Dumb and Dumber

[mdklatt]

McCain's idea: A "vacation" from federal gas taxes.

Yes, let's encourage oil consumption instead of conservation while removing money from the highway trust fund and saving you less than $50. Except that it probably won't even save you that much because prices will simply rise to make up for the increased consumption. Brilliant!

Hillary's idea: McCain's idea plus a windfall tax. Because we all know the oil companies aren't going to pass that on to the consumer. Sweet chocolate jesus.

I'm not sure which idea is dumb and which one is dumber. Hillary's plan will do nothing at all (simply replace federal gas tax with the windfall tax), but McCain's plan does almost nothing for the consumer while increasing the deficit and/or making our roads even ****tier. Actually, I bet Hillary's windfall tax would end up in the general fund instead of the highway trust fund, so roads would get ****tier no matter what.

If either of these bumble****s thinks their idea is a good one, then he/she is an idiot. More likely, they know it's a dumb idea and are simply trying to buy votes because they think we are the idiots. Unfortunately, they're more right than wrong about that. Business as usual.

[SoonerStormchaser]

Well, let's see here...
POTUS proposes drilling in ANWR back in 2001...Donks keep blocking legislation. POTUS encourages oil companies to build new refineries and use their massive profits to fund new exploration and cleaner technology...Congress fails to move on it cause it would mean ****ing off the biggest donors to their political coffers. Now someone comes up with a temporary solution that could at least alleviate a growing problem while the rest of the political system get their ***es in gear...and you think it's a dumb idea.

I guess you have a boatload of cash left in your budget to spend on gas while most of us are doing everything we can to conserve.

[SoonerInKCMO]

I guess you have a boatload of cash left in your budget to spend on gas while most of us are doing everything we can to conserve.

If you think that removing the gas tax today will lead to prices being $0.185/gallon lower tomorrow, I'd have to disagree.

[SicEmBaylor]

Honestly, how many people bitched when highway and infrastructure money was dipped into by a countless number of states over the years for pet projects?

[Mjcpr]

I guess you have a boatload of cash left in your budget to spend on gas while most of us are doing everything we can to conserve.

I know you and the missus have really cut back what with your Vegas and Rush trips lately.

Times, they're tough all over.

;)

[mdklatt]

Now someone comes up with a temporary solution that could at least alleviate a growing problem while the rest of the political system get their ***es in gear...and you think it's a dumb idea.

At best it's going to do nothing, because prices will rise to a new equilibrium level. At worst it's going to do nothing for the consumer while reducing government revenue.



I guess you have a boatload of cash left in your budget to spend on gas while most of us are doing everything we can to conserve.

That would save me about $10 this summer. IF prices actually dropped 18 cents and stayed there all summer. Which they won't. Whoopee, maybe now I can afford to Bueno-size it.

[frankensooner]

Well, let's see here...
POTUS proposes drilling in ANWR back in 2001...Donks keep blocking legislation. POTUS encourages oil companies to build new refineries and use their massive profits to fund new exploration and cleaner technology...Congress fails to move on it cause it would mean ****ing off the biggest donors to their political coffers. Now someone comes up with a temporary solution that could at least alleviate a growing problem while the rest of the political system get their ***es in gear...and you think it's a dumb idea.

I guess you have a boatload of cash left in your budget to spend on gas while most of us are doing everything we can to conserve.

See, the refineries output is at about 85% from what I hear. If they would step up production, allow drilling in ANWAR which would supply by some estimates 5% of the nations needs, I bet we still would be paying over 3 bucks a gallon because of speculation and the weak dollar. Until the dollar gets stronger, (don't hold your breath) forget about cheaper gas.

[tommieharris91]

Well, let's see here...
POTUS proposes drilling in ANWR back in 2001...Donks keep blocking legislation. POTUS encourages oil companies to build new refineries and use their massive profits to fund new exploration and cleaner technology...Congress fails to move on it cause it would mean ****ing off the biggest donors to their political coffers. Now someone comes up with a temporary solution that could at least alleviate a growing problem while the rest of the political system get their ***es in gear...and you think it's a dumb idea.

