PDA

View Full Version : Wanna see a "Moose in the headlights?"



KC//CRIMSON
9/11/2008, 11:04 PM
I'll take, What is the Bush doctrine? for a $100, Alex.

Z75QSExE0jU

landrun
9/11/2008, 11:26 PM
Heh.... First, he couldn't define what 'the Bush Doctrine' was when he asked the question.
"... the Bush doctrine, as I understand it,..."

She did an excellent job of answering the questions.

You will NEVER see Obama have to answer questions like she's having too.
She's undergone more scrutiny in two weeks than Obama has in 2 years.

Does Obama think we have the right to go into Pakistan to kill Bin Laden without their permission?
Does Obama really have the experience to be president? Seriously. He does NOT.

What national security credentials does Obama have? Literally, NONE.
National Security is a lot more than voting for a non-binding resolution on the senate floor.

You get my point. He'll never be asked anything but softball questions from the liberal press. And she literally does have more executive experience than Obama AND Biden combined.

tbl
9/11/2008, 11:27 PM
Ouch... I had no idea what the Bush doctrine was, but Charlie was obviously doing this with the intent of getting the reaction he got. I'm hoping he puts the same level of grilling on Obama and Biden, but I highly doubt he will.

That kind of political speak where they NEVER answer the question is done on both sides, all the time. For an example of Obama doing it, watch the interview with Rick Warren when the abortion issue comes up. He never answers the question, but instead gives a bunch of political speak around it.

Frankly if Charlie Gibson and every other reporter were to do this to all the politicians it would be fantastic, but I have a feeling he might be a little softer on the dems.

landrun
9/11/2008, 11:28 PM
oh... yeah... and Israel can bomb Iran without asking our permission.

Deal with it....

Rhino
9/11/2008, 11:28 PM
Moose?!?!? What a sexist thing to say!!!!!!11

And how dare the liberal media ask her questions like that! She was the governor of Alaska! She dealt with Russia all the time!

Sooner02
9/11/2008, 11:30 PM
http://vinestreetchronicle.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/crybaby-gop31.jpg

tbl
9/11/2008, 11:30 PM
He'll never be asked anything but softball questions from the liberal press.

That's what I have a problem with. However when he does get a hard question, he will do exactly what she did and wag the dog, however I highly doubt they'll call him out like Gibson did right there. "I'm sorry. You said a lot of words, but I'm not sure you answered the question."

I'll make a 1 year sig bet right now that we will never see Gibson use that same tactic on Obama. Never.

47straight
9/11/2008, 11:59 PM
What's the bush doctrine?

Sooner02
9/12/2008, 12:01 AM
She's undergone more scrutiny in two weeks than Obama has in 2 years.
Maybe because we have eight weeks to understand where she stands, not two years.



Does Obama think we have the right to go into Pakistan to kill Bin Laden without their permission?

Yes he does:

"There are terrorists holed up in those mountains who murdered 3,000 Americans. They are plotting to strike again. It was a terrible mistake to fail to act when we had a chance to take out an al-Qaida leadership meeting in 2005. If we have actionable intelligence about high-value terrorist targets and President Musharraf won't act, we will." -Barack Obama, Aug. 2007


Does Obama really have the experience to be president? Seriously. He does NOT.

Totally subjective. Seriously. Since if you're talking years of public service, he has more than Bush had--in addition to being a natural-born citizen, over 35, and has been a permanent resident in the United States for at least fourteen years.


And she literally does have more executive experience than Obama AND Biden combined.

And she is not a candidate for chief executive. McCain, however, is and has zero executive experience for someone wanting to become chief executive. Furthermore, you won't find anywhere in the Constitution that you have to be a governor or mayor before you can become president.

Sooner02
9/12/2008, 12:10 AM
Moose?!?!? What a sexist thing to say!!!!!!11

And how dare the liberal media ask her questions like that! She was the governor of Alaska! She dealt with Russia all the time!
OMG! They cannot ask THE SARAH any relevant questions to becoming a world leader! How dare the media do it's job!
:eek:

tommieharris91
9/12/2008, 12:53 AM
<youtube video>

OK, this is the first thing I've seen of tonight's interview. I wanna take her answer as a "yes", but it wasn't completely definitive. I don't see how this question was a softball or how the answer was complete dance around the issue (though the end was). She can't simply give beauty pageant answers when grilled like this though, or she will cost the pubs this election.

