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JohnnyMack
9/15/2008, 01:56 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080913/ap_on_el_pr/mccain


Greenspan: No McCain tax cuts without reduction

WASHINGTON - Alan Greenspan says the country can't afford tax cuts of the magnitude proposed by Republican presidential contender John McCain — at least not without a corresponding reduction in government spending.
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"Unless we cut spending, no," the former Federal Reserve chairman said Friday when asked about McCain's proposed tax cuts, pegged in some estimates at $3.3 trillion.

"I'm not in favor of financing tax cuts with borrowed money," Greenspan said during an interview with Bloomberg Television. "I always have tied tax cuts to spending."

McCain has said that he would offset his proposed cuts — including reducing the corporate tax rate and eliminating the Alternative Minimum Tax that has plagued middle-class families — by ending congressional pork-barrel spending, unnecessary government programs and overhauling entitlement programs such as Medicare and Social Security.

Democrats pounced on Greenspan's comments, in part because McCain professed last year that he was weaker on economics than foreign affairs and was reading Greenspan's memoir, "The Age of Turbulence," to educate himself.

"Obviously he needs to go back to that book and study it some more," Sen. Claire McCaskill, D-Mo., said during a conference call arranged by the campaign of Democratic nominee Barack Obama.

McCaskill said eliminating congressional earmark spending — estimated at $17 billion annually — cannot offset McCain's proposed tax cuts.

"That's a huge amount of money, but it's not even a drop in the bucket to pay for $3.5 trillion in tax cuts," she said. "So, every time he throws up earmarks and he's asked how he's going to pay for it, he knows he's being disingenuous, he knows he's not being forthcoming."

McCain campaign officials dispute the $3.3 trillion figure, saying it assumes eliminating 2003 tax cuts made by the Bush administration and then cutting from that higher level. They say McCain is proposing tax cuts worth $600 billion from current levels.

"John McCain opposed President Bush's tax cuts in 2003, because they didn't include the necessary spending controls. Sen. McCain's proposed job-growing tax cuts are modest in comparison to his plans to slow the exploding growth of federal expenditures — meaning that contrary to Chairman Greenspan's assertions, this relief isn't proposed on borrowed money," said McCain spokesman Tucker Bounds.

While McCain opposed the 2003 cuts and previous Bush administration tax cuts from 2001, he now says he would leave them intact. Obama has said he would repeal Bush tax cuts benefiting families making over $250,000 annually to pay for programs and provide middle-tax class relief.

Meanwhile, organizers of a conservative summit in Washington said McCain and his running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, missed an opportunity by not addressing the gathering. Some 2,100 activists from 44 states, plus another 10,000 people who signed up to watch online, participated in the three-day Values Voter Summit.

On Saturday, McCain was less than 10 miles away, working in at his campaign headquarters in Arlington, Va. Palin was leaving Alaska and traveling to a rally in Reno, Nev. Last year, McCain and seven other GOP presidential candidates spoke at the summit.

"I think there is some disappointment that he's not here. I think there's greater disappointment that Palin is not here," said Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council, a key sponsor of the summit. "I think people would have liked to have heard from her."

Activists attending the summit were unanimous in their enthusiasm for Palin, including several who said their support for McCain was lukewarm before he selected her.

Gary Ward, pastor of the Rocky Point Church in Stephenville, Texas, said he supported former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee for the GOP nomination but that his enthusiasm for McCain has been increased by his choice of Palin and his recent statement that he believes life begins at conception.

"That was absolutely the right answer," Ward said.

Elizabeth Kish, an administrative assistant from Gainesville, Fla., said she was put off by McCain's record on immigration and was considering voting for Libertarian Party candidate Bob Barr until Palin's selection.

"Once he chose Palin that was it for me," said Kish, who was wearing a "Pro-Life Pro-Palin" button and another button featuring pictures of Chief Justice John Roberts and Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito under the slogan, "The Kind of Change I Believe In."

Sounds like more typical Republican economics to me. He wants to slash taxes but hasn't figured out how to curb spending to match it. We can't keep slashing taxes and not taking in any money as a govt. and expect to stay afloat. Can we?

