I am burned out on Phelps

[Penguin]

Can we go one day without hearing about Michael Phelps winning a bazillion gold medals?

[tommieharris91]

That day will come like Sunday.

[badger]

That day will come like Sunday.

Or sooner. He only has three events left.

[King Crimson]

well, it's about time somebody discovered that "propaganda" isn't simply a phenomenon of the "chicoms". the Olympic telecasts have been ratings-driven "propaganda" for a long time.

[soonersn20xx]

I am sure you will get even more sick of him when he whores himself to a bazillion ad campaigns. Wheaties, Disney, HP, etcccc commercials

[soonermix]

or you might hear about him everyday for the rest of your life :eek:

or until track and field starts

[SoonerInKCMO]

I thought this was going to be about Fred Phelps and his burned out garage. :mad:

[Penguin]

I'm just grumpy because there's no curling in the summer Olympics.

[jkjsooner]

Again, I say that swimming flat out gives away too many medals. We call Phelps the greatest olympian ever but he ain't no Bo Jackson or Jim Thorpe. He does one thing very very well but the way the sport is organized you can win a ton of medals doing that one thing. There's a reason Spitz was one of our most decorated Olympic athletes.

Even a track and field guy like Carl Lewis had to add in long jump to sprinting to get a high medal count.

Swimming needs to tone down the medal count. We don't need a million combinations of every stroke / distance / number of competitors / etc.

That being said, Phelps is a stud.

[badger]

Swimming needs to tone down the medal count. We don't need a million combinations of every stroke / distance / number of competitors / etc.

China agrees... replace swimming medals with gymnastics and diving medals. Thus, they are guaranteed to win because those contests are based on biased judging. :D

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Again, I say that swimming flat out gives away too many medals. We call Phelps the greatest olympian ever but he ain't no Bo Jackson or Jim Thorpe. He does one thing very very well but the way the sport is organized you can win a ton of medals doing that one thing. There's a reason Spitz was one of our most decorated Olympic athletes.

Even a track and field guy like Carl Lewis had to add in long jump to sprinting to get a high medal count.

Swimming needs to tone down the medal count. We don't need a million combinations of every stroke / distance / number of competitors / etc.

That being said, Phelps is a stud.Good Point!

[King Crimson]

Good Point!

i think it's a good point, too.

maybe they need a decathalon type event....that's a combo.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

i think it's a good point, too.

maybe they need a decathalon type event....that's a combo.Maybe the 200m backstroke, combined with Still Rings, Rhythmic Gymnastics, and a boxing match?

[setem]

All you communist hippies better get on board or you will burn in depths of hell for your pinko ways! Phelps is a American hero(even though he dresses like a fag in the pool) and you better get right with President Bush and Jesus!

Love
John Rocker

[StoopTroup]

I thought he looked funny in the first event last night.

This morning I heard he was having trouble with his goggles.

I guess that makes sense since he basically threw them to the side of the pool after he finished.

[kbsooner21]

Phelps is the man!

[Curly Bill]

Phelps is the man!

Right on, and he and the Olympics are taking some of the focus off of Brack -v- McCain.

[Penguin]

Again, I say that swimming flat out gives away too many medals. We call Phelps the greatest olympian ever but he ain't no Bo Jackson or Jim Thorpe. He does one thing very very well but the way the sport is organized you can win a ton of medals doing that one thing. There's a reason Spitz was one of our most decorated Olympic athletes.

Let's count the swimming events:
Freestyle
50m for men & women
100m for men & women
200m for men & women
400m for men & women
800m for women
1500m for men

Backstroke
100m for men & women
200m for men & women

Breaststroke
100m for men & women
200m for men & women

Butterfly
100m for men & women
200m for men & women

Individual medley
200m for men & women
400m for men & women

Freestyle relay
4×100m for men & women
4×200m for men & women

Medley relay
4×100m for men & women

Marathon
10km for men & women


By my count, that 17 men's events! No wonder only swimmers are the ones that can get 8 medals. I used to think track & field had too many medals, but even Carl Lewis had to add long-jumping to get his medal count up.

[StoopTroup]

Why don't they just have a Decathlon Type of Swimming event and limit the number of events an athelete can enter.

[Curly Bill]

We usually kick *** at swimming, I say the more swimming events the better. Now some of the more ghey events we don't do well at, lets get rid of those.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

We usually kick *** at swimming, I say the more swimming events the better. Now some of the more ghey events we don't do well at, lets get rid of those.OMG, You're right! What was I thinking? If it was a freakin' Ruskie or Chicom who was taking all those medals, we would have a right to be PO'd, but Phelps is a good ole 'Merican boy!

[SoonerJack]

man, buncha haters on here

[Soonrboy]

man, buncha haters on here


No **** man...tearing down an Olympic champ. Jiminy Christmas

[Frozen Sooner]

Again, I say that swimming flat out gives away too many medals. We call Phelps the greatest olympian ever but he ain't no Bo Jackson or Jim Thorpe. He does one thing very very well but the way the sport is organized you can win a ton of medals doing that one thing. There's a reason Spitz was one of our most decorated Olympic athletes.

Even a track and field guy like Carl Lewis had to add in long jump to sprinting to get a high medal count.

Swimming needs to tone down the medal count. We don't need a million combinations of every stroke / distance / number of competitors / etc.

That being said, Phelps is a stud.

You realize that he broke a world record in the 400 I/M, right? That's actually being world class in four different things. So until Carl Lewis wins a spring going backwards or something, Phelps is the bigger stud.

[Blue]

and I don't see any other swimming dudes winning 8 events. It aint easy. He is better than people who only "specialize" in a certain event.

[Blue]

Anybody hear Spitz saying if they had all these events when he was swimming he could have done what Phelps is doing? What a doosh.