Sooner02
9/12/2008, 12:58 AM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/11/AR2008091103789.html?hpid=topnews


Palin Links Iraq to Sept. 11 In Talk to Troops in Alaska

FORT WAINWRIGHT, Alaska, Sept. 11 -- Gov. Sarah Palin linked the war in Iraq with the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, telling an Iraq-bound brigade of soldiers that included her son that they would "defend the innocent from the enemies who planned and carried out and rejoiced in the death of thousands of Americans."

The idea that the Iraqi government under Saddam Hussein helped al-Qaeda plan the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, a view once promoted by Bush administration officials, has since been rejected even by the president himself. But it is widely agreed that militants allied with al-Qaeda have taken root in Iraq since the U.S.-led invasion.

...

tommieharris91
9/12/2008, 01:04 AM
Well, I'm pretty sure they were celebrating...

Blue
9/12/2008, 01:05 AM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/11/AR2008091103789.html?hpid=topnews


So what?

Vaevictis
9/12/2008, 01:24 AM
Just curious.

Does anyone really give a **** about how much executive experience someone has had? It's pretty much a goddamn crap-shoot whether someone with "executive experience" is actually worth a damn.

I mean, W has more executive experience than any of the folks in this race, and for all that experience, he's not worth a pile of dog **** when it comes to the stuff that executives are supposed to be good at.

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
9/12/2008, 01:24 AM
OK, this is the first thing I've seen of tonight's interview. I wanna take her answer as a "yes", but it wasn't completely definitive. I don't see how this question was a softball or how the answer was complete dance around the issue (though the end was). She can't simply give beauty pageant answers when grilled like this though, or she will cost the pubs this election.Sounded to me like she tactfully said "yes", we have a right to defend ourselves, if we determine a strike in another country is needed to do that. I don't see how you tabbed her answer as "beauty pageant".

texas bandman
9/12/2008, 01:39 AM
Sounded to me like she tactfully said "yes", we have a right to defend ourselves, if we determine a strike in another country is needed to do that. I don't see how you tabbed her answer as "beauty pageant".

Rush is still aroused from the convention. Palin says no wrong. :D

Rogue
9/12/2008, 05:31 AM
She's smart. She'll have the talking points down soon.

But I don't know about her thinking on her feet in a debate.
Not that I want to elect the best (master) debater, but it could be fun to watch.

I wonder if they're actually trying to help her sound more moderate because she is pretty far to the right of McCain. The base is energized and now it's time to appeal to middle America.

This year, I think, was the year the Dems should have had a Southerner on the ballot. Would have made things more interesting.

Okla-homey
9/12/2008, 06:31 AM
JSM will probably offer BHO a cabinet post.

Three more weeks and we'll know for sure the GOP is going to prevail.

KC//CRIMSON
9/12/2008, 07:24 AM
She did an excellent job of answering the questions.

If by excellent job you mean "answered in slogans" then yeah, she was stellar.

She better brush up on foreign policy or Biden will rip her a new one.

Rip her a new one? What a sexist thing to say!!

Okla-homey
9/12/2008, 07:46 AM
If by excellent job you mean "answered in slogans" then yeah, she was stellar.

She better brush up on foreign policy or Biden will rip her a new one.

Rip her a new one? What a sexist thing to say!!

meh. WTF does Joe Biden know about foreign policy? He never served in the military, he's been a hack in the Senate since he was thirty, and made two abortive runs for the presidency.

I also predict he won't be mean to her. That would blow back into his hairplugs. The plagiarizing bastage.

85Sooner
9/12/2008, 08:20 AM
Just curious.

Does anyone really give a **** about how much executive experience someone has had? It's pretty much a goddamn crap-shoot whether someone with "executive experience" is actually worth a damn.

I mean, W has more executive experience than any of the folks in this race, and for all that experience, he's not worth a pile of dog **** when it comes to the stuff that executives are supposed to be good at.

Due to the fact that he tried to reach accross the isle. A snake is a snake is a snake. Kennedy, Reid, Pelosi = snake.

swardboy
9/12/2008, 08:22 AM
She did fine. Gibson's the one getting the negative ratings for editing her quotes on the "being on God's side" comments. And the ABC editing was atrocious in terms of presenting the candidate in a negative light.

No more edited interviews please. The American people deserve better....

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 08:25 AM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/11/AR2008091103789.html?hpid=topnews

Maybe Palin was referring to AQ in Iraq, just maybe????

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 08:26 AM
I want Gibson to ask Obama to name all 58 states.

