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View Full Version : A little longish, but well written and very worth your time



Okla-homey
4/1/2008, 09:48 AM
By one of the finest minds slinging ink...


The Tall Tale of Tuzla

Hillary Clinton's Bosnian misadventure should disqualify her from the presidency, but the airport landing is the least of it.

By Christopher Hitchens
Posted Monday, March 31, 2008, at 11:26 AM ET

The punishment visited on Sen. Hillary Clinton for her flagrant, hysterical, repetitive, pathological lying about her visit to Bosnia should be much heavier than it has yet been and should be exacted for much more than just the lying itself. There are two kinds of deliberate and premeditated deceit, commonly known as suggestio falsi and suppressio veri. (Neither of them is covered by the additionally lying claim of having "misspoken.")

The first involves what seems to be most obvious in the present case: the putting forward of a bogus or misleading account of events. But the second, and often the more serious, means that the liar in question has also attempted to bury or to obscure something that actually is true. Let us examine how Sen. Clinton has managed to commit both of these offenses to veracity and decency and how in doing so she has rivaled, if not indeed surpassed, the disbarred and perjured hack who is her husband and tutor.

I remember disembarking at the Sarajevo airport in the summer of 1992 after an agonizing flight on a U.N. relief plane that had had to "corkscrew" its downward approach in order to avoid Serbian flak and ground fire. As I hunched over to scuttle the distance to the terminal, a mortar shell fell as close to me as I ever want any mortar shell to fall. The vicious noise it made is with me still. And so is the shock I felt at seeing a civilized and multicultural European city bombarded round the clock by an ethno-religious militia under the command of fascistic barbarians.

I didn't like the Clinton candidacy even then, but I have to report that many Bosnians were enthused by Bill Clinton's pledge, during that ghastly summer, to abandon the hypocritical and sordid neutrality of the George H.W. Bush/James Baker regime and to come to the defense of the victims of ethnic cleansing.

I am recalling these two things for a reason. First, and even though I admit that I did once later misidentify a building in Sarajevo from a set of photographs, I can tell you for an absolute certainty that it would be quite impossible to imagine that one had undergone that experience at the airport if one actually had not.

Yet Sen. Clinton, given repeated chances to modify her absurd claim to have operated under fire while in the company of her then-16-year-old daughter and a USO entertainment troupe, kept up a stone-faced and self-loving insistence that, yes, she had exposed herself to sniper fire in the cause of gaining moral credit and, perhaps to be banked for the future, national-security "experience." This must mean either a) that she lies without conscience or reflection; or b) that she is subject to fantasies of an illusory past; or c) both of the above. Any of the foregoing would constitute a disqualification for the presidency of the United States.

Yet this is only to underline the YouTube version of events and the farcical or stupid or Howard Wolfson (take your pick) aspects of the story. But here is the historical rather than personal aspect, which is what you should keep your eye on. Note the date of Sen. Clinton's visit to Tuzla. She went there in March 1996. By that time, the critical and tragic phase of the Bosnia war was effectively over, as was the greater part of her husband's first term. What had happened in the interim? In particular, what had happened to the 1992 promise, four years earlier, that genocide in Bosnia would be opposed by a Clinton administration?

I can personally remember, first, one of the Clintons' closest personal advisers—Sidney Blumenthal—referring with acid contempt to Warren Christopher as "a blend of Pontius Pilate with Ichabod Crane." I can remember, second, a meeting with Clinton's then-Secretary of Defense Les Aspin at the British Embassy.

When I challenged him on the sellout of the Bosnians, he drew me aside and told me that he had asked the White House for permission to land his own plane at Sarajevo airport, if only as a gesture of reassurance that the United States had not forgotten its commitments. The response from the happy couple was unambiguous: He was to do no such thing, lest it distract attention from the first lady's health care "initiative."

It's hardly necessary for me to point out that the United States did not receive national health care in return for its acquiescence in the murder of tens of thousands of European civilians. But perhaps that is the least of it. Were I to be asked if Sen. Clinton has ever lost any sleep over those heaps of casualties, I have the distinct feeling that I could guess the answer. She has no tears for anyone but herself.

In the end, and over her strenuous objections, the United States and its allies did rescue our honor and did put an end to Slobodan Milosevic and his state-supported terrorism. Yet instead of preserving a polite reticence about this, or at least an appropriate reserve, Sen. Clinton now has the obscene urge to claim the raped and slaughtered people of Bosnia as if their misery and death were somehow to be credited to her account!