I guess you have a boatload of cash left in your budget to spend on gas while most of us are doing everything we can to conserve.

Unlike the other ideas which were actually good, this one is bad because it simply means we will drive more, demanding more oil and thus increasing the price.

[picasso]

I think McCain is trying to encourage vacationers who are vital to so many summer industry folks who also vote. ;)

yes! in a slowing economy we need more conservation!!! brilliant.

[mdklatt]

If they would step up production, allow drilling in ANWAR which would supply by some estimates 5% of the nations needs

For how long? All we're doing is delaying the inevitable. Maybe we should start weaning ourselves from oil before we're forced to quit cold turkey.

Nah, that's just crazy talk.

[yermom]

it sounds like it might do something, but it's too little and too late. i mean 5 years ago i was griping because gas was almost 2 dollars

the taxes are what like 5% of the cost? who cares... hell, double the tax for electric car research if you want to do something

[mdklatt]

yes! in a slowing economy we need more conservation!!! brilliant.

Rampant deficit spending by government and consumers alike got us into this mess, it can get us out!

[picasso]

I agree with that but encouraging people to quit driving and staying home isn't going to help me the artist or mom and pop and their trinket store.

I'm also in agreement about finding an alternative energy source. Remember nukes? That was shot down by somebody. Oil is what we've got for now.

[mdklatt]

it sounds like it might do something, but it's too little and too late. i mean 5 years ago i was griping because gas was almost 2 dollars

the taxes are what like 5% of the cost? who cares... hell, double the tax for electric car research if you want to do something

But where's the instant gratification in that?

GIMME GIMME GIMME NOW NOW NOW! TELL ME WHAT I WANT TO HEAR, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATES! I CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!

[frankensooner]

Remember when Stockdale's running mate proposed a 25 cent per gallon gas tax to pay down the national debt. What a rube! ;)

[mdklatt]

I agree with that but encouraging people to quit driving and staying home isn't going to help me the artist or mom and pop and their trinket store.


But getting rid of the gas tax isn't going to help anybody because it's not actually going to decrease prices.

If I told you I'd give you $20 now, but in a few months you're going to have to replace a wheel after driving into a pothole, would you take that deal?

[Animal Mother]

I will now proceed to entangle the entire area.

Want gas prices to go down?

Drive slower.
Drive less. Walk or car pool more.
Drive less of a car. Get rid of your Urban Assault Vehicle for a four banger. I did five years ago. You say you can afford it? Well the country can’t afford it.
Somehow, if possible, stop selling oil as a commodity on the market. Isn’t there a way for us not get pummeled by these wankers trying to make money of the speculation of oil futures?
The scarcity of oil that is refined into gasoline drives up the price. Lots of oil sitting around should drive it down.
I don’t agree with the gummite often but we are being held by the short and curlies security wise by OPEC. We better do SOMETHING as quick as possible.
That’s just my three dollars and fifty-five cents worth.

[JohnnyMack]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24388777/

Economists slam the proposal. Obama opposes it.

Nice to see McCain and Clinton continue their standard Washington pandering.

[Beef]

The gas holiday is chock full of fail. I agree with Obama and the economists.

[OUDoc]

I agree oil execs are pricks.
And that plan won't do much good.

[Big Red Ron]

Its half a dozen of one or six of the other. Stimulus packages and tax holidays are goofy in general but I kinda like the idea, going into summer.

I promise you, there are economists that can make any proposal look good or bad, like any expert witness.

[frankensooner]

I think I read about this in the dumb and dumber thread! ;)

[Scott D]

Well, let's see here...
POTUS proposes drilling in ANWR back in 2001...Donks keep blocking legislation. POTUS encourages oil companies to build new refineries and use their massive profits to fund new exploration and cleaner technology...Congress fails to move on it cause it would mean ****ing off the biggest donors to their political coffers. Now someone comes up with a temporary solution that could at least alleviate a growing problem while the rest of the political system get their ***es in gear...and you think it's a dumb idea.