Now THAT would be an interesting reaction.

swardboy
9/12/2008, 08:29 AM
"Blizzard of words"....hahahaha, stop it Charlie, you really are a dumbass. Obama never spoke as clearly as she just did to you.

Gandalf_The_Grey
9/12/2008, 08:34 AM
This is really like the Nadal/Federer match at Wimbledon.

The Pubs put up a video of Ossama..i mean Obama saying something stupid
The *****crats come on here and say "Oh that was misinterpreted"
The Pubs say "Oh I guess Obama can do no wrong can he?"
The *****crats come back and say "Quit avoiding their point"

Now replace Palin with Obama...and you got the return services.

I mean it is almost better than Federer/Nadal because this wont end for another 8 weeks or so!!!!!

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 08:40 AM
http://forthardknox.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/pelosi-nancy.jpg
GULP!

Seems the Redeemer of ManKind is taking congress down with him...


PRINCETON, NJ -- A potential shift in fortunes for the Republicans in Congress is seen in the latest USA Today/Gallup survey, with the Democrats now leading the Republicans by just 3 percentage points, 48% to 45%, in voters' "generic ballot" preferences for Congress. This is down from consistent double-digit Democratic leads seen on this measure over the past year.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/110263/Battle-Congress-Suddenly-Looks-Competitive.aspx

Vaevictis
9/12/2008, 09:29 AM
Due to the fact that he tried to reach accross the isle. A snake is a snake is a snake. Kennedy, Reid, Pelosi = snake.

I'm sorry, am I understanding you correctly? Did you actually say that Bush tried to reach across the aisle?

JohnnyMack
9/12/2008, 09:31 AM
Maybe Palin was referring to AQ in Iraq, just maybe????

Here's what she said:

"defend the innocent from the enemies who planned and carried out and rejoiced in the death of thousands of Americans."

Think about what you posted. Do you wish to continue this discussion? Think about it for a minute or two before you post your answer.

Pieces Hit
9/12/2008, 09:34 AM
If you asked Bush what the Bush Doctrine was he'd prolly say,

"Ever time I'm sick I need doctrine."

Okla-homey
9/12/2008, 09:36 AM
I was taught the "Bush Doctrine" meant pre-emptive strikes were okay if we had credible evidence someone was preparing to mount an attack on the US.

Whether or not that was articulated last night I don't know because I didn't watch the interview (yes, I do have a life although it may seem to some that life involves total captivation in political stuff), anyhoo, I'm quite sure SHP is down with that policy. I am too.

Pieces Hit
9/12/2008, 09:50 AM
When Baracko Bama says P words his cheeks pop like a frog.
This annoys me.

However, his teeth are really sparkling white and very impressive.
This, (in addition to being a fancy pants lawyer), should help him in the debates with John.

The greatest thing I've heard this week was Biden saying "in all honesty" Hillary was more qualified to be the VP and qualified to be President.
Ha!

LesNessman
9/12/2008, 10:03 AM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/11/AR2008091103789.html?hpid=topnews

Very disingenuous, even outright stupid or malicious as Kristol says.

Kristol: The Washington Post Distorts Palin on Page One

Here are the headline and the first two paragraphs from an article posted online that apparently will be on the front page of Friday’s Washington Post:

“Palin Links Iraq to 9/11, A View Discarded by Bush"
By Anne E. Kornblut
 Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, September 12, 2008; A01

FORT WAINWRIGHT, Alaska, Sept. 11 -- Gov. Sarah Palin linked the war in Iraq with the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, telling an Iraq-bound brigade of soldiers that included her son that they would "defend the innocent from the enemies who planned and carried out and rejoiced in the death of thousands of Americans."

The idea that Iraq shared responsibility with al-Qaeda for the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, once promoted by Bush administration officials, has since been rejected even by the president himself. On any other day, Palin's statement would almost certainly have drawn a sharp rebuke from Democrats, but both parties had declared a halt to partisan activities to mark Thursday's anniversary.”


Kornblut’s interpretation of what Palin said is either stupid or malicious. Palin is evidently saying that American soldiers are going to Iraq to defend innocent Iraqis from al Qaeda in Iraq, a group that is related to al Qaeda, which did plan and carry out the Sept. 11 attacks. It makes no sense for Kornblut to claim that Palin is arguing here that Saddam Hussein’s regime carried out 9/11—obviously Palin isn’t saying that our soldiers are now going over to Iraq to fight Saddam’s regime. Palin isn’t linking Saddam to 9/11. She’s linking al Qaeda in Iraq to al Qaeda.