C&CDean
9/15/2008, 02:00 PM
You're ****ing obsessed. Seek professional help. Now.

achiro
9/15/2008, 02:04 PM
I don't understand why people don't get that part of McCains platform is a reduction of goverment spending. Something conservatives are suppose to stand for but the Bush admin apparently forgot.

BTW, have you seen the math on Obama's plans?

JohnnyMack
9/15/2008, 02:16 PM
I don't understand why people don't get that part of McCains platform is a reduction of goverment spending. Something conservatives are suppose to stand for but the Bush admin apparently forgot.


I agree. I just haven't seen the reduction of spending equal anything close to what he's proposing in tax cuts.

C&CDean
9/15/2008, 02:22 PM
I agree. I just haven't seen the reduction of spending equal anything close to what he's proposing in tax cuts.

Good. So go carry your pinko *** down and vote for Czar Brack and STFU about it. You're dead set on being stupid this election so why not just do it quietly instead of advertising to the world you're a loony tune? I'm gonna start calling you JohnnyTubaJr.

The Maestro
9/15/2008, 02:35 PM
I know it seems too simple, but just make the cuts and tell Congress they only have "X" amount to spend. That's it. It might help stop all the wasting that goes on...from both sides.

Bottom line, we are all getting screwed in taxes. Hell, every month my commission check comes I get disappointed when 40% is gone before it ever gets to me...on to Washington for those clowns to waste. I am tired of it, so whoever claims tax cuts works for me...let the boys in Washington figure out what to do when they have less to spend.

Why anyone would support a candidate who likes more government (i.e., more money FROM US!!!) over a candidate who prefers less government (should mean LESS FROM US...not saying it always does) is beyond me.

OklahomaTuba
9/15/2008, 02:41 PM
Good thing Obama will cut taxes and reduce spending!

Oh wait, nm...

tommieharris91
9/15/2008, 02:49 PM
I personally ain't a big fan of either candidate's economic thinking.

olevetonahill
9/15/2008, 02:52 PM
I have to LMFAO at the loonies that Say ITS ALL Bushes Fault .
Yup GW you sure led thw WORLDS Econimy right down the ****ter.

OklahomaTuba
9/15/2008, 02:55 PM
The libz like to call it "repealing the Bush tax cuts for the rich".

What that means really is the largest tax increase in US history.

So far, we have avoided a recession. By upping taxes, it will surely put us into one in no time.

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
9/15/2008, 02:55 PM
JohnnyMack, you have dazed and bitch-slapped me into voting for the Bammer, if I can gather my balance and senses enough to find the polling place...wait, it is voting day, isn't it?

OklahomaTuba
9/15/2008, 03:01 PM
Remember Rush, Republicans vote Nov 4, Donks vote Nov 5.

SoonerBorn68
9/15/2008, 03:05 PM
Good lord people. Flat tax or consumption tax. Everybody pays the same rate.

Problem fixed. IRS abolished.

SoonerBorn68
9/15/2008, 03:07 PM
Johnny, serious question. Did you pay any Federal Income Tax last year?

soonerscuba
9/15/2008, 03:11 PM
Good lord people. Flat tax or consumption tax. Everybody pays the same rate.

Problem fixed. IRS abolished.
And magical fairy leprechauns will fill out your forms for free!

tommieharris91
9/15/2008, 03:13 PM
And magical fairy leprechauns will fill out your forms for free!

:les:AIN'T NO FORMS!!!

Hamhock
9/15/2008, 03:14 PM
And magical fairy leprechauns will fill out your forms for free!

:les: There are no forms!!!

Hamhock
9/15/2008, 03:14 PM
:les:AIN'T NO FORMS!!!

heh

Hamhock
9/15/2008, 03:16 PM
nothing will change in D.C. until we elect a third party candidate.

soonerscuba
9/15/2008, 03:16 PM
No forms = no exemptions and no state taxes?

What a truly magical system!

SoonerBorn68
9/15/2008, 03:17 PM
And magical fairy leprechauns will fill out your forms for free!

:les:Ain't No Forms!

