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JohnnyMack
8/3/2008, 03:30 PM
Obama hasn't been able to build a lead against a weak opponent that has only marginal support from his base. The summer political doldrums are upon us and the olympics are about to steal the media spotlight for the weeks leading up to the convention. HRC could seal Obamas quest to become potus and give the dems a shot at locking up the white house for 16 years. The vp choices that have been floated aren't that interesting. I predict BHO does some serious posturing and floats plenty of red herrings before he walks onto the stage of the convention and announces his VP selection. The crowd simtaneously reaches climax, BHO sells his soul to the devil and the republicans collectively **** their pants.

Thoughts?

SanJoaquinSooner
8/3/2008, 03:31 PM
I've read the idea of Senator Clinton on the ticket has passed, with no likely chance.

Okla-homey
8/3/2008, 03:51 PM
Let's put it this way. The Donks are likely going to die of a self-inflicted wound (again). They have a bizarre pattern of too often choosing a guy that simply can't be abided in fly-over country. Like Dana Garvey says, its almost as if they nominated an unknown named Charles Manson Hitler.;) And this cult of personality thing appears to be having some unintended consequences in terms of stirring up people's resentment.

You can't win the WH by carrying CA and the NE US. That was the thing about WJC, aside from the fact he was a stupendous politician, the guy resonated with Jim Bob and Mary Sue because he had something in common with them. IOW, he didn't have to concede the hillbilly vote.

If the DNC nominated a moderate, they probably could have walked away with this thing, just as they could have beaten W last time with someone who wasn't a senator from Massachusetts who looks like Herman Munster and who has a wierd wife from Upper Slobovia.

I'm now of the opinion, based on JSM's feckless campaigning, if HRC had won, and chosen BHO as her VP, they probably would have won too. As it stands, nadda. 'Twer it not so, BHO would have opened up a commanding lead by now.

JohnnyMack
8/3/2008, 03:53 PM
that's my point.

Okla-homey
8/3/2008, 04:08 PM
that's my point.

Not with BHO at the top of the ticket.

tommieharris91
8/3/2008, 04:09 PM
It would make my decision easy.

badger
8/3/2008, 04:32 PM
Sorry, Hill-dawg, but you are not the next VP (and because Barack will have angered many religion/gun clinging enemies, will not be made the next president after the inevitable assassination attempt).

My guess is that he will recruit a governor from an important swing state like Virginia or Indiana. Both have been listed as possibilities. New York, where Chill Hill is now listed as a resident (we all know better), will be Democratic no matter what, so Clinary Hillham Rodinton will have nothing to offer, other than baggage.

JohnnyMack
8/3/2008, 04:48 PM
Not with BHO at the top of the ticket.

Sorry , I was talking to sjs, didnt see your post.

Harry Beanbag
8/3/2008, 05:05 PM
The true Clinton haters will say that Barack would be signing his own death warrant if he chooses Hillary. :) ;)

r5TPsooner
8/3/2008, 05:14 PM
Obama hasn't been able to build a lead against a weak opponent that has only marginal support from his base. The summer political doldrums are upon us and the olympics are about to steal the media spotlight for the weeks leading up to the convention. HRC could seal Obamas quest to become potus and give the dems a shot at locking up the white house for 16 years. The vp choices that have been floated aren't that interesting. I predict BHO does some serious posturing and floats plenty of red herrings before he walks onto the stage of the convention and announces his VP selection. The crowd simtaneously reaches climax, BHO sells his soul to the devil and the republicans collectively **** their pants.

Thoughts?

He's unable to build a lead because he doesn't stand for anything.

JohnnyMack
8/3/2008, 05:21 PM
How many Obama voters would defect to McCain?

How many McCain voters would defect to Obama?

JohnnyMack
8/3/2008, 05:22 PM
He's unable to build a lead because he doesn't stand for anything.

Wrong subject Einstein.

olevetonahill
8/3/2008, 05:25 PM
How many Obama voters would defect to McCain?

How many McCain voters would defect to Obama?

There will Be a Few who Defect from BHO
I dont see any JSM Supporters going the other way.

r5TPsooner
8/3/2008, 05:26 PM
Wrong subject Einstein.

So you agree that Obama stands for nothing. You're actually smarter than I thought you were.

soonersn20xx
8/3/2008, 09:53 PM
He's unable to build a lead because he doesn't stand for anything.
With all due respect r5, that sounds like hollow political rhetoric. Obama's positions for the most part are there if you are listening. Now you can disagree with them, but he does stand for things.

As far as why Obama hasn't been able to pull away from a weak opponent like McCain is simple.............racism.

olevetonahill
8/3/2008, 10:04 PM
With all due respect r5, that sounds like hallow political rhetoric. Obama's positions for the most part are there if you are listening. Now you can disagree with them, but he does stand for things.

As far as why Obama hasn't been able to pull away from a weak opponent like McCain is simple.............racism.

Racism Has Nothing to do with it
Brack has blown a 9 point pole lead in 2 weeks or so
I predict he will continue the slide.

Soonerus
8/3/2008, 10:07 PM
Racism Has Nothing to do with it
Brack has blown a 9 point pole lead in 2 weeks or so
I predict he will continue the slide.

I concur...

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 10:08 PM
With all due respect r5, that sounds like hallow political rhetoric. Obama's positions for the most part are there if you are listening. Now you can disagree with them, but he does stand for things.

As far as why Obama hasn't been able to pull away from a weak opponent like McCain is simple.............racism.

Would you then so enlighten us o' wise one?

The more I think about that the more it make me laugh: "he does stand for things." Things? He stands for "things" As opposed to what? Non-things?

soonersn20xx
8/3/2008, 10:08 PM
You mean those polls? I don't pay any attention to them, I don't think they are accurate and might even be manipulated to push a psychological perception by their results.

Soonerus
8/3/2008, 10:10 PM
You mean those polls? I don't pay any attention to them, I don't think they are accurate and might even be manipulated to push a psychological perception by their results.

BAWHAHAHAHAHA...

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 10:11 PM
BAWHAHAHAHAHA...

Exactly, because if anything the polls overestimate the amount of support that Brack enjoys.

soonersn20xx
8/3/2008, 10:11 PM
Would you then so enlighten us o' wise one?
Here you go my dear friend, http://www.barackobama.com/issues/ ;)

King Crimson
8/3/2008, 10:12 PM
i don't think Hillary helps Obama at all. let alone trust her.

at least in principle. she's meaner than a junkyard dog.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 10:13 PM
Here you go my dear friend, http://www.barackobama.com/issues/ ;)

Brack's talking points. No thanks.

JohnnyMack
8/3/2008, 10:13 PM
Hey dickheads, go talk in circles somewhere else.

I'm here to discuss my BHO going all Vince McMahon on the DNC theory. Can't you see the strobe lights spinning, the fireworks, the fog machines belching out smoke as he introduces the next Vice President of the United States!!! and the crowd goes nuts and then I throw up in my mouth a little bit and wash the bile back down with a stiff drink.

KC, you seem to be staying on point, you may remain in my thread.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 10:14 PM
i don't think Hillary helps Obama at all. let alone trust her.

at least in principle. she's meaner than a junkyard dog.

I don't think she helps either, she brings more baggage than I think his skinny little shoulders can carry.

...and he's accumulating more and more of his own baggage to shoulder.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 10:17 PM
Hey dickheads, go talk in circles somewhere else.

They locked our Jarboe thread, where are we gonna go? ;)


...and it's dickwheels to you. :cool:

soonersn20xx
8/3/2008, 10:19 PM
I believe Hillary's husband Bill actually makes her a tougher choice as far as "the baggage" issue. She surprised me with her ability to touch base with lower income rural like folks, which IMO is Obama's weakest link.

Since McCain has turned his campaign over to the Karl Rove minions two weeks ago, the negative attacks have had their success more than Obama doing anything wrong. So assuming Obama is going to wait till after the Olympics to announce his VP, he should have her on the short list for now.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 10:23 PM
I believe Hillary's husband Bill actually makes her a tougher choice as far as "the baggage" issue. She surprised me with her ability to touch base with lower income rural like folks, which IMO is Obama's weakest link.


Agreed on the Bill issue.

On touching base with the lower income rural folks, remember she did this when their other option was Obama. She doesn't win, or bring to the donk ticket as VP, all those same folks when their other option is McCain.

King Crimson
8/3/2008, 10:32 PM
Agreed on the Bill issue.