[Okla-homey]

Again, I say that swimming flat out gives away too many medals. We call Phelps the greatest olympian ever but he ain't no Bo Jackson or Jim Thorpe. He does one thing very very well but the way the sport is organized you can win a ton of medals doing that one thing. There's a reason Spitz was one of our most decorated Olympic athletes.

Even a track and field guy like Carl Lewis had to add in long jump to sprinting to get a high medal count.

Swimming needs to tone down the medal count. We don't need a million combinations of every stroke / distance / number of competitors / etc.

That being said, Phelps is a stud.

I agree completely. It's as of they gave out medals in track for the guy who runs the fastest 40, 50, 60, 70, 80, 90 and 100m.

[Penguin]

I was reading on another board that they should have a 400m medley in track and field.

100m of running, 100m of hurdles, 100m of skipping, and 100m of speed walking.

[tommieharris91]

Anybody hear Spitz saying if they had all these events when he was swimming he could have done what Phelps is doing? What a doosh.

He probably could have. I don't doubt him there.

[GottaHavePride]

Um, how many of you guys actually swim? And can you actually swim all those different strokes? They all work totally different muscle groups. You have the challenge of sprint speed vs. endurance PLUS using different muscle sets, so it's like a having a guy enter sprinting, distance running, hammer throw, and high jump.

Seriously - I can swim breaststroke all day and not get tired. Not anywhere approaching the speed of an Olympic swimmer, because that stroke is hard as hell to swim fast. Freestyle is more of a workout, and backstroke is freestyle in reverse - not just other side up: your arms rotate the opposite direction. Opposing muscle sets.

Butterfly is hard as hell. I can't make it more than about 10 meters doing butterfly before I have to quit. It takes a ridiculous amount of shoulder and leg strength to actually get that stroke in a rhythm where it works. (That's what SHE said.)

[GottaHavePride]

He probably could have. I don't doubt him there.

Spitz was ALWAYS a doosh. But he could back it up.

Some guys get hyped (Bode Miller), and some are just actually that good.

[jkjsooner]

Um, how many of you guys actually swim? And can you actually swim all those different strokes? They all work totally different muscle groups. You have the challenge of sprint speed vs. endurance PLUS using different muscle sets, so it's like a having a guy enter sprinting, distance running, hammer throw, and high jump.


Sorry, but, no. I understand they're different motions but it's not as different as sprinting vs hammer throw vs high jump. You can't seriously make that argument.

For starters, it's physically impossible to be a champion marathon runner and 100m sprinter. I would also argue it's impossible to be a champion hammer thrower and sprinter. They have totally different body types.

Have you ever seen a guy excel at the Olympic level at any combination of events you listed?

It happens quite often in swimming. Not to Phelp's level but others have taken home multiple medals in swimming with different types of strokes.

Nobody has or will ever win gold on two or more of the events you listed...


Guys, don't get me wrong I'm rooting for Phelps big-time and think he kicks butt. I'm just saying his accomplishments need to be put in perspective. If you define "best olympian" as the one with most medals then you're pretty much guaranteeing that it's either a swimmer or a diver.

You have other people who have dominated their sports for 10 years but can only win one Olympic medal per Olympics.

One reason I feel this way is that years ago I ran into an obnoxious Aussie who was talking trash after the Sydney Olympics about how they won so many more medals per capita than we did. The thing is, they have a strong swim team and that pretty much guarantees more medals per capita for them.

[Frozen Sooner]

Yeah, well, the Australians are notorious dopers on the swimming front.

[Frozen Sooner]

I agree completely. It's as of they gave out medals in track for the guy who runs the fastest 40, 50, 60, 70, 80, 90 and 100m.

Yeah, good thing they don't give separate medals for the 100m, 200m, 400m, the various hurdles, and the different relays. They just give one dude a medal in those per year.

[JohnnyMack]

Yeah, good thing they don't give separate medals for the 100m, 200m, 400m, the various hurdles, and the different relays. They just give one dude a medal in those per year.

Or the 800 or 5000 or 10,000 or anything like that.

[sooneron]

Spitz was ALWAYS a doosh. But he could back it up.

Some guys get hyped (Bode Miller), and some are just actually that good.

You realize that he won two silvers, right? Alpine skiing may be the quirkiest of all Olympic sports. One bad edge, and your done... for good.

Yeah, he totally sucked...

Bode Miller (born October 12, 1977) is an American alpine skier. In 2008 Bode (pronounced as IPA: [boʊˈdi]) won his second overall Alpine Skiing World Cup title in four years, after also winning the title in 2005. This led the United States ski team to sweep the men's and women's overall World Cup titles for the first time in 25 years, as Lindsey Vonn won the woman's title. In 2005 Bode became the first American in 22 years to win the overall title, since Phil Mahre and Tamara McKinney in 1983. Earlier during his championship season, with a victory on November 28, 2004, he became only the fifth man to win World Cup races in all five disciplines: slalom, giant slalom, Super-G, downhill, and combined. With 31 World Cup victories, he is the most successful American alpine skier. He is also a four-time World Champion in four different disciplines and has a pair of silver medals from the 2002 Winter Olympics. On May 12, 2007, Miller announced that he would be leaving the US Ski Team.[1][2]. However, he still competes for the USA in international competitions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bode_Miller

He may not be popular, but he was good. The best the USA has had for a long while.

[Penguin]

http://www.curlingrussia.com/images/photos/national/womens/privivkova.jpg

[Penguin]

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/0b5cbCveuheqK/610x.jpg

[SanJoaquinSooner]

Let's count the swimming events:
Freestyle
50m for men & women
100m for men & women
200m for men & women
400m for men & women
800m for women
1500m for men



Individual medley
200m for men & women
400m for men & women

Freestyle relay
4×100m for men & women
4×200m for men & women

Medley relay
4×100m for men & women

Marathon
10km for men & women

.

Yea, for freestyle wrestling, maybe there should be

30 second match freestyle
1 min match freestyle
2 min match freestyle
4 min match freestyle
8 min match freestyle
15 min match freestyle
1 hour (marathon) freestyle

and a couple of tag team medley match freestyle categories.

then repeat for greco-roman.