Gubment takes 15% of your income. The end.

soonerscuba
9/15/2008, 03:25 PM
Jesus people, the reason there are no forms because after they get rid of every exemption, SALT, capital gains, royalties and pass trough income the leprechauns do the forms for you. Just because you can't see them, doesn't mean they don't exist.

SoonerBorn68
9/15/2008, 03:28 PM
The IRS' gots to have somethin' to do...

JohnnyMack
9/15/2008, 03:39 PM
Johnny, serious question. Did you pay any Federal Income Tax last year?

Yep.

Ike
9/15/2008, 03:46 PM
nothing will change in D.C. until we elect a third party candidate.

I almost agree with you here.


But I think there is one other way to make things change in D.C.:
:les: STOP SENDING 95% OF CONGRESSPEOPLE AND SENATORS BACK TO D.C.!

The relection rate of incumbents is, IMO, abysmally high. You want change? Send em packing every 2 (or 6 years). Make sure they know when they get elected that they would do well to rent housing in D.C. rather than buy. Normally in congressional elections, I just vote for whoever isn't the incumbent specifically for that reason. If nation wide we had a few election cycles of sending incumbents packing, I think we'd be a whole lot better off. Maybe the 2 parties might realize that we'd like them to sit down, shut up, and listen for a bit before they get up on their soapboxes.


But who am I ****ting? It will probably be easier to elect a 3rd party candidate than make that happen.

jage
9/15/2008, 03:53 PM
You're ****ing obsessed. Seek professional help. Now.

Thanks for the intelligent response to defend your candidate on the matter. :rolleyes:

OklahomaTuba
9/15/2008, 03:56 PM
McCain is about as "3rd Party" as one can get.

GOP hates him, and so do the donks.

Ike
9/15/2008, 03:59 PM
McCain is about as "3rd Party" as one can get.

GOP hates him, and so do the donks.

If you were talking about McCain.2000 I might agree with you.

McCain.2008 however is nowhere near as Maverickey as he used to be.

Vaevictis
9/15/2008, 03:59 PM
McCain is about as "3rd Party" as one can get.

GOP hates him, and so do the donks.

I hear he also walks on water, turns water into wine and raises folks from the dead.

Hamhock
9/15/2008, 04:00 PM
McCain is about as "3rd Party" as one can get.

GOP hates him, and so do the donks.

no, somoene from a "3rd Party" is as about as "3rd Party" as one can get.

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
9/15/2008, 04:30 PM
no, somoene from a "3rd Party" is as about as "3rd Party" as one can get.And what, pray tell, would this 3rd party type do that is different from capitalism and socialism, and be so wonderful for the USA? (get a grip, as if that person could also be elected haha)

Tulsa_Fireman
9/15/2008, 04:34 PM
CLEGG WON'T PULL YOUR LEG

http://members.cox.net/firemanat25s/cleggposter.jpg

Hamhock
9/15/2008, 04:41 PM
And what, pray tell, would this 3rd party type do that is different from capitalism and socialism, and be so wonderful for the USA? (get a grip, as if that person could also be elected haha)

how about limit the size/scope of the federal government?

C&CDean
9/15/2008, 04:43 PM
Thanks for the intelligent response to defend your candidate on the matter. :rolleyes:

Thanks for piping up when it's none of your galdamned business. Besides, I don't have a candidate that needs defending.

olevetonahill
9/15/2008, 04:44 PM
Thanks for the intelligent response to defend your candidate on the matter. :rolleyes:

**** off dip ****
http://content.pyzam.com/graphics/insults/IBS.gif

olevetonahill
9/15/2008, 04:46 PM
I hear he also walks on water, turns water into wine and raises folks from the dead.

no thats your boy brack .

Vaevictis
9/15/2008, 04:48 PM
no thats your boy brack .

It's either candidate. It just depends on which partisan hack you're talking to at the moment.

Tulsa_Fireman
9/15/2008, 04:48 PM
no thats your boy brack .

Not anymore.

Remember? He's all about CHANGE.

Now he redistributes the water, taxes the wine, and has the dead stay dead, just vote Democrat.

Vaevictis
9/15/2008, 04:50 PM
Hate to break it to you guys that think you have me pegged, but either McCain or Obama represent enough change for me.