On touching base with the lower income rural folks, remember she did this when their other option was Obama. She doesn't win, or bring to the donk ticket as VP, all those same folks when their other option is McCain.

you are setting yourself up here, so rural dems (voted in the primaries) who voted for Hillary are now going to cross party lines to vote for McCain?

why? because they are newly minted "moderates"?

soonersn20xx
8/3/2008, 10:36 PM
Agreed on the Bill issue.

On touching base with the lower income rural folks, remember she did this when their other option was Obama. She doesn't win, or bring to the donk ticket as VP, all those same folks when their other option is McCain.

What is so fantastically perplexing is that these lower income rural folks lives would be better off economically with Obama as president. If you make 250,000 and above then McCain would be your choice, if you want to narrow the debate into a income class analysis.

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 10:41 PM
Brack's talking points. No thanks.

That's quite an awesome worldview.

"He doesn't have any stands on the issues!"

"Here's a link to his stands on the issues."

"Those are just his talking points!"


And to address the original issue:

No. Hillary will not be the VP pick.

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 10:42 PM
you are setting yourself up here, so rural dems (voted in the primaries) who voted for Hillary are now going to cross party lines to vote for McCain?

why? because they are newly minted "moderates"?

I think it's pretty obvious from the interviews that were published at the time of the West Virginia primaries why some rural Democrats won't vote for Obama.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 10:43 PM
you are setting yourself up here, so rural dems (voted in the primaries) who voted for Hillary are now going to cross party lines to vote for McCain?

why? because they are newly minted "moderates"?

I think if Brack is at the top of the ticket many of them would cross over, or not turn out. I don't think rural dems, at least not a great many of them are going to identify with Brack and vice versa, remember the whole bitter, Bible-clinging, gun owner thing? I don't think rural dems like being talked down to anymore then anyone else does.

King Crimson
8/3/2008, 10:45 PM
I think it's pretty obvious from the interviews that were published at the time of the West Virginia primaries why some rural Democrats won't vote for Obama.

that's partially the set-up. and i suspect why HRC had one of her largest margins of victory in the Sooner state.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 10:46 PM
That's quite an awesome worldview.

"He doesn't have any stands on the issues!"

"Here's a link to his stands on the issues."

"Those are just his talking points!"

I didn't want to read about CHANGE...

....or airing up my tires.

soonersn20xx
8/3/2008, 10:52 PM
That's quite an awesome worldview.

"He doesn't have any stands on the issues!"

"Here's a link to his stands on the issues."

"Those are just his talking points!"


And to address the original issue:

No. Hillary will not be the VP pick.

Well I was hoping to at least disspell this claim that Obama doesn't stand for anything, you hear this on right-wing radio and TV and all it accomplishes is no serious and intellectual debate.

Such broad and false accusations prevent us from politically reaching common goals regardless of which party you might lean towards. If you think about it, maybe since McCain can't win on a debate on the issues he has resorted to this character assassination campaign.

I am not a messiah following Obama supporter, I do not agree with everyone of his positions. But on the whole I find less in common with McCain.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 10:54 PM
If you think about it, maybe since McCain can't win on a debate on the issues he has resorted to this character assassination campaign.
.

Then why want Obama debate him?

soonersn20xx
8/3/2008, 11:01 PM
Then why want Obama debate him?

I don't agree with this political strategy, but this is the reason:

Obama's reversal on town hall debates is part of a play-it-safe strategy he's adopted since claiming the nomination and grabbing a lead in national polls. Advisers to the Illinois senator, speaking on condition of anonymity because they are not authorized to discuss strategy, say Obama is reluctant to take chances or give McCain a high-profile stage now that Obama's the front-runner. Source - http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080802/ap_on_el_pr/presidential_debates

Because I believe politics is like football, what happens every time you go into a prevent defense?

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 11:01 PM
Well I was hoping to at least disspell this claim that Obama doesn't stand for anything, you hear this on right-wing radio and TV and all it accomplishes is no serious and intellectual debate.

Such broad and false accusations prevent us from politically reaching common goals regardless of which party you might lean towards. If you think about it, maybe since McCain can't win on a debate on the issues he has resorted to this character assassination campaign.

I am not a messiah following Obama supporter, I do not agree with everyone of his positions. But on the whole I find less in common with McCain.

20xx, there are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Some people want to be believe that Sen. Obama has no stand on the issues, so will ignore anything to the contrary.

King Crimson
8/3/2008, 11:07 PM
Then why want Obama debate him?

he will. though, "debate" is a strong word for what we call these media events.

it's conventional strategy for the frontrunner to play it off/not take chances....dictate the pace of the game.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:09 PM
20xx, there are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Some people want to be believe that Sen. Obama has no stand on the issues, so will ignore anything to the contrary.

Oh snap! I feel so chastised! :rolleyes:

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:10 PM
he will. though, "debate" is a strong word for what we call these media events.

it's conventional strategy for the frontrunner to play it off/not take chances....dictate the pace of the game.

I agree, but I thought it funny 20xxx said McCain couldn't win a debate on the issues, yet Brack is so far the one who has refused.

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 11:11 PM
Oh snap! I feel so chastised! :rolleyes:

Why don't you just post "Change" in big fonts a few times? I'm sure you'll feel better.

You've been given a direct link to Senator Obama's positions on several issues, yet you've refused to look at them, instead choosing to repeat that he doesn't have any stands on the issues. That sounds an awful lot like willful ignorance.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:13 PM
Bracks stand on the issues:
1. air in tires
2. raise taxes
3. guns are bad

What'd I miss?

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:15 PM
Why don't you just post "Change" in big fonts a few times? I'm sure you'll feel better.

You've been given a direct link to Senator Obama's positions on several issues, yet you've refused to look at them, instead choosing to repeat that he doesn't have any stands on the issues. That sounds an awful lot like willful ignorance.

Seen it before, it's typical political flowery rhetoric that any politician might put out, McCain included, and which really isn't worth the time it would take to glance over it again.

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 11:16 PM
Bracks stand on the issues:
1. air in tires
2. raise taxes
3. guns are bad

What'd I miss?

Oh, well, in that case:

McCain's stand on the issues:

1. We will be sending troops to the Iraq-Pakistan Border, whether they want them or not.
2. The DREAM Act is good or bad, depending on who I'm talking to.
3. My opponent is popular.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:16 PM
Why don't you just post "Change" in big fonts a few times? I'm sure you'll feel better.

You've been given a direct link to Senator Obama's positions on several issues, yet you've refused to look at them, instead choosing to repeat that he doesn't have any stands on the issues. That sounds an awful lot like willful ignorance.

...and CHANGE is Brack's pet word, it should be embraced by all.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:16 PM
Oh, well, in that case:

McCain's stand on the issues:

1. We will be sending troops to the Iraq-Pakistan Border, whether they want them or not.
2. The DREAM Act is good or bad, depending on who I'm talking to.
3. My opponent is popular.

You can slam McCain all you want, I'm not invested in him at all.

...He's just the person running opposite Brack.

soonersn20xx
8/3/2008, 11:17 PM
Bracks stand on the issues:
1. air in tires - Conservation
2. raise taxes - on people who make $250,000 b/c we need to pay for the cost of this war ourselves instead of borrowing from our grandchildren.
3. guns are bad - criminals with guns are bad, you will still be able to go Dove hunting this fall.(One thing I do miss about Oklahoma btw)


FIXED! :P

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:18 PM
FIXED! :P

You keep believeing he'd only raise taxes on those earning over $250,000.

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 11:19 PM
Seen it before, it's typical political flowery rhetoric that any politician might put out, McCain included, and which really isn't worth the time it would take to glance over it again.

QED.

So what, exactly, would it take for you to concede that Obama has a stand on the issues?

He's written two books, one of which extensively details his political beliefs and was written before he decided to run for President. Clarification: both were written before he decided to run for President. One details his political beliefs and aspirations extensively.

soonersn20xx
8/3/2008, 11:22 PM
You keep believeing he'd only raise taxes on those earning over $250,000.
Well, according to his own words..........that is his stand on this issue. You are making conjecture that he will do otherwise.

That is like me saying that McCain won't institute a draft b/c he said so, yet he wants to remain in Iraq for 100 years.........which is not feasible without one.:rolleyes:

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 11:22 PM
...and CHANGE is Brack's pet word, it should be embraced by all.

The economy's in the ****ter, we're involved in building a nation that doesn't want us there, gas has gone up 400%+ in the last eight years...

Yeah, change is needed. Good thing that one of the candidates this year has a specific plan for change which he extensively details. The other seems to think there's nothing wrong and that the problems with the economy are all in our head.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:27 PM
QED.

So what, exactly, would it take for you to concede that Obama has a stand on the issues?