Words begin to fail one at this point. Is there no such thing as shame? Is there no decency at last? Let the memory of the truth, and the exposure of the lie, at least make us resolve that no Clinton ever sees the inside of the White House again.

sooneron
4/1/2008, 09:50 AM
A president that lies? What next?
Oh, and I am NOT sticking up for Hillary, just voicing my cynicism.


Oh yeah, and Broken or barely fulfilled campaign promises? No way!

OKC-SLC
4/1/2008, 09:58 AM
good post, Homey.

StoopTroup
4/1/2008, 10:00 AM
Is longish some sort of cheese?

frankensooner
4/1/2008, 10:37 AM
I liked your Uterine Parasite thread better.

NormanPride
4/1/2008, 10:55 AM
So she's a ****ty liar? And somehow because she's a ****ty liar thousands of Bosnians died? Hack.

SoonerInKCMO
4/1/2008, 11:14 AM
Is your "one of the finest minds slinging ink" comment your April Fool's joke? 'Cause I'm guessing you're not a big fan of "God Is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything" ;)

Okla-homey
4/1/2008, 11:26 AM
So she's a ****ty liar? And somehow because she's a ****ty liar thousands of Bosnians died? Hack.

No. Hitchins posits that because she prevailed in forestalling US involvement in the Balkans until after it became apparent her health care scheme was DOA, thousands of Bosnians died horrible deaths in Milosovic's "ethnic cleansing"

Now, she has the gall to take credit for ending the slaughter via the fact she happened to be legally married to WJC when he ordered US involvement in the UN SFOR/IFOR missions in 1996. She also wants us to believe she encouraged WJC to eventually sign that order. Preposterous, but there it is.

Put another way, she helped postpone US involvement that ended the mass-murders for her own selfish purposes. She is evil.

Personally, faced with her or BHO, I'd have to go with BHO. IMHO, he's a starry-eyed idealist, but lacking her cunning, at least he wouldn't be able to do too much damage during a single term -- which, like JEC, is all he'd get.

Okla-homey
4/1/2008, 11:30 AM
Is your "one of the finest minds slinging ink" comment your April Fool's joke? 'Cause I'm guessing you're not a big fan of "God Is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything" ;)


Just because I don't agree with his atheism doesn't mean I don't greatly admire his acumen and writing ability. Moreover, while we don't agree on whether or not God exists, I quite agree with Hitchins there has been, and continues to be, entirely too much evil perpretrated in His name. Where we depart company is his belief the bad outweighs the good done in God's name.

shaun4411
4/1/2008, 11:47 AM
it sure would be nice to have a president that we know, like, and trust.

NormanPride
4/1/2008, 11:58 AM
No. Hitchins posits that because she prevailed in forestalling US involvement in the Balkans until after it became apparent her health care scheme was DOA, thousands of Bosnians died horrible deaths in Milosovic's "ethnic cleansing"

Now, she has the gall to take credit for ending the slaughter via the fact she happened to be legally married to WJC when he ordered US involvement in the UN SFOR/IFOR missions in 1996. She also wants us to believe she encouraged WJC to eventually sign that order. Preposterous, but there it is.

Put another way, she helped postpone US involvement that ended the mass-murders for her own selfish purposes. She is evil.

Personally, faced with her or BHO, I'd have to go with BHO. IMHO, he's a starry-eyed idealist, but lacking her cunning, at least he wouldn't be able to do too much damage during a single term -- which, like JEC, is all he'd get.

Ah, yes. Now that I re-read it I retract my statement. :D

Still, what of this surprises you? She stays married to Bill because he helps her political career. She "moves" to NY to get a shot at a Senatorship with no incumbent. She hops on every leftist bandwagon there is while Bush's criticism is popular, and then when she starts her campaign, she's suddenly "moderate" and "level-headed". At least with Obama we know how loony he's going to be, because he's always been that loony.

Face it, Homester. Politicos have perfected the art of gaining idiot voters, and they so far outnumber the educated/smart ones that it's almost pointless to make your voice heard.

JohnnyMack
4/1/2008, 12:23 PM
No. Hitchins posits that because she prevailed in forestalling US involvement in the Balkans until after it became apparent her health care scheme was DOA, thousands of Bosnians died horrible deaths in Milosovic's "ethnic cleansing"

Now, she has the gall to take credit for ending the slaughter via the fact she happened to be legally married to WJC when he ordered US involvement in the UN SFOR/IFOR missions in 1996. She also wants us to believe she encouraged WJC to eventually sign that order. Preposterous, but there it is.

Put another way, she helped postpone US involvement that ended the mass-murders for her own selfish purposes. She is evil.