Dave and Mark Schultz could have won 8 gold medals each.

[SoonerDood]

Burned out on Phelps?! Maybe you would like to subscribe to the Farve Channel?

[soonerboomer93]

Or the 800 or 5000 or 10,000 or anything like that.

and don't forget those extra cool

20km and 50km racewalks

:/


seriously, people

when you go compete in those events at that level, then you can talk **** about his gold medals

[soonermix]

America...
America...
America, **** YEAH!
Coming again, to save the mother ****ing day yeah,
America, **** YEAH!
Freedom is the only way yeah,
Terrorist your game is through cause now you have to answer too,
America, **** YEAH!
So lick my butt, and suck on my balls,
America, **** YEAH!
What you going to do when we come for you now,
it’s the dream that we all share; it’s the hope for tomorrow

[Fraggle145]

America...
America...
America, **** YEAH!
Coming again, to save the mother ****ing day yeah,
America, **** YEAH!
Freedom is the only way yeah,
Terrorist your game is through cause now you have to answer too,
America, **** YEAH!
So lick my butt, and suck on my balls,
America, **** YEAH!
What you going to do when we come for you now,
it’s the dream that we all share; it’s the hope for tomorrow

http://www.celluloid-dreams.de/content/images/kritiken-filmbilder/team-america-world-police/team-america-world-police-1.jpg

[jkjsooner]

seriously, people

when you go compete in those events at that level, then you can talk **** about his gold medals

What is that supposed to mean?

I darn sure never said or implied that I could do that. Nobody here is saying they're better than Phelps. We're also not at all criticizing his performances and I've said many times that he's one bad mofo.

The reason I'm making this point is that comparing medal counts is really unfair to non-swimming athletes.

Look at how many swimmers bring home 4 or 5 medals. It's happened in every Olympics that I've watched. The multitude of multiple medal winners to me proves the point that these events are too similar. I don't care if you guys say different strokes require totally different muscles/skills. Too many swimmers winning too many medals with different strokes proves my point.

Track and field does produce multiple medal winners but not nearly to the level of swimming. An exceptional athlete can compete in maybe 3 or 4 events.

[SCOUT]

I agree completely. It's as of they gave out medals in track for the guy who runs the fastest 40, 50, 60, 70, 80, 90 and 100m.

There is the 100m, 200m, 400m, 800m, 110m hurdles, 400m hurdles, 4x100m relay and 4x400m relay. That sounds fairly comparable to the Phelps schedule when you consider the different strokes and the different running styles.

Don't forget that track and field also has a 1500m, 5000m, 10000m, multiple walking events, multiple steeplchase events, and of course the marathon.

[Penguin]

Well, let's not forget that there's only one way to run when there are 4 ways to swim.

Also, swimmers are in the cool pool water which is constantly pulling away their body heat, while runners are running in the heat and humidity.

I just think the media forgets about all of that when they start throwing around the term "greatest Olympian of all-time."

[Penguin]

Now if swimmers were swimming in warm bathwater, NOW we're talking!

[SCOUT]

Well, let's not forget that there's only one way to run when there are 4 ways to swim.

Also, swimmers are in the cool pool water which is constantly pulling away their body heat, while runners are running in the heat and humidity.

I just think the media forgets about all of that when they start throwing around the term "greatest Olympian of all-time."

Let me start by agreeing with you on the overuse of the "all-time" moniker.

There are indeed four ways to swim and they are all pretty different. Sprints, long distance, walking, hurdles and running with obstacles are also different ways of running. I also forgot to mention the run-skip and jump event.

Look, swimming has a lot of differen medals but winning all of them is at a minimum roughly equivalent to a track and field athlete. Mastering the four different strokes is similar to mastering the track and field events or at least enough of them to rake in 8 medals.

I think Phelps is getting flack because he is just so dominant. He makes the races look like a joke. Keep in mind that he set world records in pretty much every event he has won.

[SCOUT]

Sorry, I forgot to address the temperature. It is true that the water has a cooling effect, but the chlorine wreaks havoc on their hair.

[Penguin]

1 Olympic women's overall gymnastics Gold medal = 200 Olympic swimming gold medals

[Blue]

Actually if a girl were as good as phelps she could conceivably win the team, individual all around, the floor, the vault, the beam, and the uneven bars. That's six golds.

If eight swimming golds were easy it would have been done before. How many did Ian Thorpe win a couple olympics ago?

[badger]

If you're sick of Phelps, just relish the fact that he'll be gone for four years after this week.

[picasso]

Again, I say that swimming flat out gives away too many medals. We call Phelps the greatest olympian ever but he ain't no Bo Jackson or Jim Thorpe. He does one thing very very well but the way the sport is organized you can win a ton of medals doing that one thing. There's a reason Spitz was one of our most decorated Olympic athletes.

Even a track and field guy like Carl Lewis had to add in long jump to sprinting to get a high medal count.

Swimming needs to tone down the medal count. We don't need a million combinations of every stroke / distance / number of competitors / etc.

That being said, Phelps is a stud.

Bo Jackson? He was a multi-sport athlete being great in football and not-so great in baseball.
I'm no big swimming fan but Phelps is an absolute freakish stud who deserves all of the press he's currently getting.
If it wasn't for him, we'd have to hear about the greatness of China even more so.

so quit bitching.

[Frozen Sooner]

Didn't Bo make an All-Star game or three as a baseball player? Or am I making that up?

[picasso]

Didn't Bo make an All-Star game or three as a baseball player? Or am I making that up?

if he did it was by popular fan vote. there is a reason he left baseball to play football.
I'll admit anyone who makes the majors is a stud.

[Frozen Sooner]

Actually, not only did he make an All-Star game, he was the MVP of it and became one of a very select group who has hit a homer AND stolen a base in an all-star game.