He's written two books, one of which extensively details his political beliefs and was written before he decided to run for President. Clarification: both were written before he decided to run for President. One details his political beliefs and aspirations extensively.

It would help if his stand on anything didn't CHANGE with the weather. I think he's a political machine that says what is needed when needed to get elected. I could read 99 books he wrote on what he thinks and still say he has no stand because I think his "stands" are mere political ploys. In short: an empty suit.

I don't doubt he has broad ideas on things: like I said: higher taxes, guns are bad, clean environment, so on and so on...but real genuine stands? I think with him it depends on what is politically expedient.

I'd also like more detail on how he plans on doing any of his stuff, other then saying we have to CHANGE.

...and again, if you want to knock McCain on these same things go ahead, I don't think he's all that either.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:28 PM
Well, according to his own words..........that is his stand on this issue. You are making conjecture that he will do otherwise.



I have been around a few years. I have little doubt he will do otherwise. Idealism is good though, Brack sure is making a living off of it.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:30 PM
The economy's in the ****ter, we're involved in building a nation that doesn't want us there, gas has gone up 400%+ in the last eight years...

Yeah, change is needed. Good thing that one of the candidates this year has a specific plan for change which he extensively details. The other seems to think there's nothing wrong and that the problems with the economy are all in our head.

You can slam Bush too, he's an idiot. That doesn't make Brack the savior.

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 11:34 PM
Then unfortunately, Bill, you and I are going to have to agree to disagree, because we're working with different assumptions.

The detail is there, but you've categorically stated that you aren't going to look at it.

I will agree that Obama's stand on some issues have changed or refined. I will also state that some of his policy statements that were consistent with other statements were misreported as inconsistent. I don't necessarily think that changing your mind when new information is presented is a bad thing. For example, I grew up a Washington fan, but changed my mind when OU offered me a boatload of cash. ;)

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 11:37 PM
You can slam Bush too, he's an idiot. That doesn't make Brack the savior.

I've never said that he was. This little cute antic by the anti-Obama people of painting people who support him as religious zealots is pretty childish. I like the guy and happen to agree with a lot of his ideas for getting this country back on track. I don't ascribe any deific qualities to him, and in point of fact I do disagree with him on a couple of issues-most notably on the continuation of faith-based initiatives.

soonersn20xx
8/3/2008, 11:38 PM
You can slam Bush too, he's an idiot. That doesn't make Brack the savior.

Let's bring the debate down to its simplest terms then, in this election "two men will enter, one man leaves". If you have liked the last 8 years, then by all means, McCain is your man. If change is the direction you want to go and your not even sure that this "change" will be for the better but your current circumstances are so lousy you are willing to take that risk. Then Obama is your man.

Call me a gambling man then, I'm rolling the dice with Obama. Good nite and good luck my beloved Sooner bretheren.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:38 PM
Then unfortunately, Bill, you and I are going to have to agree to disagree, because we're working with different assumptions.


This apparently is true.

...and ultimately I could set across a table from Brack for a couple of hours and he could tell me his "stands" and I would leave that talk still not really believing it. I guess you could say I don't trust him or what he says any further then I could throw his wife.

Curly Bill
8/3/2008, 11:40 PM
Let's bring the debate down to its simplest terms then, in this election "two men will enter, one man leaves". If you have liked the last 8 years, then by all means, McCain is your man. If change is the direction you want to go and your not even sure that this "change" will be for the better but your current circumstances are so lousy you are willing to take that risk. Then Obama is your man.

Call me a gambling man then, I'm rolling the dice with Obama. Good nite and good luck my beloved Sooner bretheren.

My current circumstances really aren't so bad.

...and of course I don't think Brack is going to make anything better, but perhaps worse...

...but we could chase this around all evening, so yeah...I'm done.

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 11:43 PM
This apparently is true.

...and ultimately I could set across a table from Brack for a couple of hours and he could tell me his "stands" and I would leave that talk still not really believing it. I guess you could say I don't trust him or what he says any further then I could throw his wife.

And that's what it boils down to. Hey, if you don't trust the guy, that's fine. I accept that as a legitimate reason to not vote for him, though I don't agree with you.

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
8/3/2008, 11:44 PM
You can slam Bush too, he's an idiot. That doesn't make Brack the savior.As if Bush and the republicans are the ones to blame for energy prices being what they are nowadays...GET REAL, MR RICH! Barach and his socialism scares the heck out of many Americans. Hopefully, enough of them to keep his scary a*s out of controlling the free world.

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 11:46 PM
One thing that gives me some hope for the next four years, one way or the other:

I was registering voters door-to-door yesterday. Although we predominantly got McCain supporters (which isn't surprising, my district votes heavily Republican) with the exception of one they were all very cordial and polite and generally said things along the lines of "Although I don't like your candidate, you're doing a good thing."

Frozen Sooner
8/3/2008, 11:47 PM
BOOGA BOOGA!

I thought you didn't like McCain because he's really a socialist.

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
8/4/2008, 12:11 AM
I thought you didn't like McCain because he's really a socialist.You would be right. He's just nowhere as wrong and socialist on so many issues as is Barach. In the end, I prolly will vote for Mccain. If only Obama wasn't so THOROUGHLY objectionable...booga booga!

def_lazer_fc
8/4/2008, 01:11 AM
The economy's in the ****ter, we're involved in building a nation that doesn't want us there, gas has gone up 400%+ in the last eight years...

Yeah, change is needed. Good thing that one of the candidates this year has a specific plan for change which he extensively details. The other seems to think there's nothing wrong and that the problems with the economy are all in our head.

mccain wants to change things and fix all the nation's problems too. the only problem is that he doesn't seem to want to say how, exactly, he'd do that. because as everyone knows, bin laden is an avid cspan watcher. :rolleyes: :D

def_lazer_fc
8/4/2008, 01:14 AM
Then unfortunately, Bill, you and I are going to have to agree to disagree, because we're working with different assumptions.

The detail is there, but you've categorically stated that you aren't going to look at it.

I will agree that Obama's stand on some issues have changed or refined. I will also state that some of his policy statements that were consistent with other statements were misreported as inconsistent. I don't necessarily think that changing your mind when new information is presented is a bad thing. For example, I grew up a Washington fan, but changed my mind when OU offered me a boatload of cash. ;)

flip flopper!!!!

Scott D
8/4/2008, 01:16 AM
mccain wants to change things and fix all the nation's problems too. the only problem is that he doesn't seem to want to say how, exactly, he'd do that. because as everyone knows, bin laden is an avid cspan watcher. :rolleyes: :D

don't forget that he'd say that the immigration issue is a problem on the Cuba-Chile border that needs to be rectified.

Then he'd re-deploy the National Guard to Columbia to search for Elaine Wilder. ;)

Frozen Sooner
8/4/2008, 01:17 AM
don't forget that he'd say that the immigration issue is a problem on the Cuba-Chile border that needs to be rectified.

Then he'd re-deploy the National Guard to Columbia to search for Elaine Wilder. ;)

Have they tried Cartagena?

olevetonahill
8/4/2008, 02:59 AM
They locked our Jarboe thread, where are we gonna go? ;)


...and it's Flying Dickwheels to you. :cool:
Fixed
Dam n am I gonna have make you clean the toilets at our Last meeting

olevetonahill
8/4/2008, 03:04 AM
Well I was hoping to at least disspell this claim that Obama doesn't stand for anything, you hear this on right-wing radio and TV and all it accomplishes is no serious and intellectual debate.

Such broad and false accusations prevent us from politically reaching common goals regardless of which party you might lean towards. If you think about it, maybe since McCain can't win on a debate on the issues he has resorted to this character assassination campaign.

I am not a messiah following Obama supporter, I do not agree with everyone of his positions. But on the whole I find less in common with McCain.

I almost wish I hadnt turned you green :P
Now as Far as Debates Go Brack has completely said NO to a series Of town Hall type Meetings with JSM . How come ?

soonersn20xx
8/4/2008, 08:00 AM
I almost wish I hadnt turned you green :PWell, we can always agree on OU football. :D


Now as Far as Debates Go Brack has completely said NO to a series Of town Hall type Meetings with JSM . How come ?
Answered in post 39 of this thread o great one :) http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2353749&postcount=39

JohnnyMack
8/4/2008, 09:10 AM
Have they tried Cartagena?

He can borrow my little mule!

JohnnyMack
8/4/2008, 09:36 AM
Let's put it this way. The Donks are likely going to die of a self-inflicted wound (again). They have a bizarre pattern of too often choosing a guy that simply can't be abided in fly-over country. Like Dana Garvey says, its almost as if they nominated an unknown named Charles Manson Hitler.;) And this cult of personality thing appears to be having some unintended consequences in terms of stirring up people's resentment.