People can debate how intimate that connection is, and how much of the fight in Iraq is now against al Qaeda in Iraq--but it’s simply the case that Palin is not saying what Kornblut says she is, and that the Washington Post is, right now, leading its paper with a clear distortion of what Palin said.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSFP/2008/09/kristol_the_washington_post_di.asp

Imagine that. The WaPo issuing a liberally biased slant on a story, and misrepersenting (i.e.lying about) a conservative.

Love the objective take by the A.P too:

Palin tries to defend qualifications in interview

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5g-mjfuE-Dz5hpM2uDBVt3Kw6le4AD935372OB

Tries to defend? Please.

" Palin, 44, has been Alaska's governor for less than two years and before that was a small-town mayor. She was McCain's surprise selection for the No. 2 slot on the ticket, raising questions about her readiness to serve in the White House, particularly during wartime."

What about raising questions about Barry Hussein in the White at anytime.? I suppose when he's not taxing the ever-living daylights out everyone, or chatting with maniacal dictators, maybe he'll find time to organize some communities.

Lordy b-gordy. What a terrifying thought.

CK Sooner
9/12/2008, 10:06 AM
Very disingenuous, even outright stupid or malicious as Kristol says.

Kristol: The Washington Post Distorts Palin on Page One

Here are the headline and the first two paragraphs from an article posted online that apparently will be on the front page of Friday’s Washington Post:

“Palin Links Iraq to 9/11, A View Discarded by Bush"
By Anne E. Kornblut
 Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, September 12, 2008; A01

FORT WAINWRIGHT, Alaska, Sept. 11 -- Gov. Sarah Palin linked the war in Iraq with the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, telling an Iraq-bound brigade of soldiers that included her son that they would "defend the innocent from the enemies who planned and carried out and rejoiced in the death of thousands of Americans."

The idea that Iraq shared responsibility with al-Qaeda for the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, once promoted by Bush administration officials, has since been rejected even by the president himself. On any other day, Palin's statement would almost certainly have drawn a sharp rebuke from Democrats, but both parties had declared a halt to partisan activities to mark Thursday's anniversary.”


Kornblut’s interpretation of what Palin said is either stupid or malicious. Palin is evidently saying that American soldiers are going to Iraq to defend innocent Iraqis from al Qaeda in Iraq, a group that is related to al Qaeda, which did plan and carry out the Sept. 11 attacks. It makes no sense for Kornblut to claim that Palin is arguing here that Saddam Hussein’s regime carried out 9/11—obviously Palin isn’t saying that our soldiers are now going over to Iraq to fight Saddam’s regime. Palin isn’t linking Saddam to 9/11. She’s linking al Qaeda in Iraq to al Qaeda.

People can debate how intimate that connection is, and how much of the fight in Iraq is now against al Qaeda in Iraq--but it’s simply the case that Palin is not saying what Kornblut says she is, and that the Washington Post is, right now, leading its paper with a clear distortion of what Palin said.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSFP/2008/09/kristol_the_washington_post_di.asp

Imagine that. The WaPo issuing a liberally biased slant on a story, and misrepersenting (i.e.lying about) a conservative.

Love the objective take by the A.P too:

Palin tries to defend qualifications in interview

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5g-mjfuE-Dz5hpM2uDBVt3Kw6le4AD935372OB

Tries to defend? Please.

" Palin, 44, has been Alaska's governor for less than two years and before that was a small-town mayor. She was McCain's surprise selection for the No. 2 slot on the ticket, raising questions about her readiness to serve in the White House, particularly during wartime."

What about raising questions about Barry Hussein in the White at anytime.? I suppose when he's not taxing the ever-living daylights out everyone, or chatting with maniacal dictators, maybe he'll find time to organize some communities.

Lordy b-gordy. What a terrifying thought.

Thanks :)

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 10:19 AM
Here's what she said:


Think about what you posted. Do you wish to continue this discussion? Think about it for a minute or two before you post your answer.

Sounds like she is spot on.

AQ in Iraq is who we are fighting, along with Iran backed militants. Not Saddam.

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
9/12/2008, 10:45 AM
She better brush up on foreign policy or Biden will rip her a new one.

Rip her a new one? [/I]This debate will have incredibly high ratings, mostly for people who want to see the inevitable Biden meltdown. That is, if he's still Barry's VP choice at the time of the scheduled debate.