[picasso]

well I don't recall him being as impressive as he was in football. it might have had something to do with college and drinking a lot of beer.

anywho, he's got nothing to do with Phelps because Bo dint do no Olympics.

[Frozen Sooner]

Fair enough. Bo really was a pretty superlative player in both sports (though he was better in football, for sure) until his degenetarive condition ended his career.

And I'm totally on the Phelps=stud bandwagon.

[picasso]

I do remember now Bo winning MVP of the All-Star game and that one time running up the wall in the outfield. I also remember arguing with my black friends in college after the "Whens that Tour De France thing?" commercial and how Bo could never ever actually do that.:D

[sooneron]

Well, let's not forget that there's only one way to run when there are 4 ways to swim.

Also, swimmers are in the cool pool water which is constantly pulling away their body heat, while runners are running in the heat and humidity.

I just think the media forgets about all of that when they start throwing around the term "greatest Olympian of all-time."

Here's an idea. Go run for 30 minutes straight.

On another day some time in the future, go swim for 30 minutes straight. Please be sure to get back to us on how long you were swimming laps.

[royalfan5]

Fair enough. Bo really was a pretty superlative player in both sports (though he was better in football, for sure) until his degenetarive condition ended his career.

And I'm totally on the Phelps=stud bandwagon.

Bo wasn't that good of a baseball player. He didn't walk, struck out a ton, and posted pretty medicore overall stat lines. Check his baseball refence comp's, they aren't that outstanding. At his peak he was no more than the third best player on those Royals rosters.

[Howzit]

Also, swimmers are in the cool pool water which is constantly pulling away their body heat, while runners are running in the heat and humidity.


Plus, they can take a drink whenever the heckfire they feel like it. How hard is that?




If eight swimming golds were easy it would have been done before. How many did Ian Thorpe win a couple olympics ago?

Bingo.

This is the same as arguning who is the greatest athlete of all-time in anything. Or which is harder, hitting a fastball or...um...doing something else.

If winning 8 golds was no big deal, someone would have done it. It's been over 30 years since 7 were won, even in swimming, a demonstrably weaker sport :rolleyes: 8 has never happened.

[jkjsooner]

I think Phelps is getting flack because he is just so dominant. He makes the races look like a joke. Keep in mind that he set world records in pretty much every event he has won.

I disgree. Outside of Phelps, look at how many people are walking away with multiple medals. It happens in swimming in every Olympics.

Again, in track and field it's much more rare. Running the 400m is so different than the 100m that you almost never seen anyone do it. (You do see some 100/200 and 200/400 crossovers though.)

Looking at this I must conclude one of the two to be true and this is based on observations outside of Phelps.

1. The swimming events are in fact more similar than the listed track and field events.

or

2. Swimming still does not have the level of participation required to truly isolate the specialists in each of the various events. Let's face it, the number of kids who can compete in competitive swimming around the world pales in comparison to those who have access to track and field. Plus, you kind of have to get in the pool and train to discover you have ability in that. Some kid from Uganda with little resources but can run really fast can be discovered and put into a track program.


I mean, c'mon, how many people have walked away with tons of swimming medals in the 2000/2004/2008 Olympics?

[picasso]

my suggestion to you would be to turn the channel when swimming is on.

[jkjsooner]

my suggestion to you would be to turn the channel when swimming is on.

No, because I enjoy watching Phelps win gold medals and I hope he gets eight.

I just don't want to degrade all the other great Olympians we've had in other sports by calling Phelps the greatest ever.

[picasso]

I'm not sure it's degrading.

I mean, Hairy doesn't get upset when folks talk about my obvious golfing prowess over him.

[jkjsooner]

One other thing about track and field....

We pretty much all have developed our walking/running skills daily since we took our first steps as a child. It's so fundamental to the human being that I would say that if there was one sport that gives away a bunch of medals it should be something like running.

If we were fish I would say we should have a ton of swimming medals. We're not fish, though, so I think swimming should tone down the medal count just a tad bit.

[picasso]

One other thing about track and field....

We pretty much all have developed our walking/running skills daily since we took our first steps as a child. It's so fundamental to the human being that I would say that if there was one sport that gives away a bunch of medals it should be something like running.

If we were fish I would say we should have a ton of swimming medals. We're not fish, though, so I think swimming should tone down the medal count just a tad bit.

I don't get your logic or why you have such a woody for the subject. I was personally hoping for a Dog Paddling event this year. Chalk #10 up for Phelps.

[tommieharris91]

Bo wasn't that good of a baseball player. He didn't walk, struck out a ton, and posted pretty medicore overall stat lines. Check his baseball refence comp's, they aren't that outstanding. At his peak he was no more than the third best player on those Royals rosters.

His 1990 season was pretty good. I'd be pretty happy with his 1990 production in CF.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/j/jacksbo01.shtml

[Howzit]

If we were fish I would say we should have a ton of swimming medals. We're not fish, though, so I think swimming should tone down the medal count just a tad bit.

Think how many medals someone would get if they were, like, a Cheetoh.

[Howzit]

Or a jaguar.

Dang.

[royalfan5]

His 1990 season was pretty good. I'd be pretty happy with his 1990 production in CF.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/j/jacksbo01.shtml

except that he was a LF, and outside of HR's he didn't generate much extra base power. He had one pretty good season, and so has Mark Teahen.

[tulsaoilerfan]

ESPN just reported Serbian team has filed a protest regarding Phelps' victory tonight in the 100 Fly

[Hot Rod]

ESPN just reported Serbian team has filed a protest regarding Phelps' victory tonight in the 100 Fly

The race was close, but after watching it in super slow mode, as they replayed it, I have to give to Phelps.

[JohnnyMack]

**** Serbia

[JohnnyMack]

One other thing about track and field....

We pretty much all have developed our walking/running skills daily since we took our first steps as a child. It's so fundamental to the human being that I would say that if there was one sport that gives away a bunch of medals it should be something like running.