You can't win the WH by carrying CA and the NE US. That was the thing about WJC, aside from the fact he was a stupendous politician, the guy resonated with Jim Bob and Mary Sue because he had something in common with them. IOW, he didn't have to concede the hillbilly vote.

If the DNC nominated a moderate, they probably could have walked away with this thing, just as they could have beaten W last time with someone who wasn't a senator from Massachusetts who looks like Herman Munster and who has a wierd wife from Upper Slobovia.

I'm now of the opinion, based on JSM's feckless campaigning, if HRC had won, and chosen BHO as her VP, they probably would have won too. As it stands, nadda. 'Twer it not so, BHO would have opened up a commanding lead by now.

Back on topic, I think you'd be making a mistake to offhandedly dismiss HRC's ability to bring the rust belt back comfortably to the D side. I think she'd hit Ohio, Michigan & Pennsylvania HARD and I think that's where this election will be won. The D's in those states love her. Arkansas also again becomes a toss up state. Obama could afford to lose FL if he had HRC sewing up the rust belt while he made inroads in swing states like VA, IN, NV & CO. Regardless of whether or not it happens, it would make for a very interesting (if nauseating) finish.

picasso
8/4/2008, 11:12 AM
Obama hasn't been able to build a lead against a weak opponent that has only marginal support from his base. The summer political doldrums are upon us and the olympics are about to steal the media spotlight for the weeks leading up to the convention. HRC could seal Obamas quest to become potus and give the dems a shot at locking up the white house for 16 years. The vp choices that have been floated aren't that interesting. I predict BHO does some serious posturing and floats plenty of red herrings before he walks onto the stage of the convention and announces his VP selection. The crowd simtaneously reaches climax, BHO sells his soul to the devil and the republicans collectively **** their pants.

Thoughts?

16 years? Are you on drugs or do you always look that way.

r5TPsooner
8/4/2008, 11:17 AM
Why don't you just post "Change" in big fonts a few times? I'm sure you'll feel better.

You've been given a direct link to Senator Obama's positions on several issues, yet you've refused to look at them, instead choosing to repeat that he doesn't have any stands on the issues. That sounds an awful lot like willful ignorance.

Mike, I respect you as a poster but even you can see how transparent and flip floppy this guy is. I know that McCain isn't perfect but at least he won't flip flop every other day to win the Presidency. I honestly believe in my heart that Obama would sell our country down the river if it got him into the White House. While I don't much care for McCain on some political issues, I believe that he would put America first if it meant giving up the White House.

r5TPsooner
8/4/2008, 11:19 AM
I almost wish I hadnt turned you green :P
Now as Far as Debates Go Brack has completely said NO to a series Of town Hall type Meetings with JSM . How come ?

We can remedy that in a heart beat.:D

soonersn20xx
8/4/2008, 11:24 AM
We can remedy that in a heart beat.:D

Nooooooooooooooooooo, as long as I am polite and civil.......we should be ok. Besides, wouldn't you rather respect someone for standing up for their beliefs rather than kissing butt to conform?:D

JohnnyMack
8/4/2008, 11:26 AM
16 years? Are you on drugs or do you always look that way.

Paint chips. I eated them.

Curly Bill
8/4/2008, 11:30 AM
Nooooooooooooooooooo, as long as I am polite and civil.......we should be ok. Besides, wouldn't you rather respect someone for standing up for their beliefs rather than kissing butt to conform?:D


...and don't be so naive as to think it's all the President's fault that gas prices are what they are...:D

Frozen Sooner
8/4/2008, 11:31 AM
Mike, I respect you as a poster but even you can see how transparent and flip floppy this guy is. I know that McCain isn't perfect but at least he won't flip flop every other day to win the Presidency. I honestly believe in my heart that Obama would sell our country down the river if it got him into the White House. While I don't much care for McCain on some political issues, I believe that he would put America first if it meant giving up the White House.

Want to go issue for issue on which guy has "flip-flopped" the most?

picasso
8/4/2008, 11:32 AM
seriously. if you think either party could pull off a run of 16 years you might be a bit retarded.

no offense.

I honestly think if OBL wins he'll be one and out. His 4 years will just produce a better GOP candidate.

Can Obama really run his campaign on higher taxes and spreading the wealth and actually win? No, he just says "change" and acts as if he's a moderate.

I'll be watching golf.

soonersn20xx
8/4/2008, 11:33 AM
Want to go issue for issue on which guy has "flip-flopped" the most?

Oh, this is gonna be good. http://forums.mystery-axiom.com/images/smilies/popcorn1.gif

StoopTroup
8/4/2008, 12:41 PM
I just wanna see the South leave the Union again. ;)

Curly Bill
8/4/2008, 12:46 PM
I just wanna see the South leave the Union again. ;)


I'm in!

StoopTroup
8/4/2008, 12:48 PM
It'll give Homey some new material. :D

Scott D
8/4/2008, 05:40 PM
It'll give Homey some new material. :D

lord knows he needs it.

r5TPsooner
8/4/2008, 05:47 PM
Want to go issue for issue on which guy has "flip-flopped" the most?


As an Independent I think they have both flip flopped like most politicians do. However, most everyone knew that McCain was going to open up drilling, he just happened to see the light before Brack did.

Bracck will do whatever is necessary to win, and quite frankly his raising taxes on middle and upper middle class citizens scare me to death. Not to mention he has ZERO experience in protecting our country from the bad guys.

Of course, if Brack ever showed up to vote once in awhile in the Senate, we'd know which way his ears leaned.:D

Scott D
8/4/2008, 05:55 PM
I passed a billboard this morning. It said "Help Rebuild America with John McCain."

Now, if McCain says America isn't broken, then isn't the billboard lying?

soonersn20xx
8/4/2008, 05:55 PM
Bracck will do whatever is necessary to win, and quite frankly his raising taxes on middle and upper middle class citizens scare me to death. Not to mention he has ZERO experience in protecting our country from the bad guys.:D

We all know that crashing 5 jet planes and being captured gives you God-like insight into fighting terrorism.:rolleyes:


Of course, if Brack ever showed up to vote once in awhile in the Senate, we'd know which way his ears leaned.:DPlease stop spreading misinformation or at least do a fact check before posting such bogus information kind sir. McCain leads in missed Senate votes :D - http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/110/senate/vote-missers/

Harry Beanbag
8/4/2008, 05:58 PM
Besides, wouldn't you rather respect someone for standing up for their beliefs rather than kissing butt to get elected?:D


Yep.

mdklatt
8/4/2008, 07:05 PM
I know that McCain isn't perfect but at least he won't flip flop every other day to win the Presidency.

Oh wow, where have you been? I'm not even really paying attention, and I know that McCain has more flip-flops than a sorority house.

McCain (two years ago): I oppose Bush's tax cuts on the wealthy.

McCain (two weeks ago): I will not raise taxes on the wealthy!

McCain (two days ago): Raising taxes on the wealthy wouldn't be my first choice....

mdklatt
8/4/2008, 07:06 PM
Bracck will do whatever is necessary to win, and quite frankly his raising taxes on middle and upper middle class citizens scare me to death.

$250,000/year = NOT middle class

r5TPsooner
8/4/2008, 07:42 PM
$250,000/year = NOT middle class

If you believe that bunch oh horse **** I have some ocean front property in Arizona.:rolleyes:

r5TPsooner
8/4/2008, 07:44 PM
$250,000/year = NOT middle class

jealous? BTW, those folks that make $250,000 year.... are mostly small business owners that EMPLOY American citizens. Ya know, it like, gives em jobs and health care and stuff.:rolleyes:

If you think Bracks only gonna tax those making 250k or more.... you're really drinking the big eared Kool-Aid.

olevetonahill
8/4/2008, 07:54 PM
We all know that crashing 5 jet planes and being captured gives you God-like insight into fighting terrorism.:rolleyes:

Please stop spreading misinformation or at least do a fact check before posting such bogus information kind sir. McCain leads in missed Senate votes :D - http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/110/senate/vote-missers/

BY just using a Little common sense it satn to reason thatJSM has Missed More votes than your Boy
see Hes Been in the Senate a lot Longer:rolleyes:

Frozen Sooner
8/4/2008, 07:55 PM
BY just using a Little common sense it satn to reason thatJSM has Missed More votes than your Boy
see Hes Been in the Senate a lot Longer:rolleyes:

Of course, by actually reading the link provided, you'd know that they were talking about the 110th Congress-ie, just this year.

soonersn20xx
8/4/2008, 08:00 PM
Of course, by actually reading the link provided, you'd know that they were talking about the 110th Congress-ie, just this year.

http://forums.mystery-axiom.com/images/smilies/owned.gif Just kidding big O :P

olevetonahill
8/4/2008, 08:03 PM
Of course, by actually reading the link provided, you'd know that they were talking about the 110th Congress-ie, just this year.

