A sign of progress in public education

[Okla-homey]

Its about frickin time.


North Texas school district will let teachers carry guns

Associated Press

HARROLD, Texas — A tiny Texas school district may be the first in the nation to allow teachers and staff to pack guns for protection when classes begin later this month, a newspaper reported.

Trustees at the Harrold Independent School District approved a district policy change last October so employees can carry concealed firearms to deter and protect against school shootings, provided the gun-toting teachers follow certain requirements.

In order for teachers and staff to carry a pistol, they must have a Texas license to carry a concealed handgun; must be authorized to carry by the district; must receive training in crisis management and hostile situations and have to use ammunition that is designed to minimize the risk of ricochet in school halls.

Superintendent David Thweatt said the small community is a 30-minute drive from the sheriff's office, leaving students and teachers without protection. He said the district's lone campus sits 500 feet from heavily trafficked U.S. 287, which could make it a target.

"When the federal government started making schools gun-free zones, that's when all of these shootings started. Why would you put it out there that a group of people can't defend themselves? That's like saying 'sic 'em' to a dog," Thweatt said in Friday's online edition of the Fort Worth Star-Telegram.

Thweatt said officials researched the policy and considered other options for about a year before approving the policy change. He said the district also has various other security measures in place to prevent a school shooting.

"The naysayers think (a shooting) won't happen here. If something were to happen here, I'd much rather be calling a parent to tell them that their child is OK because we were able to protect them," Thweatt said.

Texas law outlaws firearms on school campuses "unless pursuant to the written regulations or written authorization of the institution."

It was unclear how many of the 50 or so teachers and staff members will be armed this fall because Thweatt did not disclose that information, to keep it from students or potential attackers. Wilbarger County Sheriff Larry Lee was out of the office Thursday and did not immediately return a phone call seeking comment, the newspaper said.

Barbara Williams, a spokeswoman for the Texas Association of School Boards, said her organization did not know of another district with such a policy. Ken Trump, a Cleveland-based school security expert who advises districts nationwide, including in Texas, said Harrold is the first district with such a policy.

The 110-student district is 150 miles northwest of Fort Worth on the eastern end of Wilbarger County, near the Oklahoma border.

On the Web:

Harrold Independent School District, http://harroldisd.net/

[olevetonahill]

How else they gonna Coral those wild longwhorns ?
:pop:

[StoopTroup]

I OUr use of the Bob Stoops Cattle prod.

It seems to work well.

[Dio]

They need to let the teachers start carrying paddles.

[Okla-homey]

They need to let the teachers start carrying paddles.


naaa. You just wait til a teacher pops a cap in a mufugga. After that happens, all them utes will calm the fug down.

[Curly Bill]

I think maybe I've found where I will be working next year! ;)

[SicEmBaylor]

I think this is a great idea. After we had our school shooting back when I was in HS, I actually suggested to some of my teachers that they start carrying. They were all horrified at the suggestion, but I personally believe that if teachers carried sidearms (it would be their option of course and not mandatory) then one of them would be in a better position to put a stop to a deranged gunman.

At the very least, I wish there were at least a couple of firearms securely locked away in the principle's office.

:shrug: I've been suggesting this for years because it seems like common sense to me.

[Curly Bill]

I think this is a great idea. After we had our school shooting back when I was in HS, I actually suggested to some of my teachers that they start carrying. They were all horrified at the suggestion, but I personally believe that if teachers carried sidearms (it would be their option of course and not mandatory) then one of them would be in a better position to put a stop to a deranged gunman.

At the very least, I wish there were at least a couple of firearms securely locked away in the principle's office.

:shrug: I've been suggesting this for years because it seems like common sense to me.

It takes away the sitting duck situation you find in schools currently. I've been saying for years it should be allowed as well, but schools are largely effeminate institutions and frown on such a thing.

[SicEmBaylor]

It takes away the sitting duck situation you find in schools currently. I've been saying for years it should be allowed as well, but schools are largely effeminate institutions and frown on such a thing.

I frown on being shot.

[GottaHavePride]

I frown on not shooting ****ers trying to shoot me.

[Curly Bill]

I frown on being shot.

Me too, and that's why ever chance I get I point out the lunacy of the idjits that fear teachers having guns in school, but apparently think it's OK to leave a school full of people at the mercy of any deranged person wanting to make the news.