If we were fish I would say we should have a ton of swimming medals. We're not fish, though, so I think swimming should tone down the medal count just a tad bit.

This is some of the worst logic i've ever encountered around here. Good jorb.

[mdklatt]

I think the swimmers should have to swim outdoors. Then we'll see how tough they are.

[Blue]

Spitz classy in that interview. He's now only a minor doosh.

[OU-HSV]

How can you be burned out on Phelps??
Tonights the first time I've ever shouted for swimming.
Of course tonight is the first night I've ever watched swimming as well. :)

[Blue]

Hate! Hate! Hate!

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/3175/hatersball03300019xc.jpg

[hurricane'bone]

I think the swimmers should have to swim outdoors. Then we'll see how tough they are.

You mean like they did in Athens?

[mdklatt]

You mean like they did in Athens?

Make them swim in open water, like a lake or the ocean. Pools are for sissies. :D

[Czar Soonerov]

Make em' swim with sharks, then we'd find out just how fast they really are.

[GottaHavePride]

Make them swim in open water, like a lake or the ocean. Pools are for sissies. :D

I actually thought it was easier to swim across a lake in Sweden than it is to swim in a pool here in town.

Maybe it's just because I was following a really hot chick.

[Okla-homey]

The race was close, but after watching it in super slow mode, as they replayed it, I have to give to Phelps.

Only because Phelps is a freak. His reach, with his arms outstretched, exceeds his height. That is just weird. He should be tested for gorilla genes.:eek:

[JohnnyMack]

Only because Phelps is a freak. His reach, with his arms outstretched, exceeds his height. That is just weird. He should be tested for gorilla genes.:eek:

Oh I'm quite certain we all have those, I dont need genetic testing to know that. ;)

[jkjsooner]

Think how many medals someone would get if they were, like, a Cheetoh.

Not my point at all. No doubt we're hardly the fastest running animal. However, we are built to run not swim. So a guy who excels at running is excelling at something humans were created to do.

[jkjsooner]

This is some of the worst logic i've ever encountered around here. Good jorb.

It's not logic it's opinion. In my opinion, as you get further away from basic human strengths it becomes harder and harder for me to annoint you as the greatest athlete. It's simply the way I define the greatest athlete.

IMO, sports were created to demostrate the basic human attributes. (I don't consider swimming a basic human attribute as we were not created to be swimmers.) That's also why I would never call Tiger Woods the greatest athlete. His sport is way too specialized to be considered an all around athlete. Maybe if you used the term "greatest sportsman" I would agree.

Anyway, it's just an opinion. Don't confuse opinion with logic. It is neither logical or illogical.

[jkjsooner]

How can you be burned out on Phelps??
Tonights the first time I've ever shouted for swimming.
Of course tonight is the first night I've ever watched swimming as well. :)

I know this wasn't addressed to me but I want to say that I'm not at all burned out on Phelps. Frankly, he and the basketball team have made these Olympics the best in a while.

I am, however, burned out on the "best Olympian ever" talk.

[Frozen Sooner]

Not my point at all. No doubt we're hardly the fastest running animal. However, we are built to run not swim. So a guy who excels at running is excelling at something humans were created to do.

We were built to brachiate, not run.

Therefore, we should have 20 medal events in vine swinging.

[jkjsooner]

We were built to brachiate, not run.

Therefore, we should have 20 medal events in vine swinging.

Hate to be the one to inform you that we're not monkeys or apes. As far as I know humans haven't swung from vines since we evolved from other primates. We evolved as hunter/gatherers and that generally didn't involve swinging through trees. It did involve running though.

Maybe you've watched too many Tarzan movies.

[jkjsooner]

I know track and field hasn't started yet but look at the multiple medal winners. Ignore Phelps if you like. Look how many swimmers are on there. Are we to conclude that all the best athletes are swimmers?

http://results.beijing2008.cn/WRM/ENG/INF/GL/99/GL0000000.shtml

Swimmers rank 1,2,3,4,4,9,10,11,11,....

The thing is full of swimmers and many won medals using different strokes. So, I guess you have to be a swimmer to be the greatest athlete. If looking at those standands doesn't make you think there is medal overkill and too much cross-event competition then I don't know what will.

[JohnnyMack]

It's not logic it's opinion. In my opinion, as you get further away from basic human strengths it becomes harder and harder for me to annoint you as the greatest athlete. It's simply the way I define the greatest athlete.

IMO, sports were created to demostrate the basic human attributes. (I don't consider swimming a basic human attribute as we were not created to be swimmers.) That's also why I would never call Tiger Woods the greatest athlete. His sport is way too specialized to be considered an all around athlete. Maybe if you used the term "greatest sportsman" I would agree.

Anyway, it's just an opinion. Don't confuse opinion with logic. It is neither logical or illogical.

Outside of running down a wooly mammoth and tossing a spear at it what athletic events are humans conditioned for?

Basic human strengths? WTF are you talking about?

[Okla-homey]

How about this. Humans started making bows and arrows between 40 and 50,000 B.C.. At least that's what the archeologists tell us. Further, virtually every human culture, regardless of where on the planet they lived, developed bows and arrows.

So, since archery and humans have such a long history and the shooting of an arrow only involves a stick and string, does that make archery "pure" enough to count?

[Howzit]

Ok, jkjsooner, who IS the greatest olympian of all time? And please give your criteria and justification.

[Curly Bill]

Since we evolved as hunter-gatherers we should have Olympic events where we just hunt and gather stuff...

...course with them long arms and ginormous hands Phelps would probably dominate that too. Can you imagine how well this guy could pick berries?

[tommieharris91]

Since we evolved as hunter-gatherers we should have Olympic events where we just hunt and gather stuff...

...course with them long arms and ginormous hands Phelps would probably dominate that too. Can you imagine how well this guy could pick berries?

I bet he could catch tasty fishes with his bare hands.