Except Im not gonna read every link In every Post in these threads . Are you ? :rolleyes:

Frozen Sooner
8/4/2008, 08:13 PM
Except Im not gonna read every link In every Post in these threads . Are you ? :rolleyes:

I generally try to before I comment on the content of them.

olevetonahill
8/4/2008, 08:16 PM
I generally try to before I comment on the content of them.

I commented On His comment Not his Linky

mdklatt
8/4/2008, 08:34 PM
If you believe that bunch oh horse ****

$250,000/year is well into the top 5% of all wage earners. I don't have a concrete definition of rich, but that is certainly not anywhere close to "middle".

mdklatt
8/4/2008, 08:40 PM
jealous?

Overcompensating?



BTW, those folks that make $250,000 year.... are mostly small business owners that EMPLOY American citizens

Well good for them. Now how is raising their personal SS tax going to effect their business?





If you think Bracks only gonna tax those making 250k or more.... you're really drinking the big eared Kool-Aid.

Do you think any of the promises either candidate makes are going to actually come to fruition?

olevetonahill
8/4/2008, 08:43 PM
Overcompensating?



Well good for them. Now how is raising their personal SS tax going to effect their business?





Do you think any of the promises either candidate makes are going to actually come to fruition?

So If they Both Lying who we supposed to vote for ? :confused:

soonersn20xx
8/4/2008, 08:50 PM
So If they Both Lying who we supposed to vote for ? :confused:
Good question, the answer is......who will lie the least and about what.

olevetonahill
8/4/2008, 08:52 PM
Good question, the answer is......who will lie the least and about what.

I'm just gonna vote for the One I believe will Help us keep the terrorist over there and Keep Iran from getting that loaded gun .
just MY .02

mdklatt
8/4/2008, 08:55 PM
So If they Both Lying who we supposed to vote for ? :confused:

NEITHER. Of course, all politicians lie to get elected, so that's not much of a solution is it? Don't vote against one of 'em just because the other one is lying--how about that? Whatever criteria you use, at least make sure they're logically consistent.

Don't want to vote for Obama because he doesn't wear a flag pin? Fine, at least that's true. Same goes for him being black. Or being born in Hawaii (as long as you recognize that he's a citizen). I don't think those are valid reasons not to vote for him, but at least it's just a difference of opinion and not a distortion of the facts. Fact: McCain is as big of a flip-flopper as Obama (and I don't think that's always a bad thing, for the record.)

olevetonahill
8/4/2008, 09:01 PM
Since I'm fairly conservative On most subjects
pretty Lib on a few
I'm gonna vote for the Dude what I think will do the Best Job
And Be so Damn glad when the Season starts and the Politics end .
Its Like this every elction year Peeps going after each others throats
:pop:
I usually stay outta Poli threads cept come in stir **** up then sit back and watch:D

mdklatt
8/4/2008, 09:13 PM
I'm gonna vote for the Dude what I think will do the Best Job


That sounds like the best policy. Congress is going to have as much to say about what gets done as the president, so competence in general is probably more important than specific positions. In other words, don't vote for the dumbass. I don't think either McCain or Obama is a dumbass, but I do worry that McCain is turning into a crazy old coot, and he was already halfway there in 2000.

olevetonahill
8/4/2008, 09:15 PM
You Crazy old Coot Like its a Bad thing :eek:

mdklatt
8/4/2008, 09:18 PM
You Crazy old Coot Like its a Bad thing :eek:

:D

r5TPsooner
8/4/2008, 09:58 PM
Overcompensating?



Well good for them. Now how is raising their personal SS tax going to effect their business?





Do you think any of the promises either candidate makes are going to actually come to fruition?


How much do you pay in taxes? Not enough I bet. It's funny how some folks hate people who have a little success and want them to pave the way for them when they're not paying there fair share of taxes to begin with themselves. If the roles were reversed you be bitching the reverse.

Personally, 250k/year is a nice living but it ain't rich by a long shot.

r5TPsooner
8/4/2008, 10:00 PM
Good question, the answer is......who will lie the least and about what.

McCain is owned by big oil.

Obama is owned by Ted Kennedy.

I'll take McCain any day over a ****ing Kennedy!

mdklatt
8/4/2008, 10:27 PM
How much do you pay in taxes? Not enough I bet. It's funny how some folks hate people who have a little success and want them to pave the way for them when they're not paying there fair share of taxes to begin with themselves.

Obviously not as much as you, Bruce. :rolleyes:

I don't deduct mortgage interest or kids from my taxes. I don't have kids in public school. I drive very little. I bet you're chomping down on more government cheese than me, so suck it.



If the roles were reversed you be bitching the reverse.


If the roles were reversed I wouldn't be bitching at all, because it's absolutely unseemly to bitch about having "too much" money. Oh woe is me, I have so much money my taxes are too high. Oh woe is me, my house is so big I have a huge utility bill. Yeah, boo-fricking hoo.

You come on here, slip in backhanded comments about much money you make and then cry foul when somebody calls you wealthy. Well you can't have it both ways. What's so wrong with being wealthy in the first place? Congratulations, you're wealthy. Enjoy it. No, that's not sarcasm. I don't care how much money you do or don't have.

The false modesty isn't even that big of a deal (that's just the innerweb), but the snide remarks to people who make less than you is pathetic.

JohnnyMack
8/4/2008, 10:37 PM
Here's the cool thing about the innerwebs:

I haven't yet told you all that I cleared 15.6 million last year. I spent my off time on my yacht in the south of France getting smokers from Kate Beckinsale. Don't hate me.

Scott D
8/4/2008, 10:38 PM
r5 brings up a decent point actually.

Would Obama be considered this 'savior' type if John F. Kennedy Jr. doesn't nosedive his plane into the Atlantic a few years back?

mdklatt
8/4/2008, 10:40 PM
I spent my off time on my yacht in the south of France getting smokers from Kate Beckinsale. Don't hate me.

TTIWWP!! :mad:

That's why we hate you.

mdklatt
8/4/2008, 10:42 PM
Would Obama be considered this 'savior' type if John F. Kennedy Jr. doesn't nosedive his plane into the Atlantic a few years back?

:confused:

After George Bush, either McCain or Obama is going to seem like a savior.

r5TPsooner
8/4/2008, 11:35 PM
Obviously not as much as you, Bruce. :rolleyes:

I don't deduct mortgage interest or kids from my taxes. I don't have kids in public school. I drive very little. I bet you're chomping down on more government cheese than me, so suck it.



If the roles were reversed I wouldn't be bitching at all, because it's absolutely unseemly to bitch about having "too much" money. Oh woe is me, I have so much money my taxes are too high. Oh woe is me, my house is so big I have a huge utility bill. Yeah, boo-fricking hoo.

You come on here, slip in backhanded comments about much money you make and then cry foul when somebody calls you wealthy. Well you can't have it both ways. What's so wrong with being wealthy in the first place? Congratulations, you're wealthy. Enjoy it. No, that's not sarcasm. I don't care how much money you do or don't have.

The false modesty isn't even that big of a deal (that's just the innerweb), but the snide remarks to people who make less than you is pathetic.

How much do you pay in taxes, seriously? You bitch and moan about how Obama isn't going to tax anyone but those who make over 250k year when you know damn well he's gonna tax the **** out of anyone making over 150k year. Then you send me a ghey PM about calling you out on what you make and how much tax you pay and I'm the one crying? I simply stated that folks who make 250k/year pay enough in taxes and if you think that they should pay more maybe you should to.

As far as back hand slapping goes you seem to do a pretty good job at that too. I find it funny that when someone hits you where it hurts you cry fould and send PM's. Seriously, if you want to play with the big pups in the SO with regards to politics, you can't set on the porch and pee like a pup.

If your not proud of what you make for a living that's your problem not mine. I'm just sick and tired of people like you who think that folks who make 250k are rich and living in the lash of luxury. As far as cheese goes, everything in my home is bought and paid for with cash. I don't use credit cards unless I can pay them off every month and the only loans I have are on my car and my home.