Lets face it, if you were someone wanting to kill a large number of people where would you go knowing there would be a large number of people available, they would likely be housed in rooms so as to keep them from scattering too fast, and you would be unlikely to encounter any armed resistance for a good period of time?

[SicEmBaylor]

Me too, and that's why ever chance I get I point out the lunacy of the idjits that fear teachers having guns in school, but apparently think it's OK to leave a school full of people at the mercy of any deranged person wanting to make the news.

Lets face it, if you were someone wanting to kill a large number of people where would you go knowing there would be a large number of people available, they would likely be housed in rooms so as to keep them from scattering too fast, and you would be unlikely to encounter any armed resistance for a good period of time?

No. You're totally right.

A friend of mine started this organization called "Students for Concealed Carry on Campus" after the VTech shooting. Its been on the news and they usually have someone from the organization on one of the news shows when another shooting happens. They want college students who can legally carry a concealed weapon to be allowed to do so on their college campus, so they have been lobbying state legislatures and universities to allow it.

[soonerscuba]

As someone who has never met a disgruntled teacher, I think there couldn't possibly be any sort of ramification to this at any point, ever.

PS, I am in favor of 2nd amendment rights within the home and for hunting, within the general public is where I think the clamps come down for me personally. I just don't think it's good policy to institutionalize guns for 21 year-old frat boys on campus.

[Okla-homey]

There was amove afoot in the Okie legislature to allow on-campus heat packing by CCP holders, modified with the provision the only CCP'ers who could carry on campus had to be honorably discharged veterans or CLEET certified ex- or current cops.

I think the whole thing went down in flames when someone pointed out that Lee Oswald, the UT tower shooter and that scum whose name I have vowed never again to write who bombed OKC were all honorably discharged veterans.:eek: Granted, that was a total non-sequitor, but there you have it.

[Curly Bill]

As someone who has never met a disgruntled teacher, I think there couldn't possibly be any sort of ramification to this at any point, ever.

PS, I am in favor of 2nd amendment rights within the home and for hunting, within the general public is where I think the clamps come down for me personally. I just don't think it's good policy to institutionalize guns for 21 year-old frat boys on campus.

Yup, it's better to keep law-abiding folks from carrying to school...makes it easier for the psychopaths that way.

[SicEmBaylor]

As someone who has never met a disgruntled teacher, I think there couldn't possibly be any sort of ramification to this at any point, ever.

PS, I am in favor of 2nd amendment rights within the home and for hunting, within the general public is where I think the clamps come down for me personally. I just don't think it's good policy to institutionalize guns for 21 year-old frat boys on campus.

First of all, when you say "frat boys" you make it sound as if they're a bunch of drunks who run down to the gun shop and start packing heat. Personally, I think if you have a CHL then you've already proven you know how to handle a firearm. I doubt too many frat guys are going to have too much interest in packing heat anyway.

Secondly, with all due respect, it's not really up to you to decide when the 2nd Amendment is appropriate. I don't even really mean you personally but anyone. The 2nd amendment is NOT just for home protection and NOT just for hunting. The 2nd Amendment is a solemn cross-generational pact between the Constitutional Framers and the American people. The 2nd Amendment is there to protect against an unlawful or tyrannical government and should NEVER EVER be limited to specific or "government approved" uses.

What you do with your firearm should be your business unless and until you use it to commit a violent crime. Frankly, I don't think the government should even be in the business of giving licenses. The 2nd Amendment should be the only license Americans need to carry ANY kind of firearm they want.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

I recall in Scalia's recent D.C. opinion, he clearly stated there may be exceptions, e.g., convicted felons, mentally ill, neanderthal football coaches and shop teachers.

[soonerscuba]

First of all, when you say "frat boys" you make it sound as if they're a bunch of drunks who run down to the gun shop and start packing heat. Personally, I think if you have a CHL then you've already proven you know how to handle a firearm. I doubt too many frat guys are going to have too much interest in packing heat anyway.

Secondly, with all due respect, it's not really up to you to decide when the 2nd Amendment is appropriate. I don't even really mean you personally but anyone. The 2nd amendment is NOT just for home protection and NOT just for hunting. The 2nd Amendment is a solemn cross-generational pact between the Constitutional Framers and the American people. The 2nd Amendment is there to protect against an unlawful or tyrannical government and should NEVER EVER be limited to specific or "government approved" uses.