85Sooner
9/12/2008, 10:45 AM
I was taught the "Bush Doctrine" meant pre-emptive strikes were okay if we had credible evidence someone was preparing to mount an attack on the US.

DING DING DING DING WE HAVE A WINNER

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 10:54 AM
Bush Doctrine could also mean advancing democracy to dictatorships and fighting terrorism.

Since that has actually happened more than the any pre-emptive strikes.

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 10:55 AM
Like the "credible" evidence that SH had wmd, drones, and the like that could attack us. The Bush Doctine is about as pointless as globalization, a dismal failure.

And yes, I am sure everyone we fight in Iraq and Afghanistan is either AQ or Iranian trained bad guys. Must be nice to have a simple packaged retort for such a complex world.

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 10:56 AM
Advanced democracy...that is rich.

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 11:03 AM
Advanced democracy...that is rich.
So Iraq and Afganistan don't have elected governments now??

Someone forgot to tell them that.

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 11:04 AM
And yes, AQ in Iraq and the Iranian backed militia are the biggest problems now in Iraq. The surge showed that by clearing those folks out, the country could be stable, and even less violent than Chicago.

Not sure how many times the military and even Iraqis have to say this for the libz to believe it.

LesNessman
9/12/2008, 11:20 AM
Even Kirsten Powers (democratic commentator) thinks the performance by ABC / Charlie Gibson was bad:

ABC'S BUNGLES
BOTCHES MAR PALIN INTERVIEW

http://www.nypost.com/seven/09122008/postopinion/opedcolumnists/abcs_bungles_128726.htm

Some excerpts:

"Her responses to Gibson's cross-examining seemed canned and rehearsed, a little like the answers you might give in a tough college interview. But that may be a result of the ham-fisted editing - which seemed to cut her off mid-thought on many answers. ABC should release the entire, unedited interview, so that Americans can judge her more fairly."


"Plus, her answers last night are already being misrepresented. She said - quite correctly - that, if Georgia and Ukraine are admitted to NATO, the United States may be obliged to defend them. This has been morphed into an assertion that we might invade Russia. And ABC News bears much of the blame: It actually sent out a pre-broadcast alert to that effect.

So now we can play this stupid game, pretending she wants to invade Russia instead of debating real issues.

ABC's errors didn't end there. The interview seemed to show a lack of good faith, with the blatant misrepresentation of comments she's made about the Iraq war.

Gibson - probably relying on a sloppy Associated Press report - told Palin she has said that, "Our national leaders, are sending [U.S. soldiers] out on a task that is from God."
In a part of the interview that was edited out (but is available on ABC's Web site), Palin says, "You know, I don't know if that was my exact quote."

Gibson snaps: "Exact words."

Sorry, Charlie - let's go to the tape.

In the video of her remarks, Palin says "Pray for our military men and women who are striving to do what is right. Also, for this country, that our leaders, our national leaders, are sending [US soldiers] out on a task that is from God." She is clearly praying for wisdom for our national leaders - praying that they are following God's will.

This is Christianity 101, not some fundamentalist plot to wage a holy war. Presumably, Obama, as a Christian, utters similar prayers for our country as well.

There's more: Gibson also accused her of saying of Iraq, "There is a plan and that that plan is God's plan."

Here's what she really said: "That's what we have to make sure that we're praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God's plan."

Despite Gibson's insistance that she'd said things that she clearly hadn't, Palin was polite and seemed unrattled."


"There are real questions that Americans need to hear Palin answer. But they're ill-served by the game the media has played so far. Rather than real insights into this woman, we get exchanges that will lead to arguments about whether she's a religious fanatic - arguments based on a comment she never made. "

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 11:25 AM
So Iraq and Afganistan don't have elected governments now??

Someone forgot to tell them that.

Did the Sunni population participate fully in the election? Are these governments sovereign and free to make choices on their own? If a true election was in place would you feel ok if they told the US to leave? How about the election of Hamas in Gaza, or is that somehow void of the democracy panacea.


And yes, AQ in Iraq and the Iranian backed militia are the biggest problems now in Iraq. The surge showed that by clearing those folks out, the country could be stable, and even less violent than Chicago.

Not sure how many times the military and even Iraqis have to say this for the libz to believe it.

So the fact that Maliki and Ahmajinedad are big pals how does that factor in to your conclussion that they are a problem. What about the brokered deal to end violence in the South, was this a problem. I'm sure that if the Chicago area police began paying off criminals it too might see a decline in violence...what happens when the cash stops flowing?