[Okla-homey]

Ok, jkjsooner, who IS the greatest olympian of all time? And please give your criteria and justification.

I dunno about what he thinks, but my money's on Jim Thorpe.

Apparently General Mills agrees.

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/5752/thorpegw3.jpg

[Curly Bill]

I bet he could catch tasty fishes with his bare hands.

...and the fact he can swim like one couldn't hurt here right? ;)

...so what was this argument about now??? :P

[tommieharris91]

...and the fact he can swim like one couldn't hurt here right? ;)

...so what was this argument about now??? :P

Somethin about how we're made to gather food? :confused:

[Curly Bill]

Somethin about how we're made to gather food? :confused:

Oh yeah, we should be out gathering food instead of watching the Olympics. :D

[jkjsooner]

Ok, jkjsooner, who IS the greatest olympian of all time? And please give your criteria and justification.

I don't know. It's probably pointless and unfair to proclaim someone as the greatest as it's impossible to compare sports and there will too many disagreements. (I never said others had to agree with my criteria of a great athlete.) I also know there's a good chance that we're too American centric to really be able to say.

I do know one thing, it wouldn't simply be based on medal count as that is too generous to swimmers and possibly even track athletes.

[olevetonahill]

Oh yeah, we should be out gathering food instead of watching the Olympics. :D

I think Im gonna go to the Kitchen and Gather me some Now . Yall made me hungry.

[Curly Bill]

I think Im gonna go to the Kitchen and Gather me some Now . Yall made me hungry.

Fish?

[jkjsooner]

Since we evolved as hunter-gatherers we should have Olympic events where we just hunt and gather stuff...

...course with them long arms and ginormous hands Phelps would probably dominate that too. Can you imagine how well this guy could pick berries?

You're taking what I said way to literally. And I never said you had to agree with my definition of athletic excellence.

The ancient Olympics generally mimicked the activities (mostly warrior related) of the ancient Greeks. That doesn't mean they had to actually fight to death.

[olevetonahill]

Fish?

I got some Catfish In the freezer Im thinking about heating up the frydaddy :pop:

[olevetonahill]

You're taking what I said way to literally. And I never said you had to agree with my definition of athletic excellence.

The ancient Olympics generally mimiced the activities (mostly warrior related) of the ancient Greeks. That doesn't mean they had to actually fight to death.

I agree we need an event that puts an M16 against an AK :rolleyes:

[Curly Bill]

I got some Catfish In the freezer Im thinking about heating up the frydaddy :pop:

Yummmmmm. :)

[Curly Bill]

You're taking what I said way to literally.

Well yeah, that's what happens on here. :P

[olevetonahill]

Well yeah, that's what happens on here. :P

nOObs go figure :D

[jkjsooner]

Anyway, my criteria of sports is quite off-topic. I only used it to explain why I think it makes more sense for track and field to give tons of medals than swimming.

To make my "fundamental movement" argument more concrete, I'm down with creating a sport comprised of a race while walking on one's hands if someone wanted to create. Lord knows it would be hard and would take much strength and stamina. But if they started adding 20m, 40m, 80m hand walking competitions then I would complain as it's just not a natural enough sport to warrant multiple medals. I'm not saying swimming is equivalent to walking on one's hands but I'm going to extreme to make my point.

Anyway, that was only used to compare track and field to swimming and went a little off topic.

My biggest point is that I've pretty much proven with links that even outside of Phelps swimming has the largest majority of multiple medal winners. That's fine but I'm not going to automatically give the "best Olympian" title to Phelps or Spitz. In fact, I think it's unfair to give it to anyone.

[NYC Poke]

A walking-on-hands race underwater might be kinda cool.

[Penguin]

Oh, yeah. I forgot about that dolphin-kick thing! These swimmers don't even do a stroke for 1/4 of the race! They get to stay underwater for as long as they want at the start and on turns.

Even backstrokers get to stop their stroke, backflip, push off the wall, and dolphin-kick for as long as they want. If you are a tremendous dolphin-kicker, you can compete in any stroke.

[Curly Bill]

I think we should have an event where you swing from a vine into the pool, upon landing in the pool you have two minutes to catch as many fish as possible. The winner of the event is the one that catches the heaviest amount of fish.

...makes at least as much since as synchronized diving does IMO.

[mdklatt]

Even backstrokers get to stop their stroke, backflip, push off the wall, and dolphin-kick for as long as they want.

You have to be back "on stroke" with you head above the surface within 15 m of the wall. You can see a red mark on the lane marker lines; I think that's at 15 m.

(You can learn a lot from nbcolympics.com.)

[Howzit]

Even backstrokers get to stop their stroke, backflip, push off the wall, and dolphin-kick for as long as they want. If you are a tremendous dolphin-kicker, you can compete in any stroke.

Not to mention the fact that they are laying on their backs!!!

C'mon! Should an olympic sport involve reclining?!?!?

Don't even get me started on the demerits and olympic unworthiness of stroking breasts.

[Curly Bill]

C'mon! Should an olympic sport involve reclining?!?!?


Of course it should, I can't think of many things that should not involve reclining. :D

[PhilTLL]

Anyway, it's just an opinion. Don't confuse opinion with logic. It is neither logical or illogical.

Your opinion can be based on logic and facts...or not.

Also,
Hate to be the one to inform you that we're not monkeys or apes.

Ever met your close relatives, family Hominidae, subfamilies Homininae and Ponginae? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_ape)

[soonerboomer93]

Oh, yeah. I forgot about that dolphin-kick thing! These swimmers don't even do a stroke for 1/4 of the race! They get to stay underwater for as long as they want at the start and on turns.

Even backstrokers get to stop their stroke, backflip, push off the wall, and dolphin-kick for as long as they want. If you are a tremendous dolphin-kicker, you can compete in any stroke.

not the breast stroke

dolphin-kicking would get them dq'd

infact, the can only to 1 pull under water

[Frozen Sooner]

Hate to be the one to inform you that we're not monkeys or apes. As far as I know humans haven't swung from vines since we evolved from other primates. We evolved as hunter/gatherers and that generally didn't involve swinging through trees. It did involve running though.