What you do with your firearm should be your business unless and until you use it to commit a violent crime. Frankly, I don't think the government should even be in the business of giving licenses. The 2nd Amendment should be the only license Americans need to carry ANY kind of firearm they want.
Sorry, the 2nd amendment, like all of it's billy friends has limits, and whether you like it or not, are justified. Are you in favor of the public being able to carry a gun into a commercial flight? That's not tyranny, it's common sense.

We don't let 21 year-olds drink in frat houses or on campus at OU, but you seriously expect them to allow guns? I don't care one way or another, I am just realistic enough to know that Boren never lets it happen, at least at OU.

[tommieharris91]

Sorry, the 2nd amendment, like all of it's billy friends has limits, and whether you like it or not, are justified. Are you in favor of the public being able to carry a gun into a commercial flight? That's not tyranny, it's common sense.

We don't let 21 year-olds drink in frat houses or on campus at OU, but you seriously expect them to allow guns? I don't care one way or another, I am just realistic enough to know that Boren never lets it happen, at least at OU.

I certainly agree here.

[SicEmBaylor]

Sorry, the 2nd amendment, like all of it's billy friends has limits, and whether you like it or not, are justified. Are you in favor of the public being able to carry a gun into a commercial flight? That's not tyranny, it's common sense.

No, but I think you should be able to freely check with your luggage. There's a difference between temporarily restricting where you can carry and totally outlawing where and what you can carry.

There is a BIG difference between the 2nd Amendment and other amendments. The Supreme Court has clearly stated from time to time that some amendments are weighed more than others and should be restricted less than others. The 2nd Amendment is the most important amendment, by far, and should have no restrictions whatsoever.


We don't let 21 year-olds drink in frat houses or on campus at OU, but you seriously expect them to allow guns? I don't care one way or another, I am just realistic enough to know that Boren never lets it happen, at least at OU.

No, I don't seriously expect them to allow it. I would be beyond shocked if students who can lawfully carry were allowed to do so, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't like them to.

This frat house/frat boy analogy is strange. I'm not sure why being a member of a fraternity would disqualify you from carrying a firearm that you are legally entitled to carry.

[soonerscuba]

No, but I think you should be able to freely check with your luggage. There's a difference between temporarily restricting where you can carry and totally outlawing where and what you can carry.

There is a BIG difference between the 2nd Amendment and other amendments. The Supreme Court has clearly stated from time to time that some amendments are weighed more than others and should be restricted less than others. The 2nd Amendment is the most important amendment, by far, and should have no restrictions whatsoever.
You can check a gun at the airport, with very reasonable restrictions (unloaded, handguns must be cased user-retained with lock).

You admit in one sentence the concept of temporary restriction, and later argue that's it's mostest important of all the amendments and shouldn't be restricted at all.:confused:

There is nothing wrong with admitting there are places where it should be illegal to posses a firearm, personally, I like the idea of not allowing firearms at political conventions, or Congress, or the Whitehouse, etc. It seems that there is a block of people that feel firearms should be allowed on campus, which is fine, and some disagree. I disagree that high school teachers should be able to carry on the grounds that a lot of them don't know their *** from their elbow and we expect them to identify and nullify a threat to public safety?

I do agree that there is a big difference between the 2nd, and others, primarily in that it deals with the idea of the public having the right to posses a tangible object that's primary use is to kill. Like I said, I fully support a law abiding citizen to posses and even carry guns, but there are places that are and should be off limits, this isn't a new or bad concept.


This frat house/frat boy analogy is strange. I'm not sure why being a member of a fraternity would disqualify you from carrying a firearm that you are legally entitled to carry.
Not at all, frat boys are among my best friends and colleagues, but I do know that some of the most hotheaded, immature carzy assed people I have ever met fit this demographic. I personally wouldn't feel any better if they were the arbitrators of public safety.

[Okla-homey]

Sorry, the 2nd amendment, like all of it's billy friends has limits, and whether you like it or not, are justified. Are you in favor of the public being able to carry a gun into a commercial flight? That's not tyranny, it's common sense.




I dunno about that. Had a single US citizen with a CCP been aboard any of those flights on 9/11 it very well may have turned out differently.

And then we might not have had to fight the big scary war that you people hate so much. You know, "for want of a nail a shoe was lost....etc."

[StoopTroup]

I believe the biggest reason you might not want weapons on-board an aircraft is that you don't want the aircraft hijacked.

A hijacked aircraft can become an even bigger weapon than a handgun.

We were warned before 911 also...

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[soonerscuba]

I dunno about that. Had a single US citizen with a CCP been aboard any of those flights on 9/11 it very well may have turned out differently.