All that I was getting at that maybe you should pay more in taxes too if you expect someone else to. It also seems to me that you're the one getting personal, not me. If someone buys a new car on the board as posts something about it, I'm the first one to congratulate them. If someone purchases a home, yacht, fishing boat, or big screen TV, I'm the first one to congratulate them.

BTW, I'm not wealthy by any means unless you count my wife and four kids into that equation. Now if you don't mind, I'm gonna go have some eggs benedict with Johnny Mack while we ride in his yacht on the coast of France and debate on which is funnier, Barack's ears or McCains hair line. He had better have some Bordeaux on board or he's ****ed!:D

Oh yeah, I apologize if my post hurt your feelers.

r5TPsooner
8/4/2008, 11:38 PM
:confused:

After George Bush, either McCain or Obama is going to seem like a savior.

See, I agree with you on more than you think.

Very true.

mdklatt
8/5/2008, 12:04 AM
You bitch and moan about how Obama isn't going to tax anyone but those who make over 250k year when you know damn well he's gonna tax the **** out of anyone making over 150k year.


Well, Obama ain't gonna do jack. Bush tried his best, but we don't have a dictatorship yet. As far as what he said he's going to do, he's going raise the SS tax in $250k and up.



If your not proud of what you make for a living that's your problem not mine.

How sad that you think money should be a source of pride.




As far as cheese goes, everything in my home is bought and paid for with cash.


Well whoopty-do, same here. And my car is paid off. But that has nothing to do with anything that we're talking about. The federal fuel tax doesn't pay for what the feds spend on highway construction, and it's probably similar at the state and local levels. The more you drive, the more you're being subsidized by somebody who pays more in taxes than you and/or drives less than you. That's just for starters. The mortgage interest I'm sure you deduct? Yeah, somebody else is paying for that too. Or it's just driving up the debt, which your kids will pay for in some way. Spoil them now, they're gonna be pissed later on. Are your kids in public school? Cha-ching$$ Planning on sending them to OU? Cha-ching$$ How often do fly on the airlines? Cha-ching$$ So much for being self-sufficient, eh?



All that I was getting at that maybe you should pay more in taxes too if you expect someone else to.

Who said I wasn't willing to? I think federal gas taxes should be higher, not lower. I support raising the federal tax on avgas in order to support the FAA's budget in lieu of complicated user fees. I think Bush's tax cuts should expire.

r5TPsooner
8/5/2008, 12:12 AM
Dude, I sincerely apologize for upsetting you. I have already decided after this thread and the negative way it has gone, that I'm done with political threads.

Again, a message board is to have fun and this isn't fun IMHO. So, again I'm sorry that you took such offense to my post or posts. If I see you at a tailgate, the 1st round is on me.

BTW, I do take great pride it what I earn coming from next to nothing. The nice thing about that is, I have never forgot where I came from or where I'm going. BTW, I never stated how much I made and it's not 250k/year. My point was defending the American tax payer and you seemed to miss the biggest point of all in my post, which is my fault I guess at not getting that point across in a clearer way.

mdklatt
8/5/2008, 12:31 AM
Again, a message board is to have fun and this isn't fun IMHO. So, again I'm sorry that you took such offense to my post or posts. If I see you at a tailgate, the 1st round is on me.


I'm not upset, no biggie. By the way, the beer at the tailgates is "free" (donations accepted) and I don't really like beer in the first place, so thanks for nothing. ;)





My point was defending the American tax payer and you seemed to miss the biggest point of all in my post, which is my fault I guess at not getting that point across better.

I think we need to all take a look out our contribution to the problem. You see so many people complaining about "welfare queens" and all that, but nobody thinks about the government spending that they are responsible for/recipients of. Look at how many people think the last stimulus check was a "tax refund". There ain't no such thing as a refund when you're running a deficit. Somebody's gonna pay for that, but not us--at least not now.

All we get from the government is lies, lies, lies. We are not going to fix the deficit unless we fully understand where all that money goes. We are not going to have a responsible energy policy if we don't know the true cost of every type of energy. Etc, etc.

Harry Beanbag
8/5/2008, 07:22 AM
...I don't really like beer...


As much as I disagree with nearly every view you have, this is the one that really hurts. WTF is wrong with you? :) ;)

JohnnyMack
8/5/2008, 09:15 AM
How much do you pay in taxes, seriously? You bitch and moan about how Obama isn't going to tax anyone but those who make over 250k year when you know damn well he's gonna tax the **** out of anyone making over 150k year. Then you send me a ghey PM about calling you out on what you make and how much tax you pay and I'm the one crying? I simply stated that folks who make 250k/year pay enough in taxes and if you think that they should pay more maybe you should to.

As far as back hand slapping goes you seem to do a pretty good job at that too. I find it funny that when someone hits you where it hurts you cry fould and send PM's. Seriously, if you want to play with the big pups in the SO with regards to politics, you can't set on the porch and pee like a pup.

If your not proud of what you make for a living that's your problem not mine. I'm just sick and tired of people like you who think that folks who make 250k are rich and living in the lash of luxury. As far as cheese goes, everything in my home is bought and paid for with cash. I don't use credit cards unless I can pay them off every month and the only loans I have are on my car and my home.

All that I was getting at that maybe you should pay more in taxes too if you expect someone else to. It also seems to me that you're the one getting personal, not me. If someone buys a new car on the board as posts something about it, I'm the first one to congratulate them. If someone purchases a home, yacht, fishing boat, or big screen TV, I'm the first one to congratulate them.

BTW, I'm not wealthy by any means unless you count my wife and four kids into that equation. Now if you don't mind, I'm gonna go have some eggs benedict with Johnny Mack while we ride in his yacht on the coast of France and debate on which is funnier, Barack's ears or McCains hair line. He had better have some Bordeaux on board or he's ****ed!:D

Oh yeah, I apologize if my post hurt your feelers.

Bitch I ain't lettin' you on my boat unless I hire you to serve me breakfast.

JohnnyMack
8/5/2008, 09:16 AM
As much as I disagree with nearly every view you have, this is the one that really hurts. WTF is wrong with you? :) ;)

Yeah. That made me sad. A lot.

Vaevictis
8/5/2008, 09:28 AM
Getting around an increase on the SS tax above $250k isn't really all that hard for the folks who run a small business.

Just sayin'.

mdklatt
8/6/2008, 12:45 PM
As much as I disagree with nearly every view you have, this is the one that really hurts. WTF is wrong with you? :) ;)

Actually, I don't like ****ty beer. I've been exposed to some tolerable beers, though.

JohnnyMack
8/6/2008, 01:13 PM
Actually, I don't like ****ty beer. I've been exposed to some tolerable beers, though.

Avoid Dean. Stick with me.

mdklatt
8/6/2008, 01:22 PM
Avoid Dean. Stick with me.

Impossible. You two are on each other like white on rice at the tailgates. It's kinda cute.

JohnnyMack
8/18/2008, 12:02 PM
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0808/12596.html

I totally called this.

Howzit
8/18/2008, 12:48 PM
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0808/12596.html

I totally called this.

That he would choose a VP? You're amazing.

Howzit
8/18/2008, 01:00 PM
What's your number? We could all call you!

JohnnyMack
8/18/2008, 02:03 PM
That he would choose a VP? You're amazing.

Pfftt......read between the lines, moran.

Chuck Bao
8/18/2008, 03:15 PM
There are some gems in this thread and Iím giving it a five star rating.


Barach and his socialism scares the heck out of many Americans. Hopefully, enough of them to keep his scary a*s out of controlling the free world.

Do you think the rest of the free world has yet caught on to this controlling part of being free?


I honestly believe in my heart that Obama would sell our country down the river if it got him into the White House.

Do you really mean that Obama is going to do a better job of selling our country down the river than the McCain and his economic advisors who represent China?

Back on topic, I donít think Hilary is the VP choice. Obama has plenty of time to differentiate himself from McCain on global trade and economic issues and sell himself to the rust belt states.

JohnnyMack
8/19/2008, 09:29 AM
http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/08/19/america/19veep.php?page=2

Now I'm gonna say Joe Biden.

Howzit
8/19/2008, 09:53 AM
Doesn't matter, it's still picking a VP, and you were dead. on.

sooneron
8/19/2008, 09:54 AM
Biden does think that Obama is clean.

JohnnyMack
8/19/2008, 09:57 AM
Doesn't matter, it's still picking a VP, and you were dead. on.

You really should pay a bit more attention to just how brilliant I am.

olevetonahill
8/19/2008, 09:58 AM
You really should pay a bit more attention to just how brilliant I am.

You so Brilliant ya Blind me :D

Howzit
8/19/2008, 10:11 AM
You really should pay a bit more attention to just how brilliant I am.