I guess you have a boatload of cash left in your budget to spend on gas while most of us are doing everything we can to conserve.

yeah, that half a tank of gas you'll save with this idea will go a long way this summer :rolleyes: maybe you can get the missus a new lower denture gel. ;)

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24388777/

Economists slam the proposal. Obama opposes it.

Nice to see McCain and Clinton continue their standard Washington pandering.Therefore, VOTE OBAMA!

[soonerscuba]

We should put an randomly selected state on eBay.

[JohnnyMack]

I think I read about this in the dumb and dumber thread! ;)

Heh. Oops. Guess it would help if I did some readin'.

Merge ahead.

[JohnnyMack]

We should put an randomly selected state on eBay.

I drew a name out of a hat. Mississippi, you're first.

[soonerinabilene]

We should put an randomly selected state on eBay.

If by random you mean California, Im all for it!;)

[royalfan5]

It just boggles my mind how entitled people feel to their cheap energy and wastefulness. Learning to cut back and be more effiecent will make everyone a lot better off, instead of crying to the government for a lollypop in the form of a meaningless tax break.

[JohnnyMack]

It just boggles my mind how entitled people feel to their cheap energy and wastefulness. Learning to cut back and be more effiecent will make everyone a lot better off, instead of crying to the government for a lollypop in the form of a meaningless tax break.

But it isn't the people asking for this, it's 2 people who want to be POTUS asking for this. Two people who are doing nothing more than pandering to their voting base.

[royalfan5]

But it isn't the people asking for this, it's 2 people who want to be POTUS asking for this. Two people who are doing nothing more than pandering to their voting base.

The people want a lolly, the folks running for potus are the one determining the flavor.

[JohnnyMack]

The people want a lolly, the folks running for potus are the one determining the flavor.

I don't. I think it's a typical dog and pony show. I'd rather pay the taxes and have my roads intact. Thanks.

[SoonerInKCMO]

I don't.

Well, it's been well established that you're not like most folks. ;)

[royalfan5]

I don't. I think it's a typical dog and pony show. I'd rather pay the taxes and have my roads intact. Thanks.

I don't think you are the typical citizen though. Do you think half the populace realizes the gas tax pays for roads?

[Scott D]

I don't even think half the populace realizes there IS a gas tax.

[yermom]

they just know that gas prices suck, and that anything that says "lower gas prices" is going to go over well

unless i'm paying $2 a gallon again, i don't think this is going to change much

even so, has our gas consumption dropped at all since 2001 or so?

people still drive their SUV 45 minutes to work every day

[Scott D]

they just know that gas prices suck, and that anything that says "lower gas prices" is going to go over well

unless i'm paying $2 a gallon again, i don't think this is going to change much

even so, has our gas consumption dropped at all since 2001 or so?

people still drive their SUV 45 minutes to work every day

depends on your point of view. GM is cutting production at 4 plants partially because of the AAM Strike, partially because demand for SUV's and Trucks has decreased on a more national basis.

[OUDoc]

The people want a lolly, the folks running for potus are the one determining the flavor.
If they want my vote, I want them to dance for me, dammit!

[yermom]

depends on your point of view. GM is cutting production at 4 plants partially because of the AAM Strike, partially because demand for SUV's and Trucks has decreased on a more national basis.

yeah, i guess that's true. they just aren't paying all that extra cash for new ones anymore

[Condescending Sooner]

[QUOTE=yermom;2285135]it sounds like it might do something, but it's too little and too late. i mean 5 years ago i was griping because gas was almost 2 dollars

the taxes are what like 5% of the cost? who cares... hell, double the tax for electric car research if you want to do something[/QUOTE

In Oklahoma the tax is 35.4 cents per gallon. Nationwide it averages 61 cents per gallon. A little more than 5%


It won't increase consumption much, a full tank today equals not getting gas tomorrow.

[mdklatt]

I don't even think half the populace realizes there IS a gas tax.

In the interest of full disclosure, there should be a pie-chart breakdown of gas prices on every gas pump. That way we'll know how much is for taxes, how much goes to the distributor, how much funds terrorists in the Middle East, etc.