Sooner02
9/12/2008, 11:38 AM
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/8d91brDnt7A&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/8d91brDnt7A&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
Really.

KC//CRIMSON
9/12/2008, 01:01 PM
meh. WTF does Joe Biden know about foreign policy? He never served in the military, he's been a hack in the Senate since he was thirty, and made two abortive runs for the presidency.

I also predict he won't be mean to her. That would blow back into his hairplugs. The plagiarizing bastage.


Homey, this is a woman who is backing up a seventy two year old man that has had several bouts with cancer, not to mention other health related problems. Do you really feel confident this woman who didn't know WTF the Bush Doctrine was (you know, the base foreign policy for the last eight years) is capable of running the show on her own?


Not to mention her reckless comments on Georgia/Russia/Israel to boot.

Okla-homey
9/12/2008, 01:18 PM
Homey, this is a woman who is backing up a seventy two year old man that has had several bouts with cancer, not to mention other health related problems. Do you really feel confident this woman who didn't know WTF the Bush Doctrine was (you know, the base foreign policy for the last eight years) is capable of running the show on her own?


Not to mention her reckless comments on Georgia/Russia/Israel to boot.

yep. because she obviously has good sense and doesn't propose shooting goodies out her butt like a busted pinata in order to get elected.

Here's the thing. And I mean this with great sincerety. Her selection was genius because criticism of her is perceived by an awful lot of folks in this country as a personal affront because they personally identify with her.

In contrast, who can say they have anything in common with BHO or his running mate? Other than the most obvious physical characteristics of course. That and the fact that everyone who ever served in the military personally identifies with the top of our ticket.

That sort of thing has a near magical effect on an electorate. It's also why they'll ultimately win.

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 01:18 PM
Did the Sunni population participate fully in the election??

So everyone in a country now has to participate "fully" in elections in order to be called a true democracy????

That is almost funny!

Vaevictis
9/12/2008, 01:21 PM
yep. because she obviously has good sense and doesn't propose shooting goodies out her butt like a busted pinata in order to get elected.

She does when she thinks it will help to get her elected. cf Bridge to Nowhere.

JohnnyMack
9/12/2008, 01:22 PM
Here's the thing. And I mean this with great sincerety. Her selection was genius because criticism of her is perceived by an awful lot of folks in this country as a personal affront because they personally identify with her.

How long can it last? Just how stupid are U.S. Americans? I guess we'll find out. It's clear the Rs have no intention of making this election about policy. They've rolled out Palin, now they're circling the wagons and hoping that enough people won't vote for the black muslim fella.

Okla-homey
9/12/2008, 01:24 PM
How long can it last? Just how stupid are U.S. Americans? I guess we'll find out. It's clear the Rs have no intention of making this election about policy. They've rolled out Palin, now they're circling the wagons and hoping that enough people won't vote for the black muslim fella.

JM,
You must disabuse yourself of this naive notion that presidential elections are about "policy." sheesh. How long have you been paying attention to American politics?
People vote for the candidates they like, just like HS student council elections.

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 01:25 PM
So the fact that Maliki and Ahmajinedad are big pals how does that factor in to your conclussion that they are a problem. What about the brokered deal to end violence in the South, was this a problem. I'm sure that if the Chicago area police began paying off criminals it too might see a decline in violence...what happens when the cash stops flowing?

If Maliki is such a a friend to Ahmajinedad, why would Maliki all but kill Sadr, Ahmajinedad's & the crazy cleric's but boy?

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 01:25 PM
So everyone in a country now has to participate "fully" in elections in order to be called a true democracy????

That is almost funny!

Yes, by defintion I would think true democracy requires the input of the entire population.

If it is political parties that are only recognized by the occupying power is that democracy? if "democracy" is demanded by an outside force and is not a ground up operation is it democracy?

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 01:27 PM
She does when she thinks it will help to get her elected. cf Bridge to Nowhere.

Now, if we could only find that bridge to nowhere.

She hid it somewhere, dammit.

Okla-homey
9/12/2008, 01:28 PM
Yes, by defintion I would think true democracy requires the input of the entire population.

if "democracy" is demanded by an outside force and is not a ground up operation is it democracy?

Sure! That's what we did in Japan. Heck, their constitution was drafted in Washington for goshsakes.

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 01:29 PM
http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:UUmqHdXEW_V0ZM:http://www.needlenose.

i think it has something to do with the militia situation that punches holes in your simple Iran AQ bad theory.

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 01:31 PM
Yes, by defintion I would think true democracy requires the input of the entire population.