Only major problem I have with McCain is that he claims to be a maverick outsider, but he's playing the game and selling out with the best of them.

IOW, he's a filthy lying SOB. But he's a politician who won his party's nomination -- that's part of the job description.

(That includes Obama, too.)

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
9/15/2008, 04:54 PM
how about limit the size/scope of the federal government?republicans say smaller, but don't often act on it. Democrats say bigger, and always do it.

Tulsa_Fireman
9/15/2008, 04:56 PM
Democrats say bigger, and always do it.

Change you can COUNT on!

SoonerBorn68
9/15/2008, 05:04 PM
Yep.

Was your tax return larger than your Federal Income Tax?

Tulsa_Fireman
9/15/2008, 05:09 PM
Was your tax return larger than your Federal Income Tax?

That's an awful personal question.

By the way, my "tax return" is bigger than his. :D

SoonerBorn68
9/15/2008, 05:12 PM
It's a personal question indeed, but for somebody who crows about "change" so much, I'd just like to know if he's really got a dog in this fight. If he's gettimg more than he paid in, that's kind of hypicritical.

Tulsa_Fireman
9/15/2008, 05:14 PM
I totally buttpunched Uncle Sam the last few years.

I am what they call a "detriment to society". A "burden on the tax rolls". A "financial boat anchor".

And you know what's frickin' AWESOME?

My vote counts just as much as anybody here. Yay me!

picasso
9/15/2008, 05:15 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080913/ap_on_el_pr/mccain



Sounds like more typical Republican economics to me. He wants to slash taxes but hasn't figured out how to curb spending to match it. We can't keep slashing taxes and not taking in any money as a govt. and expect to stay afloat. Can we?

so quit spending it biitch.

SoonerBorn68
9/15/2008, 05:15 PM
...but isn't your whole salary paid by tax dollars? :D

Tulsa_Fireman
9/15/2008, 05:18 PM
...but isn't your whole salary paid by tax dollars?

Exactly!

I get you federally AND locally! UNF UNF UNF

JohnnyMack
9/15/2008, 05:22 PM
Was your tax return larger than your Federal Income Tax?

No.

I went and looked.

It wasn't even close.

Rogue
9/15/2008, 05:23 PM
It IS time for change. Even Palin is saying it now. I don't mind paying my share of taxes. What I do mind is that note everyone does and that they go down the black hole of Iraq. Look, I don't like No Child Left Behind either, but at least W was trying something different. It needs to be fixed, but we can't lament every time some new idea fails as bad as the one before it. Keep trying to fix things.

olevetonahill
9/15/2008, 05:25 PM
It's either candidate. It just depends on which partisan hack you're talking to at the moment.

I dont Listen to any of em :)
I barely skim Jm and LAS posts. Speed read Homeys :D

Rogue
9/15/2008, 05:35 PM
Let me summarize every thread from now to November:

JMack: Obama's better and here's why
Random poster: Palin is hawt and her voice rawks
Homey: Big Rock yadda yadda
Dean: yer stoopid

I really think this, THE ECONOMY, is the real battleground for this election.
Most everything else is smoke and mirrors, hot button emotional issues that the POTUS has little to do with.

olevetonahill
9/15/2008, 05:40 PM
Let me summarize every thread from now to November:

JMack: Obama's better and here's why
Random poster: Palin is hawt and her voice rawks
Homey: Big Rock yadda yadda
Dean: yer stoopid

I really think this, THE ECONOMY, is the real battleground for this election.
Most everything else is smoke and mirrors, hot button emotional issues that the POTUS has little to do with.

I agree the economy Is in the ****ter but Blamin the Pubs or the Dems for that fact Is ludicrous

Rogue
9/15/2008, 05:42 PM
I agree the economy Is in the ****ter but Blamin the Pubs or the Dems for that fact Is ludicrous

Well, I'm not ready to lay off accountability for reckless spending the past many years. Granted, the mortgage greed-crisis is worse than the S&L deal a ways back. I'd like to hear some solutions proposed. From both sides.

I really don't know what I think about the gubmint bailing out big banks. I think I'm for it though.

Sooner02
9/15/2008, 06:47 PM
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