For super duper full disclosure, include a second pie chart detailing the costs of gas that aren't included in the price: highway subsidies, environmental damage, health problems, the percentage of military spending devoted to keeping the foreign oil flowing, etc. "Free market" my ***.

[yermom]

In Oklahoma the tax is 35.4 cents per gallon. Nationwide it averages 61 cents per gallon. A little more than 5%


It won't increase consumption much, a full tank today equals not getting gas tomorrow.

i'm talking the federal tax, which is $.184 per gallon, unless this site is wrong: (which is pretty close to 5% of the $3.599 i paid last night)

http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp

are they wanting the states to suspend their gas taxes as well?

[mdklatt]

i'm talking the federal tax, which is $.184 per gallon, unless this site is wrong:

http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp

are they wanting the states to suspend their gas taxes as well?

I don't think McHillary said that, but I bet a lot of states would do it if the feds did.

[Scott D]

If they want my vote, I want them to dance for me, dammit!

in your case you get to choose what color latex glove they get to put on for your prostate exam ;)

[Scott D]

I don't think McHillary said that, but I bet a lot of states would do it if the feds did.

I doubt it, because the states would be in a panic over the fact that they are losing out on federal funding for those projects because of a suspended federal tax. If anything it might cause a few more states to consider switching to a turnpike system provided they could find the funding to start it.

[Jerk]

Do you think half the populace realizes the gas tax pays for roads?

Does it go into the "build and repair roads account," or does it go into the general fund? I bet it's like social security: it goes into the general fund.

I think I like super high gas prices. I've noticed a decrease in traffic on the highway. Whatever works.

Oh, and to everyone else: how come we're not building nuclear power plants and drilling for our own oil?

[mdklatt]

Does it go into the "build and repair roads account," or does it go into the general fund? I bet it's like social security: it goes into the general fund.

No, it goes into a dedicated fund. But that fund only accounts for 2/3 of highway spending, so a pretty big chunk comes out of the general fund.

[Big Red Ron]

Oh, and to everyone else: how come we're not building nuclear power plants and drilling for our own oil?Well, that one is pretty easy. Democrats in federal offices wont allow either.

Nuclear power is a no brainer. If we can [insert anything that floats your boat here], then there is no reason we can't have nuclear power plants supplying most of our energy needs safely.

[Vaevictis]

Even if we wanted to build nuclear power plants, there's a major supply constraint because the number of reactors that can be built to Western standards in any given year is limited to less than ten. Yes, that's worldwide.

As far as drilling for oil is concerned, I say it's better that we don't over do it simply from a national security point of view. Better to suck other countries dry and be the last country with oil standing. Personally, I suspect that demand is going to ramp up at a pace that it will completely outpace our ability to supply -- in that case, the price benefit to us would be negligable, but the military benefit to keeping our own reserves would not be.

[Harry Beanbag]

Since we use about 2/3's of our oil for transportation, nuclear power plants won't cut our oil consumption that drastically. The problem isn't electricity generation, it is transportation, and that has to be the focus in the quest for an alternate energy source.

[shaun4411]

solar cars. cars powered by gyspy tears. cars powered by anger and rage(road rage). good alternatives.

[Jerk]

Since we use about 2/3's of our oil for transportation, nuclear power plants won't cut our oil consumption that drastically. The problem isn't electricity generation, it is transportation, and that has to be the focus in the quest for an alternate energy source.

They'd still be a big help, overall. They wouldn't need oil, natural gas, or coal. They produce no 'green house emissions.' They don't need wind. They don't need sun. If a major advancement in battery technology comes along and powers cars better than what we have now, then transportation could be emissions free and cheap to 'fill up.'

I was thinking that the panhandle would be an awesome place for a site, but I remembered that there is no water up there.

[Harry Beanbag]

They'd still be a big help, overall. They wouldn't need oil, natural gas, or coal. They produce no 'green house emissions.' They don't need wind. They don't need sun. If a major advancement in battery technology comes along and powers cars better than what we have now, then transportation could be emissions free and cheap to 'fill up.'

I was thinking that the panhandle would be an awesome place for a site, but I remembered that there is no water up there.