I can see why you don't like the current government in Iraq then.

I mean, Saddam got like everyone's vote before we deposed him. Won by 99% even!!

Then Bush had to go ruin that bastion of "True Democracy", and set up an evil tyrannical republic form of government.

Bastages.

JohnnyMack
9/12/2008, 01:32 PM
JM,
You must disabuse yourself of this naive notion that presidential elections are about "policy." sheesh. How long have you been paying attention to American politics?
People vote for the candidates they like, just like HS student council elections.

I'll just keep on hoping that someday people will be forced to take SicEms proficiency test in order to get a ballot.

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 01:33 PM
Sure! That's what we did in Japan. Heck, their constitution was drafted in Washington for goshsakes.

Shhhhhh.

Don't use real life examples. It just makes them mad. :D

KC//CRIMSON
9/12/2008, 01:33 PM
JM,
You must disabuse yourself of this naive notion that presidential elections are about "policy." sheesh. How long have you been paying attention to American politics?
People vote for the candidates they like, just like HS student council elections.


Going by this statement alone, Obama would crush McCain/Palin. Just like William Jefferson Clinton did to that old fart Bush Sr.

Bill was a smooth mother****** and people ate it up. Obama has the same trait. Tenfold.

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 01:34 PM
Sure! That's what we did in Japan. Heck, their constitution was drafted in Washington for goshsakes.

Ah, the good old neocon fueled WWII analogy...never fails.

JohnnyMack
9/12/2008, 01:35 PM
Obama has the same trait. Tenfold.

Pssstt....although it has NOTHING to do with this election.....he's black.

Just wanted you to know.

Okla-homey
9/12/2008, 01:35 PM
I'll just keep on hoping that someday people will be forced to take SicEms proficiency test in order to get a ballot.

I have long held, people generally get the kind of government they deserve.

Frankly, I think the "winner take all" approach adopted when we went away from the Framer's notion that the high vote getter is President and the numba two vote getter is VP was probably a bad move.

Okla-homey
9/12/2008, 01:36 PM
Ah, the good old neocon fueled WWII analogy...never fails.

I am not a neocon. I've been a conservative since I started paying taxes in 1982.

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 01:38 PM
Exactly which Iraqi government official came aboard the USS Missouri to sign the surrender documents again.

Vaevictis
9/12/2008, 01:41 PM
Now, if we could only find that bridge to nowhere.

She hid it somewhere, dammit.

She ditched it when it became a political liability. But before that...


"We need to come to the defense of Southeast Alaska when proposals are on the table like the bridge, and not allow the spinmeisters to turn this project or any other into something that's so negative," Palin said in August 2006, according to the Ketchikan Daily News.

The Anchorage Daily News quoted her in October 2006 as saying she would continue state funding for the bridge. "The window is now, while our congressional delegation is in a strong position to assist," she said.

JohnnyMack
9/12/2008, 03:39 PM
NGXlsqPL2A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NGXlsqPL2A

JohnnyMack
9/12/2008, 03:41 PM
I suck at the internets.

Tulsa_Fireman
9/12/2008, 03:48 PM
Yes.

Yes you do.

BigRedJed
9/12/2008, 03:49 PM
Says the guy who just posted a red x in another thread.

Tulsa_Fireman
9/12/2008, 03:51 PM
It's a brotherhood.

Don't knock the brotherhood.

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 03:58 PM
She ditched it when it became a political liability. But before that...

Kinda like The One did to his racist anti-American pastor of 20+ years???

OklahomaTuba
9/12/2008, 03:59 PM
Exactly which Iraqi government official came aboard the USS Missouri to sign the surrender documents again.

They were busy voting.

Democracy is HARD.

Tulsa_Fireman
9/12/2008, 04:20 PM
WALK HARD

Condescending Sooner
9/12/2008, 04:38 PM
Prophet, do you believe the surge is working in Iraq?

JohnnyMack
9/12/2008, 04:39 PM
Prophet, do you believe the surge is working in Iraq?

I'll answer your question with a question.

What would happen if we took all the police off the streets in your hometown?

Condescending Sooner
9/12/2008, 04:39 PM
Pssstt....although it has NOTHING to do with this election.....he's black.

Just wanted you to know.

Are you trying to insinuate racism again? That is tired.

Condescending Sooner
9/12/2008, 04:41 PM
I'll answer your question with a question.

What would happen if we took all the police off the streets in your hometown?