Maybe you've watched too many Tarzan movies.

Hate to be the one to inform you, but our closes genetic relative is a brachiate. The massive back problems humans develop indicate pretty conclusively that we were not really evolved to go around on two legs that well.

But hey, it's my opinion, so I don't actually need logic or anything.

[Penguin]

Not to mention the fact that they are laying on their backs!!!

C'mon! Should an olympic sport involve reclining?!?!?


http://common.csnstores.com/common/products/SPS/SPS1229_l.jpg

Don't forget to kick!!!!!!

[StoopTroup]

Hey...

Did you all hear about this Phelps Kid.

He's freaking amazing.

Evidently he's already won 7 gold medals and he's trying to get an eight tonight.

This is gonna be cool I think.

You probably should watch it IMO.

[tommieharris91]

Hey...

Did you all hear about this Phelps Kid.

He's freaking amazing.

Evidently he's already won 7 gold medals and he's trying to get an eight tonight.

This is gonna be cool I think.

You probably should watch it IMO.

Who's Phelps? All I ever hear about on TV is this Favre guy. Apparently he's a good quarterback.

[mdklatt]

Who's Phelps?

That's Debbie's son. Certainly you know all about Debbie Phelps?

[StoopTroup]

Is she hawt?

[mdklatt]

Is she hawt?

NO.

[mdklatt]

I bet Mark Spitz could have won another gold if that pornstache wasn't holding him back.

[Howzit]

Evidently he's already won 7 gold medals and he's trying to get an eight tonight.


Yeah, but it's only in swimming, so it gets an asterisk.

[StoopTroup]

Amazing.

[VeeJay]

Good on dem boys.

[JohnnyMack]

Howzit is a better swimmer than this Phelps jerk.

[StoopTroup]

Cool to see Ravens Fans finally get excited.

Kind of reminds me of whornfans when they start talking about their swim trophies. :D

[Howzit]

Howzit is a better swimmer than this Phelps jerk.

No, but I have more posts. That has to count for something, right?

[Blue]

Hate to be the one to inform you, but our closes genetic relative is a brachiate. The massive back problems humans develop indicate pretty conclusively that we were not really evolved to go around on two legs that well.

But hey, it's my opinion, so I don't actually need logic or anything.

And since my mom was a koala and my dad a sloth, I'm a slow witted vegetarian.

That's a pretty big leap there, Mike. I'm gonna keep believing in that Bible.

Way to go Phelps, BTW.

[Blue]

Is she hawt?

Natalie Coughlin? Yes.

http://assets.espn.go.com/media/pg2/2002/1105/photo/g_coughlin_i.jpg

[Howzit]

Way to go Phelps, BTW.

:les: IT'S JUST SWIMMING!!!!11





:mack:

[JohnnyMack]

That's a pretty big leap there, Mike. I'm gonna keep believing in that Bible.



Speaking of not needing logic.

[jkjsooner]

Hate to be the one to inform you, but our closes genetic relative is a brachiate. The massive back problems humans develop indicate pretty conclusively that we were not really evolved to go around on two legs that well.

But hey, it's my opinion, so I don't actually need logic or anything.

Two points:

1. It's a close relative not us. There is a big difference. I'm talking about humans not their close relatives.

2. My point earlier was basically an expression of opinion and involved no logical deductions or conclusion. On the other hand, your comment here is logically flawed because you are trying to draw conclusions on us being a brachiate (we should have tree swinging events) whereas we have evolved significantly from that point. (And, yes, I know we share something like 98% of the genes with other primates but that 2% - or whatever it is - is very different.)

[JohnnyMack]

Regardless of how the rules are put in place, he's the most accomplished champion in the history of the modern olympic.

The concept of "best" is purely subjective..

[picasso]

Speaking of not needing logic.

yes, the bible has no logic and especially all of those brilliant theologians. Like say Dietrich Bonhoeffer. Yeah, stupid people.

Thanks for your input Mack. and for hijacking a thread. I love this South Oval place these days.

[JohnnyMack]

yes, the bible has no logic and especially all of those brilliant theologians. Like say Dietrich Bonhoeffer. Yeah, stupid people.

Thanks for your input Mack. and for hijacking a thread. I love this South Oval place these days.

Don't get yer panties in a twist, I didnt say the bible had NO logic in it.

And I didnt start the threadjack, Blue did.

[picasso]

Don't get yer panties in a twist, I didnt say the bible had NO logic in it.

And I didnt start the threadjack, Blue did.

I don't wear panties biotch.

[JohnnyMack]

:les:Commando!!!!!

[Blue]

Speaking of not needing logic.

That's fine you'd like to believe we "evolved" from mud JM, but I just thought I'd throw in it's still a THEORY and not everyone buys it.

[Blue]

And Yay Phelps!

[GottaHavePride]

That's fine you'd like to believe we "evolved" from mud JM, but I just thought I'd throw in it's still a THEORY and not everyone buys it.

Just saying, but "theory" is a very misunderstood word when people start talking about science.



Some scientific explanations are so well established that no new evidence is likely to alter them. The explanation becomes a scientific theory. In everyday language a theory means a hunch or speculation. Not so in science. In science, the word theory refers to a comprehensive explanation of an important feature of nature that is supported by many facts gathered over time. Theories also allow scientists to make predictions about as yet unobserved phenomena.

[Ike]

gravity is also still a theory...

[Frozen Sooner]

gravity is also still a theory...

As is General Relativity.

The point, however, wasn't to get into a debate about evolution. Simply to point out that humans aren't really all that well evolved as runners and bear many traits that point towards brachiation as a more natural method of locomotion. Grasping hands out front should have told you.