There are still the issues of radioactive waste and public scaredy-catness that so far have been impossible to overcome to even get the idea off the ground. Not to mention just creating more and more sweet *** terror targets.

I like the battery idea that could go along with it though, that would be something that could really make a difference. Of course then there is the issue of battery disposal as well. If we ever get to that point though, I suggest we just air drop all our spent car batteries over the Middle East, by that time they won't have the money to do anything about it. :D

[Scott D]

well more places seem to be getting into the concept of wind farms with those thin bladed windmills. Perhaps that's a solid answer considering the increase in wind due to the weather cycles.

[sooneron]

It just boggles my mind how entitled people feel to their cheap energy and wastefulness. Learning to cut back and be more effiecent will make everyone a lot better off, instead of crying to the government for a lollypop in the form of a meaningless tax break.

But I have to get Tyler and Brittany to soccer and ballet!!!


http://www.arctic.org/~trockij/soccer-mom-i-forgot-my-rpg.jpg

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Boy, prosperity sure is bad. Let's just go ahead and bain it.

[sooneron]

Boy, prosperity sure is bad. Let's just go ahead and bain it.

:rolleyes:


You can be prosperous and intelligent all at the same time. Maybe that one slipped past you.
Hmm, buy the vee hickle that gets 14 mpg and costs around 50k or buy the one that averages 24 mpg and costs around 50k.

[OklahomaRed]

For how long? All we're doing is delaying the inevitable. Maybe we should start weaning ourselves from oil before we're forced to quit cold turkey.

Nah, that's just crazy talk.

I don't normally agree with mdklatt, but I'm going to have to agree with you on this one. :D All the gas tax cut will do is equalize pricing, and postpone the inevitable. The only way gas prices will ever come down is if we drill more domestically, build more refineries, and decrease our deppendence on foreign oil. Ethanol, nuclear energy, wind energy, solar energy, public transportation, smaller cars, and people cutting back - which will hurt tourism and the service industry sector.

[Frozen Sooner]

Hey. The Straight Talk Express uses a lot of gas. This could save the McCain war chest a lot of money.

[Vaevictis]

Boy, prosperity sure is bad. Let's just go ahead and bain it.

You do realize that there is such a thing as too much "prosperity", right?

[Scott D]

Boy, prosperity sure is bad. Let's just go ahead and bain it.

that's not prosperity, it's the culmination of over half the 7 deadly sins.

[JohnnyMack]

Hey. The Straight Talk Express uses a lot of gas. This could save the McCain war chest a lot of money.

What do they care? They just take her private jet wherever they need to go. You know, like all the rest of us do.

[Frozen Sooner]

What do they care? They just take her private jet wherever they need to go. You know, like all the rest of us do.

Heh. You know, it was interesting that Cindy McCain was talking last night about how when she met John, he "chased her around" the cocktail table and wouldn't leave her alone the whole night.

Being that, you know, John was still married to someone else at the time.

I mean, I don't particularly care about his infidelities, but that's a curious thing to talk about on national TV.

[OklahomaRed]

Update from U.S. Senator John Cornyn

Wednesday, April 30, 2008

It’s clear that the high price of gasoline tops the list of economic concerns facing Texas families. Despite the recent positive news that the Texas economy is among the strongest in the 50 states, skyrocketing gas prices are hitting Texas families hard, particularly as the summer travel season approaches. 

Too many Texas families are now paying the price for inaction by the Congress. That is unacceptable. Congress can and should take immediate action to improve both our security and our economy by increasing American-based energy production – from exploring ANWR and the Outer Continental Shelf to increasing American refining capacity. Unfortunately, some of my colleagues have continually obstructed any effort to step-up domestic energy production – dating back to President Clinton’s veto to stop such development in ANWR, which would have made available nearly 1,000,000 barrels of oil a day.

Members of Congress on a bipartisan basis must work together to try to bring some of these policies to the floor as soon as possible, without a moment of unnecessary delay. I am working hard to see this action through.

These retard politicians just amaze me. Duh! They all live for "today". We need some campaign finance and term limit reform now. The times have changed. :D