Did I ask you? Did you answer the question? I think you WANT the war to go bad, typical lib.

JohnnyMack
9/12/2008, 04:50 PM
I don't want the war to go bad, but I'm not so arrogant as to think we can stop these people from hating each other and being forced to adopt our system of govt either.

85Sooner
9/12/2008, 04:52 PM
I'm sorry, am I understanding you correctly? Did you actually say that Bush tried to reach across the aisle?

Yup, thanks for the correction. I mis-typed.

Tulsa_Fireman
9/12/2008, 04:57 PM
It's a drastic change, but not an unfamiliar one.

Yes, the Iraqis are familiar with the voting process. It was ridiculously broken and corrupt, but they know what it means to vote. Now they know what it means to vote and have it count. What it means to have a voice that won't put you in a shallow grave. And now as changes begin to take hold and more and more provinces are being released to sole Iraqi policing, the country begins to truly take shape into what it can eventually become.

If they choose to keep it that way after we're gone is completely up to them. Their vote, their voice, will make that decision. My money is on an explosion of theocratic representatives in ten years which will precursor an eventual lapse into some form of state theism similar to Iran. AKA, success = backing the religious leaders, and failure to do so is equivalent to political suicide.

But regardless, we will have given them the tools to rise up and have a voice. Whether they use it in a responsible manner is up to them.

85Sooner
9/12/2008, 05:15 PM
Homey, this is a woman who is backing up a seventy two year old man that has had several bouts with cancer, not to mention other health related problems. Do you really feel confident this woman who didn't know WTF the Bush Doctrine was (you know, the base foreign policy for the last eight years) is capable of running the show on her own?


Not to mention her reckless comments on Georgia/Russia/Israel to boot.

Reckless comment???????? What was reckless? If Georgia becomes a member of NATO then all the members of Nato are obligated to come to their defense. As far as Israel, she stuck to her guns that we are not the ones to determine what Israel can or cannot do to protect itself. THose are pretty factual IMO.

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 06:44 PM
They were busy voting.

Democracy is HARD.

I don't even see the connection you are trying to make here. The differences from the surrender of Japan and the implementation of those terms is very different than that of what occured in Iraq. No government signed any papers, no terms were agreed to, and there is no emperor to get the people to see things his way. Hope this helps.

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 06:50 PM
Prophet, do you believe the surge is working in Iraq?

If you call the construction of walls dividing neighborhoods that have lived together for hundreds of years working, then sure it is working. If you call the fact that we are paying off Sunni shieks and their militias so they won't engage in guerilla warfare, then yes it is working. If you call the dislocation of 4 million or so people due to the prior six years of what some people seem to think is foreign policy, then yes, it is working in Iraq.

In the immortal words of Tacitus, "they make a desert, and call it peace."

Vaevictis
9/12/2008, 07:31 PM
Kinda like The One did to his racist anti-American pastor of 20+ years???

This does not detract, in any way, from the fact that Palin is more than happy to bribe constituents with graft when it can get her elected to office.

Vaevictis
9/12/2008, 07:33 PM
Yup, thanks for the correction. I mis-typed.

Ah, okay.

By the way, are you in the market to buy a bridge? Cause I have one for sale.

47straight
9/12/2008, 09:36 PM
A-ha. From the guy who coined the phrase, "bush doctrine," it appears that there are four different "bush doctrine" definitions.

From the guy who invented the phrase (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/12/AR2008091202457.html?hpid=opinionsbox1)

I haven't seen the interview, so I can't say whether the ABC guy really did sound huffy or not. But it does confirm what I thought - it's a vague question. I'm a relatively smart guy, read the papers and the blogs, read the South Oval from time to time, certainly know what the Truman and Monroe doctrines were... but I had never heard the phrase "Bush Doctrine" before. And I certainly know the concepts of pre-emptive war, unilateral treaty recission, if-you-are-hiding-the-terrorists, we-will-consider-you-the-same.

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 09:41 PM
I think the term "unipolar movement" fits the bill.

Jerk
9/12/2008, 09:54 PM
Ah, okay.

By the way, are you in the market to buy a bridge? Cause I have one for sale.



What is it? That socialism can work?

StoopTroup
9/12/2008, 09:56 PM
All you metro-sexuals and your little special interests aren't gonna change anybody's mind with all this BS. :D

SoonerProphet
9/12/2008, 10:01 PM
establishment snobbery and intellectual condescension that has characterized the chattering classes'

Yeah Chuck, as if you are any different than other establishment snobs or pinheads.