[badger]

wtf is going on with this thread... no way I'm gonna read pages 1-7 to see how the topic got to gravity as a theory...

YAY PHELPS!

Now... back in your fish tank until 2012! :D

[Blue]

Prove to me I came from muck and I'll believe it. Gravity is not evolution. It's a theory until it's proven a fact.

[GottaHavePride]

Prove to me I came from muck and I'll believe it.

Now, see, if I say prove to me I was created by God and I'll believe it, you'd just get offended.

[olevetonahill]

Now, see, if I say prove to me I was created by God and I'll believe it, you'd just get offended.

Prove it. :D

[PhilTLL]

Prove to me I came from muck and I'll believe it. Gravity is not evolution. It's a theory until it's proven a fact.

I'm fairly sure "fact" and "theory" don't mean what they think you do. At least in science. A good place to start would be this article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_as_theory_and_fact), and this one (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objections_to_evolution). But then again, you seem like you already have decided you can't be convinced, so I don't really see the point.

[Blue]

Now, see, if I say prove to me I was created by God and I'll believe it, you'd just get offended.

I haven't gotten offended yet. Just wanted to relay another point of view. I bet if you made a pole here on Sf's 75% of posters would side with creationism yet the minority opinion here rules the roost b/c nobody wants to get into it with the resident "rational" thinkers that try to make believers look like gullible idiots at every turn.

[Blue]

I'm fairly sure "fact" and "theory" don't mean what they think you do. At least in science. A good place to start would be this article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_as_theory_and_fact), and this one (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objections_to_evolution). But then again, you seem like you already have decided you can't be convinced, so I don't really see the point.

You're right. I won't change my mind.

[GottaHavePride]

I haven't gotten offended yet. Just wanted to relay another point of view. I bet if you made a pole here on Sf's 75% of posters would side with creationism yet the minority opinion here rules the roost b/c nobody wants to get into it with the resident "rational" thinkers that try to make believers look like gullible idiots at every turn.

I also don't think believing in evolution and creationism are incompatible - and I think most scientists probably agree.

I mean, why is it difficult to believe that God could create life that had the capability to adapt to changing conditions and improve itself slowly over time? That, to me, seems to put a lot more intelligence in Intelligent Design. It's the difference between God saying "Wait, so Dinosaur 3.11 sucks? Hang on till next millenium, I'm coming out with Human 1.0" and God saying "OK, here's life. Just wait until you see what this can do."




WOOOOOOO MICHAEL PHELPS!

[PhilTLL]

I haven't gotten offended yet. Just wanted to relay another point of view. I bet if you made a pole here on Sf's 75% of posters would side with creationism yet the minority opinion here rules the roost b/c nobody wants to get into it with the resident "rational" thinkers that try to make believers look like gullible idiots at every turn.

Boo-hoo. You're so oppressed. Really, I'm crying. So it seems like what you're saying is that no one wants to advocate their (majority) opinion because...uh...the other side always makes it look foolish? That's kind of self-defeating. And gee, I wonder why it always turns out so poorly...?

[Blue]

Boo-hoo. You're so oppressed. Really, I'm crying. So it seems like what you're saying is that no one wants to advocate their (majority) opinion because...uh...the other side always makes it look foolish? That's kind of self-defeating. And gee, I wonder why it always turns out so poorly...?


Bite me.

[Howzit]

I don't wear panties biotch.

Go on...

[Penguin]

Man, this is getting good. :pop:

[StormySooner-IN]

:mad: STFU:mad: :mad:




sorry...its just.....come on...you guys.....

:eek:

[tommieharris91]

:mad: STFU:mad: :mad:




sorry...its just.....come on...you guys.....

:eek:

**** off dip ****

I believe that belongs in this thread.

And this is coming real soon.
http://www.grand-illusions.com/acatalog/puzzle_lock.jpg

[RacerX]

Good job Penguin!

[ousoonerfan]

Did anyone see Phelps on the Today show this morning? During the interview someone was waving a large OU flag in the background. Awesome.

[picasso]

ok, I gotta agree I hope his story is over now. now let's bitch about the Chinese getting stroked in the judging.

[jkjsooner]

I just want to share my last word that Phelps is one kick butt athlete.

[Lott's Bandana]

Let's count the swimming events:
Freestyle
50m for men & women
100m for men & women
200m for men & women
400m for men & women
800m for women
1500m for men

Backstroke
100m for men & women
200m for men & women

Breaststroke
100m for men & women
200m for men & women

Butterfly
100m for men & women
200m for men & women

Individual medley
200m for men & women
400m for men & women

Freestyle relay
4×100m for men & women
4×200m for men & women

Medley relay
4×100m for men & women

Marathon
10km for men & women


By my count, that 17 men's events! No wonder only swimmers are the ones that can get 8 medals. I used to think track & field had too many medals, but even Carl Lewis had to add long-jumping to get his medal count up.

What you posted there is the normal schedule of events for a typical open-class swim meet, conducted in towns all over the country and all over the world.

The Olympics' swimming events are simply a highest-kind swim meet embedded into a larger pool of other sporting events and frankly, "games".

This isn't any different from Gymnastics, Track and Field, even Water Polo, Equestrian, Sailing, etc...all are typical meet/tournament formats.

It really isn't the amount of medals Phelps won, or the opportunity for him to win those medals. The reason peeps are calling him the greatest Olympian is the way he completely dominated his Olympic discipline, unlike very few others have in any other discipline. The Heidens were almost sure wins when they competed. The Soviets in Ice Hockey, but that is a team sport...

A great comparison in an earlier post: Olympic All-Around Champion wins each individual discipline, plus leads his/her team to the team gold. That is on the level of what Phelps has accomplished...almost twice.

Hasn't been done before, likely wont' be done again.

Michael Phelps > Tulsa

[BillyBall]

He kicks ***, no doubt...

But does anyone else think he may be Gheorghe Muresan's love child?