Oh trust me, I've noticed how brilliant you are.

JohnnyMack
8/19/2008, 08:46 PM
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0808/12652.html

Great, the only person who believes me is Ralph Nader.

Howzit
8/19/2008, 09:01 PM
*snicker*

soonersn20xx
8/19/2008, 09:09 PM
I can understand that Obama doesn't like Hillary but seeing how dirty and sneaky the Karl Rove puppeteers are running McCain..........fight fire with fire and bring in HRC.

JohnnyMack
8/19/2008, 09:18 PM
I can understand that Obama doesn't like Hillary but seeing how dirty and sneaky the Karl Rove puppeteers are running McCain..........fight fire with fire and bring in HRC.

Yeah.

This is pretty much the signal of the apocalypse I think.

Harry Beanbag
8/19/2008, 11:09 PM
I still haven't noticed if McCain is actually running a campaign.

yermom
8/20/2008, 12:17 AM
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0808/12652.html

Great, the only person who believes me is Ralph Nader.

i'm not sure i follow his logic

did states like VW and OK like her over him because they really liked her? or they didn't like Obama?


i would think they best option is some moderate, less polarizing old white d00d that the flyover states could identify with

JohnnyMack
8/20/2008, 09:28 AM
i'm not sure i follow his logic

did states like VW and OK like her over him because they really liked her? or they didn't like Obama?


i would think they best option is some moderate, less polarizing old white d00d that the flyover states could identify with

This election will be won in the rust belt. Like it or not, HRC is VERY, VERY strong up there and I guess the thinking is that she could bring MI, IN, OH, PA very solidly into the D side. Add in the New England states and the left coast along with IL and Obama pretty much has it wrapped up. Even without FL.

JohnnyMack
8/20/2008, 02:54 PM
.
VEEPSTAKES: One Last Clinton Scenario
posted by John Nichols on 08/20/2008 @ 12:00pm

This column has been pondering and predicting an Obama-Biden ticket for some time now. That's still the best bet, and now that the announcement is finally imminent, everyone is talking about it.

So, what the heck, let's run the Hillary Clinton scenario one more time:

Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton like one another. Obama had Clinton's cell number on speed dial, and vice versa. They maintained stable, even good, personal relations during the primary campaign. When things got ugly, Obama stepped up several times to defend Clinton, and the senator from New York got what might have been the loudest and most sincere round of the campaign when she seemed to suggest at the close of a contentious primary-season debate that she would be willing to join an Obama-led "dream ticket."

But we always knew that the "what to do with Bill Clinton" challenge would steer Obama away from an easy or casual selection of Hillary Clinton as his vice presidential running mate. Again and again through the primary season, it was Bill who said things that seemed to inflame the competition and move both camps to their respective corners. And, of course, there is the fundamental question of where to put an ex-president in an administration that supposed to be all about change.

So the line became: Obama would only pick Clinton if he comes to the conclusion that he needs her badly enough to accept not only his former rival but the complexities that her husband brings to the equation and, of course, their considerable baggage.

Well, the latest polls seem to suggest that Obama finds himself in a circumstance that lends itself to the Clinton consideration.

Despite the fact that the miserable state of the U.S. economy shaped by eight years of oilman budgeting should be handing the election to Obama, he's either tied or behind in a number of key state and national surveys. The new Reuters/Zogby poll has Republican John McCain leading Obama 46-41. Gallup and LA Times surveys have it much closer, with Obama slightly up. But these are not encouraging number for the Democrats.

Russian tanks in Georgia, regime change in Pakistan and the general uncertainty about whether to worry more about a new Cold War or the mismanagement of the old war on terror seems to have caused a good many Americans to edge toward McCain. That may not be reasonable, or smart or fair. But, to employ the phrase of the season, "It is what it is."

Barack Obama might just need Hillary Clinton.

Clinton, whether appropriately or not, seen by a great many Americans as someone who knows her way around the international stage. In fact, members of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee who are not fans of Clinton have told me that she has far better international connections than McCain or Obama.

She also has some pretty good connections in the swing states of Michigan, Ohio and Pennsylvania.

Then there is the whole "dream ticket" thing.

If Obama takes the stage in front of the Old State Capital in Springfield, Illinois, Saturday with Evan Bayh at his side, it will be news -- but not very exciting news. If he does so with Joe Biden, it will be bigger new -- but it's not like Biden brings the "wow" factor.

If Obama takes the stage with Clinton at his side, it will be the dominant news story of the weekend, the convention and perhaps of the fall campaign.

Indeed, it could create that wave of excitement that Obama needs to have not just a triumphal convention but a triumphal campaign.

So that's the Hillary Clinton scenario, with all of its challenges, complexities and unpleasantnesses.

One does not have to like Clinton, or even believe that Clinton will ultimately join a "dream ticket," to suspect that as the Obama camp reviews the latest polls, they might be spinning the scenario one last time.

Obama and his aides may reject the option -- because of Bill, because the former First Lady does not say "change," or because of concerns that a ticket made up of an African-American man and a woman might be too much change for the electorate.

But let's presume, out of respect for the savvy of the Obama team, that they are considering it.

Veritas
8/20/2008, 03:50 PM
Clinton is such a bad idea for Obama. Such a bad idea. From where I sit Obama stands to win the election due to the fact that he's got quite a lot of Republicans who will vote for him.

However, those crossover vote will vanish like a fart in the wind if Hillary is in the picture. Mark my words on that one.

Frozen Sooner
8/20/2008, 04:20 PM
Clinton is such a bad idea for Obama. Such a bad idea. From where I sit Obama stands to win the election due to the fact that he's got quite a lot of Republicans who will vote for him.

However, those crossover vote will vanish like a fart in the wind if Hillary is in the picture. Mark my words on that one.

They did an interesting pro/con analysis on Clinton on Hardball last night.

The upshot was that if he picks Clinton, he picks up a few rust belt states that he's in danger of losing, but loses a couple of midwest states and Alaska that he's got a shot of winning (believe it or not, he led the last poll in Alaska.)

As for me?

If he picks Clinton, I'll still vote for him. But I'll probably stop my volunteer work for his campaign and move over to Begich for Senate.

SanJoaquinSooner
8/20/2008, 05:58 PM
If he doesn't pick Clinton, it's more likely I'll vote for McCain. But I don't expect him to.

More importantly, he needs to flip-flop in the Colombian Free Trade agreement. He bashed free trade during the primaries.

JohnnyMack
8/22/2008, 02:27 PM
Chet Edwards picking up late momentum.

colleyvillesooner
8/22/2008, 02:37 PM
Let us know when you get "the" text message...

JohnnyMack
8/22/2008, 03:01 PM
I keep thinking I would have gotten it by now.

I'm gonna start a bunch of threads to **** people off for now.

Harry Beanbag
8/22/2008, 05:12 PM
Should I have ever heard of Chet Edwards before?

JohnnyMack
8/22/2008, 05:22 PM
I hadn't before about a week ago.

JohnnyMack
8/22/2008, 05:24 PM
http://www.kmbc.com/2008/0822/17269047_240X180.jpg

Mixer!
8/22/2008, 05:27 PM
Biden is a non-starter for me. I'd rather see him pick Hillary.

















(I can't believe that I just typed that.) :O

Scott D
8/22/2008, 10:35 PM
Should I have ever heard of Chet Edwards before?

sadly I just manage to hope that any candidate doesn't pick the next Admiral Stockdale as a running mate.

Frozen Sooner
8/22/2008, 10:45 PM
Biden just picked up a Secret Service detail. So there's that.

Curly Bill
8/22/2008, 10:51 PM
Biden just picked up a Secret Service detail. So there's that.

I like it!

Sooner98
8/22/2008, 11:56 PM
Yep, it's Biden.

Curious, how does a six-term senator mesh with the whole "Change" mantra?

SanJoaquinSooner
8/23/2008, 01:04 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFduMuP7v-k

Harry Beanbag
8/23/2008, 01:29 AM
Since when did Biden become a non-dooshbag? He's been generally recognized as one for many many years now. This decision=fail. Just another nail in the coffin of "change". Barack is using the standard liberal/socialist playbook of the last 40 years, just packaged differently. "Cleaner and more articulate" I suppose. :rolleyes:

olevetonahill
8/23/2008, 04:41 AM
He aint ?

Scott D
8/23/2008, 10:11 AM
Not that I was considering voting for Obama, but this definitely cements my attempting to write in Mickey Mouse for President.

Veritas
8/23/2008, 01:13 PM
Not that I was considering voting for Obama, but this definitely cements my attempting to write in Mickey Mouse for President.
Let's write in Stoops.