And then we might not have had to fight the big scary war that you people hate so much. You know, "for want of a nail a shoe was lost....etc."

I think that you could make the argument that better TSA and INS practices would have been more effective than a CCP passenger.

For the record, I am all in favor of the war Afghanistan, Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11.

[Okla-homey]

I think that you could make the argument that better TSA and INS practices would have been more effective than a CCP passenger.




No doubt, but TSA didn't exist. We used rent-a-cops and paid them minimum wage. And on the INS front, I don't beleive any of those cats had overstayed their visas. But I could be wrong on that.

Imagine if Achmed had no idea if or whom was packing on each flight. Kinda ups the odds against taking over a flight with a box cutter knife.

I'm not touching the Iraq dealio because you people have made up your minds on that one.

[soonerscuba]

No doubt, but TSA didn't exist. We used rent-a-cops and paid them minimum wage. And on the INS front, I don't beleive any of those cats had overstayed their visas. But I could be wrong on that.

Imagine if Achmed had no idea if or whom was packing on each flight. Kinda ups the odds against taking over a flight with a box cutter knife.

I'm not touching the Iraq dealio because you people have made up your minds on that one.
Substitute TSA for airport security. We still pay them barely over minimum wage, but if you are going to go hindsight, better training for them makes way more sense than letting civies carry guns on board, IMO. Achmed doesn't have to imagine if we stop the box cutter beforehand, with little likelihood for crossfire.

[StoopTroup]

I like the idea of keeping people away from the controls of the aircraft better than arming passengers or even Marshalls.

Arm the Pilots and if needed put an armed Marshall in the Cockpit. The Armed Marshall can only be in the cockpit if OK'd by the Flight Crew though.

I wouldn't want to have someone I didn't know or trust sitting behind me while I was operating an aircraft.

BTW...the door codes on aircraft need to be more secure IMO.

[BigRedJed]

On the plane front, I think they should just start building/remodeling planes so that the passengers and flight crew enter through different doors, and so that there is no connection whatsoever between the compartments.

If you're worried about non-hijacking, unruly passengers needing to be restrained or something, put an unarmed security guard on the passenger compartment, or train the flight attendants to subdue and restrain.

Not to be cold about it, but if you take away any possibility of bodily harm coming to the flight crew, they can go about their business no matter what, even if there is a bloody massacre going on in the passenger compartment. But there WOULD BE NO massacre going on in the passenger compartment, because would-be hijackers would understand that there is no way they can take over a plane and would move on to other targets instead. Then we could go back to the days when you briefly stepped through a metal detector, and when your family could accompany you to the gate to see you off.

[StoopTroup]

On the plane front, I think they should just start building/remodeling planes so that the passengers and flight crew enter through different doors, and so that there is no connection whatsoever between the compartments.




The only thing I'd say to that is I would feel pretty stupid if I got on an aircraft like that and say both pilots became ill and if one of the flight crew or a passenger could have gotten onto the flight deck to help the Pilots and fly the aircraft...

Well...it would be an awful feeling just sitting there waiting for the aircraft to run out of fuel.

[BigRedJed]

Add another flight crew member and take your chances, I guess. I don't think your chances with a flight attendant would be all that great, anyway.

[Jerk]

I just can't believe that some of you don't trust our teachers with a responsibility that has proven to take only a little training and mere common sense.

They need to do something, because the scary threat we face is a copy of the Belsan hostage crisis, by, uh, 'radical' elements of a certain religion.

They'll go for a middle school - the girls are old enough to rape and the boys are too young to fight back. That should tell you everything about the kind of people who are our enemies. The backlash by the American public will be epic, and scary. Let's pray it never happens.

[Jerk]

Reference for previous post here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beslan_school_hostage_crisis

[StoopTroup]

That was a pretty awful day in the world Jerk.

Agreed.

I hope we never see that again anywhere.


334 civilians were killed, including 186 children, and hundreds were wounded. Chechen terrorist Shamil Basayev took responsibility for the hostage taking.

[Curly Bill]

I just can't believe that some of you don't trust our teachers with a responsibility that has proven to take only a little training and mere common sense.


Opposing guns in most any form in places like schools on safety grounds is the knee-jerk reaction a lot of people have when what they don't really want to say is they find guns "yucky."

[Jerk]

That was a pretty awful day in the world Jerk.

Agreed.

I hope we never see that again anywhere.

Yes, it is such a sick story that I debated whether or not to even mention it.

[Curly Bill]

I just can't believe that some of you don't trust our teachers with a responsibility that has proven to take only a little training and mere common sense.

I'd also be willing to say that most teachers I know compare quite favorably to most small-town cops I know in the ability to take to training and in common sense.

...and to those that argue many teachers aren't the gun carrying type, then those teachers wouldn't be expected to do it.

[mdklatt]

If we need to arm teachers, that is certainly not a sign of progress in public education. In fact, that's pretty much a sign of failure as a society.

[mdklatt]

Had a single US citizen with a CCP been aboard any of those flights on 9/11 it very well may have turned out differently.


Would they be required to go through all the training that FSDOs and Air Marshalls have to go through?

[mdklatt]

On the plane front, I think they should just start building/remodeling planes so that the passengers and flight crew enter through different doors, and so that there is no connection whatsoever between the compartments.


What if there's some kind of emergency in the cockpit?

[Curly Bill]

If we need to arm teachers, that is certainly not a sign of progress in public education. In fact, that's pretty much a sign of failure as a society.

I don't see needing to arm teachers as a thing to be celebrated either, but in light of mass school shootings in recent history I think it is needed. What that says about society these days I'll agree is not particularly good.

[royalfan5]

What if there's some kind of emergency in the cockpit?

Then the passengers will be remembered as unlucky. How many instances are there of the entire flight crew being disabled and some passenger having to rescue them?

[mdklatt]

Then the passengers will be remembered as unlucky. How many instances are there of the entire flight crew being disabled and some passenger having to rescue them?

Last year a passenger helped out when the FO became incapacited, but the plane would have landed just fine without him. I'm talking about a medical emergency where somebody in the cockpit needs first aid. You gonna want the FO doing CPR on the captain while he's strapped in?

[BigRedJed]

What if there's some kind of emergency in the cockpit?
TOO BAD!

[BigRedJed]

Then the passengers will be remembered as unlucky. How many instances are there of the entire flight crew being disabled and some passenger having to rescue them?
That's sorta the point I was making. The chances are extremely remote. Add another officer to the flight crew and they are infinitesimal.

[royalfan5]

Last year a passenger helped out when the FO became incapacited, but the plane would have landed just fine without him. I'm talking about a medical emergency where somebody in the cockpit needs first aid. You gonna want the FO doing CPR on the captain while he's strapped in?

Then the FO is unlucky. Tis the way it goes.

[GrapevineSooner]

If we need to arm teachers, that is certainly not a sign of progress in public education. In fact, that's pretty much a sign of failure as a society.

Point taken.

But I also don't see the harm in arming teachers, so long as they've undergone the necessary gun safety training and crisis management classes. Aterall, how many school shootings have you heard about where a teacher just snapped and started shooting?

And aside from a law, what's to stop them from doing it these days?

[Curly Bill]

And aside from a law, what's to stop them from doing it these days?

WINNER!!!

All the law currently prevents is a law-abiding teacher being able to maybe stop the next Columbine or Virginia Tech.

[BigRedJed]

They just need to be careful that they don't eat the fish.

[BigRedJed]

"You'd better tell the Captain we've got to land as soon as we can. This woman has to be gotten to a hospital."

"A hospital? What is it?"

"It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now."

[BigRedJed]

Striker, listen, and you listen close: flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle, just a lot harder to put baseball cards in the spokes.

[BigRedJed]

There's no reason to become alarmed, and we hope you'll enjoy the rest of your flight. By the way, is there anyone on board who knows how to fly a plane?

[mdklatt]

Then the FO is unlucky. Tis the way it goes.

Expecting somebody to watch someone else die next to them when there is ample medical equipment 10 feet behind the cockpit and more often than not somebody with medical training on board (in addition to the FAs) is not going to fly.

9/11 will not happen again. The only reason it worked was because up to that point the passengers had the expectation that cooperation would ensure their safety. I think there's been one traditional hijacking since 9/11, but for the most part, the next hijacking is going to end more like United 93 than the first three flights.

[Soonrboy]

I don't think the definition of societal progress would involve teachers having to take guns into schools.

[Curly Bill]

the next hijacking is going to end more like United 93 than the first three flights.

...but if somone on board was armed and killed the bad guy(s) then maybe all the good guys/gals wouldn't have to die like those on United 93.

[Curly Bill]

I don't think the definition of societal progress would involve teachers having to take guns into schools.