Harry Beanbag
8/23/2008, 01:17 PM
I've been saying Toby Keith for a long time now.

Frozen Sooner
8/23/2008, 01:17 PM
I've been saying Toby Keith for a long time now.

Toby wants you to vote for Obama. :D

Harry Beanbag
8/23/2008, 01:23 PM
:(

Frozen Sooner
8/23/2008, 01:27 PM
Like I said in another thread-when Toby Keith endorsed Obama, I couldn't have been more surprised if I woke up with my head sewn to the carpet.

jdsooner
8/23/2008, 11:26 PM
No man has willingly picked Hillary for anything in a lllloooonnnngggg time!

Okla-homey
8/24/2008, 07:09 AM
Does this finally close the book on the Clinton era in presidential politics?

Or are we to suffer Chelsea making a run at it after she turns 30?

SanJoaquinSooner
8/24/2008, 07:37 AM
Does this finally close the book on the Clinton era in presidential politics?

Or are we to suffer Chelsea making a run at it after she turns 30?

I would think if McCain wins, Senator Clinton may be up to challenge in 2012.

Okla-homey
8/24/2008, 07:44 AM
I would think if McCain wins, Senator Clinton may be up to challenge in 2012.

But if HRC has indeed permanently alienated herself to the black community, she has no future in national politics as a dem.

SanJoaquinSooner
8/24/2008, 08:44 AM
But if HRC has indeed permanently alienated herself to the black community, she has no future in national politics as a dem.

Nothing in politics is permanent.

BlondeSoonerGirl
8/24/2008, 08:51 AM
You have to be 35 to run for President.

Okla-homey
8/24/2008, 09:06 AM
You have to be 35 to run for President.


but she has to be elected to the Senate first. Its one of those stepping-stone thingies. Senate at 30, Prez at 35.

Kinda like Joe Biden's failed plan.;)

StoopTroup
8/24/2008, 09:12 AM
Yep, it's Biden.

Curious, how does a six-term senator mesh with the whole "Change" mantra?

Good Point.

I hope somebody point blank asks Barrack that one.

JohnnyMack
8/24/2008, 09:57 AM
The spin is that he's a change from what we have now. He'll be the advocate of the hard working, blue collar kind of guy and isn't another wealthy elitist trying to portray himself as the everyman like we have with W, McCain and Romney.

Curly Bill
8/24/2008, 11:38 AM
The spin is that he's a change from what we have now. He'll be the advocate of the hard working, blue collar kind of guy and isn't another wealthy elitist trying to portray himself as the everyman like we have with W, McCain and Romney.

Yup, me and ol' Joe had beers together just last week. What a regular guy he is. ;)

...Nope, I don't see that spin paying off so well.

Curly Bill
8/24/2008, 11:38 AM
Then Brack came by and asked if we wanted to go grab some arugula.

JohnnyMack
8/24/2008, 12:07 PM
I didnt say whether or not it would work, just that that will be their likely attack strategy.

Curly Bill
8/24/2008, 12:11 PM
I didnt say whether or not it would work, just that that will be their likely attack strategy.

Agreed that this is likely.

Okla-homey
8/24/2008, 12:58 PM
The spin is that he's a change from what we have now. He'll be the advocate of the hard working, blue collar kind of guy and isn't another wealthy elitist trying to portray himself as the everyman like we have with W, McCain and Romney.

two lawyers versus two non-lawyers. almost makes we want to vote donk.;)

Whet
8/24/2008, 08:39 PM
http://media.townhall.com/Townhall/Car/b/sst082108dAPR.jpg

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
8/24/2008, 09:22 PM
Somebody please post the "highlights" of the Dem convention on Soonerfans SO, as it emerges from its cucoon.

JohnnyMack
9/13/2008, 06:15 PM
I've heard two talking heads in the last few days hint that we haven't heard the last of Hillary. Like a Friday the 13th sequel, it's been floated that there is a possibility of Biden stepping aside for the "good of the party". Has anyone else heard or seen anything like this?

LosAngelesSooner
9/13/2008, 06:33 PM
I've heard two talking heads in the last few days hint that we haven't heard the last of Hillary. Like a Friday the 13th sequel, it's been floated that there is a possibility of Biden stepping aside for the "good of the party". Has anyone else heard or seen anything like this?I've heard grumblings of that out here.

Don't see it happening, though. But it's possible. It WOULD be a good move for Obama, but I just don't see him being able to do that.

KC//CRIMSON
9/13/2008, 06:34 PM
never happen.

Getem
9/13/2008, 06:40 PM
It does seem like something is going on. Maybe they are just waiting for the right time. The question is, would Hillary swallow her pride and do it? Understanding that even if they win, that puts her Prez plans on hold for at least 4 years, maybe 8.

Veritas
9/13/2008, 06:42 PM
Ahem:


Biden will fake an injury (from subject)...and drop out of the race so Brack can choose HilRod.

You heard it here first.


http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=119926

SCOUT
9/13/2008, 07:44 PM
Ahem:




http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=119926

heh
I've heard grumblings about it on Soonerfans too :D

Scott D
9/14/2008, 10:44 AM
Well from what I can tell you Dem lovers is that Hillary appears to be out stumping for Hillary for president.

And what I can tell you Rep lovers is that McCain couldn't get a wet fart to show up at his rallies without Palin in attendance.

Continuing to show that once again 2008 is the year of "None of the Above".

Veritas
9/14/2008, 11:08 AM
Continuing to show that once again 2008 is the year of "Please god make it stop already".
Fixed. ;)

Jerk
9/14/2008, 11:32 AM
Let's put it this way. The Donks are likely going to die of a self-inflicted wound (again). They have a bizarre pattern of too often choosing a guy that simply can't be abided in fly-over country. Like Dana Garvey says, its almost as if they nominated an unknown named Charles Manson Hitler.;) And this cult of personality thing appears to be having some unintended consequences in terms of stirring up people's resentment.

You can't win the WH by carrying CA and the NE US. That was the thing about WJC, aside from the fact he was a stupendous politician, the guy resonated with Jim Bob and Mary Sue because he had something in common with them. IOW, he didn't have to concede the hillbilly vote.

If the DNC nominated a moderate, they probably could have walked away with this thing, just as they could have beaten W last time with someone who wasn't a senator from Massachusetts who looks like Herman Munster and who has a wierd wife from Upper Slobovia.

I'm now of the opinion, based on JSM's feckless campaigning, if HRC had won, and chosen BHO as her VP, they probably would have won too. As it stands, nadda. 'Twer it not so, BHO would have opened up a commanding lead by now.

Man, Homey, you are a prophet!!!

eta- WJC ran as a moderate. When is the last time a liberal ran as a liberal in a national election and won? And how many times has this happened in the past 50 years?

Jerk
9/14/2008, 12:18 PM
I've heard two talking heads in the last few days hint that we haven't heard the last of Hillary. Like a Friday the 13th sequel, it's been floated that there is a possibility of Biden stepping aside for the "good of the party". Has anyone else heard or seen anything like this?

What does this say about Barry's judgment in the first place?

It doesn't make his decision-making skills look very good. You think he would do better with his experience as a community organizer ;)

Okla-homey
9/14/2008, 01:11 PM
Man, Homey, you are a prophet!!!

eta- WJC ran as a moderate. When is the last time a liberal ran as a liberal in a national election and won? And how many times has this happened in the past 50 years?


I'll say this, no ticket has won since JFK in 1960 that didn't have an ex- or sitting governor on the ticket. And that one was razor-close. In fact, historians are generally of the opinion that the Chicago machine delivered Illinois for JFK that put him over the top.

JFK: 34,220,984 votes cast
RMN: 34,108,157 votes cast.

King Crimson
9/14/2008, 01:47 PM
Bush-Quayle had no governor/ex-gov. they won in 88.

JohnnyMack
9/14/2008, 09:51 PM
What does this say about Barry's judgment in the first place?

That's what I was thinking too actually. I wonder though if Biden said that he was doing what he felt was right for the party or some crap like that and did it without Obama having anything to say about it ;) ;) no what I mean, how it would be received. This election would end up feeling like a wrestling program.

Scott D
9/15/2008, 12:15 AM
Fixed. ;)

why do you hate Brewster's Millions? :mad:

Veritas
9/15/2008, 01:42 AM
why do you hate Brewster's Millions? :mad:
Never seen it.

:ducks:

Scott D
9/15/2008, 03:26 PM
Never seen it.

:ducks:

Richard Pryor, John Candy...pure ****ing comedic genius...you ****ing commie :)