That might be true but I don't think the definition of societal progress includes more mass shootings of innocent students and teachers either.

[mdklatt]

Point of order: What's to stop students from getting their hands on these guns? If you lock them up, they're not going to be very useful in a quick-draw emergency situation. Isn't that the argument against gun locks?

[Curly Bill]

Point of order: What's to stop students from getting their hands on these guns? If you lock them up, they're not going to be very useful in a quick-draw emergency situation. Isn't that the argument against gun locks?

If the guns are concealed how would the students know whom to try and take the guns from?

[Curly Bill]

Point of order: What's to stop students from getting their hands on these guns? If you lock them up, they're not going to be very useful in a quick-draw emergency situation. Isn't that the argument against gun locks?

In the many years since concealed carry became common how many instances of this happening are there? I've never had anyone go for mine at the Wal-Marts, one reason being no one at the Wal-Marts knows I have it.

[mdklatt]

In the many years since concealed carry became common how many instances of this happening are there? I've never had anyone go for mine at the Wal-Marts, one reason being no one at the Wal-Marts knows I have it.

In the many years since concealed carry became law, how many instances of somebody stopping a mass shooting have their been?


There's a little bit of a difference between a Wal-Mart full of strangers and a school where everybody knows everyone else's business. And we're talking about a small town school in this case. It's not going to be a secret who's packing.

[Curly Bill]

There's a little bit of a difference between a Wal-Mart full of strangers and a school where everybody knows everyone else's business. And we're talking about a small town school in this case. It's not going to be a secret who's packing.

I'm not willing to concede that point. When I first took the CCP class the instructor had his son come in and he asked us to identify how many guns the son was wearing concealed, the son was wearing jeans and a polo shirt. I looked, others looked, and I don't think anyone could actually visually identify any, but most of guessed 2 or 3 just to throw out a number. He proceded to uncover 7 handguns of various sizes. I point this out to say it's not easy to tell if someone is packing.

I live in a small town and I bet you there aren't six peeps in it that know I have a concealed carry permit, and those are friends that might know.

[Curly Bill]

In the many years since concealed carry became law, how many instances of somebody stopping a mass shooting have their been?

We'll never know because these mass shooters have been smart enough to target places where they knew they would likely not encounter armed resistance for a good period of time. How many mass shootings have been prevented at places besides schools where someone bent on mass killing avoided them because they knew they might not get much done before they themselves were targeted?

[royalfan5]

We'll never know because these mass shooters have been smart enough to target places where they knew they would likely not encounter armed resistance for a good period of time. How many mass shootings have been prevented at places besides schools where someone bent on mass killing avoided them because they knew they might not get much done before they themselves were targeted?

It also seems that most mass killers are on a one way trip anyway. Maybe it only encourages them to up the amount of firepower on their one way trip.

[Curly Bill]

It also seems that most mass killers are on a one way trip anyway. Maybe it only encourages them to up the amount of firepower on their one way trip.

I agree on the one-way trip thing, but for some reason they've decided to take people with them, as opposed to taking only their own life. I think these peeps need to know that if they go into a school bent on making some kind of "mark" they might not get very far down that road.

[royalfan5]

I agree on the one-way trip thing, but for some reason they've decided to take people with them, as opposed to taking only their own life. I think these peeps need to know that if they go into a school bent on making some kind of "mark" they might not get very far down that road.

Or they will alter their tactics. Armed teachers may make carnage in the school harder, so spree killers could turn to attacking crowds where a similar amount of damage could be caused in a shorter time. There really isn't a cure all for crazy *******s bent on killing a lot of people. Armed teachers curtail one type of threat, but it wouldn't end spree killing. I guess my point is arming teachers and others is fine, but there will probably always be crazy *******s who finds ways to go crazy, and that there really isn't a solution to that.

[mdklatt]

Armed teachers curtail one type of threat, but it wouldn't end spree killing.

And increases the chance of accidental shootings. Are there any stats on how many deaths are prevented by people with guns?

[Scott D]

better yet, what's the percentage of any of you living within 3 miles of regular gun violence?

[olevetonahill]

better yet, what's the percentage of any of you living within 3 miles of regular gun violence?

Pretty damn high here around My shack
just sayin

[Scott D]

huntin' don't count...

neither do flashbacks :D

[Jerk]

And increases the chance of accidental shootings. Are there any stats on how many deaths are prevented by people with guns?

Yes, Dr. Lott, University of Chicago.