Personally, faced with her or BHO, I'd have to go with BHO. IMHO, he's a starry-eyed idealist, but lacking her cunning, at least he wouldn't be able to do too much damage during a single term -- which, like JEC, is all he'd get.

Why was it important for her to postpone US involvement in order to advance her Health Care Scheme? That's what I don't understand.

SoonerProphet
4/1/2008, 12:28 PM
Hitchens has wrote in favor of this current farce in Iraq and in favor of placing the blame for the Yugolsav civil war in the lap of the Serbs. Funny how he calls out a pathological liar, takes one to know one I guess. He is a crank of the worst sort.

Okla-homey
4/1/2008, 12:52 PM
Hitchens has wrote in favor of this current farce in Iraq and in favor of placing the blame for the Yugolsav civil war in the lap of the Serbs. Funny how he calls out a pathological liar, takes one to know one I guess. He is a crank of the worst sort.

I was there. The Serbs were the aggressors. No foolin'.

As far as the Iraqii "farce" goes...still no renewed domestic Al-Q attacks and IMHO, it's irrational to beleive the two are not substantially related. Moreover, I'll always believe Saddam used the final days before our invasion to get his WMD and related paraphenalia to Syria.

TUSooner
4/1/2008, 12:56 PM
Now I'm going to not vote for the lying bytsch TWICE!

SoonerProphet
4/1/2008, 01:20 PM
I was there. The Serbs were the aggressors. No foolin'.

As far as the Iraqii "farce" goes...still no renewed domestic Al-Q attacks and IMHO, it's irrational to beleive the two are not substantially related. Moreover, I'll always believe Saddam used the final days before our invasion to get his WMD and related paraphenalia to Syria.

i thank you for your service.

i am sure you doubt that aq imported fighters into BH to fight against the serbs. seeing how you are such a big lincoln supporter, i am surprised you do not share in milosevic's desire to keep the yugoslav state whole. yeah, i am going to believe the likes of susan sontag, the clinton gang, and wesley clark over actual serbs. tudjman was a fanatical nationalist in croatia with an irredentist ideology and slovenia broke first. again, how was serbia the aggressor?

how many attacks did we have on us soil after 93 and the WTC? i am sure you will give equal billing to the successful clintonista camp for their preventive measures as well. as for syria, sure...the long time antagonists became fast friends, they loaded up on uhauls and shipped them up north. all the while our military and civilian intel groups didn't notice.

that would explain why iraq is such a cluster****.

soonerscuba
4/1/2008, 01:37 PM
And what are we supposed to make of the 98% of the insurgency that isn't AQ? My guess is that they hate our freedom.

texas bandman
4/1/2008, 02:21 PM
Personally, faced with her or BHO, I'd have to go with BHO. IMHO, he's a starry-eyed idealist, but lacking her cunning, at least he wouldn't be able to do too much damage during a single term -- which, like JEC, is all he'd get.

A starry-eyed idealist...I'd vote for that. Jimmy Carter happens to be my favorite president. He was a failure in office because he was truly a decent man and I think decent people get chewed up by Washington. He has done so many positive things since his presidency ended. The job is truly suited for crooks and liars. "Compassionate conservative", my a$$.

SoonerProphet
4/1/2008, 02:28 PM
As if transorming the middle east and making it safe for democracy isn't starry eyed.

TexasLidig8r
4/1/2008, 02:54 PM
it sure would be nice to have a president that we know, like, and trust.

http://msnbcmedia2.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/031208/031208_reaganobit_hmedium.hmedium.jpg

OKC-SLC
4/1/2008, 02:58 PM
http://msnbcmedia2.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/031208/031208_reaganobit_hmedium.hmedium.jpg

word.

Vaevictis
4/1/2008, 03:02 PM
Put another way, she helped postpone US involvement that ended the mass-murders for her own selfish purposes. She is evil.

While I don't disagree with this sentiment (assuming all assumptions are true), I would like to point out that everyone in Washington today can be painted with the same brush vis a vis Darfur.

This includes all candidates in the race today, and the guy sitting in the White House, too.

JohnnyMack
4/1/2008, 03:15 PM
No. Hitchins posits that because she prevailed in forestalling US involvement in the Balkans until after it became apparent her health care scheme was DOA, thousands of Bosnians died horrible deaths in Milosovic's "ethnic cleansing"

How can this be proven?

SoonerProphet
4/1/2008, 03:20 PM
How can this be proven?

It can't because its fiction. There are so many lies around the Clintons and the Balkans it makes my mind spin. The same kinda stuff we see trickle out of Rome on the Potomac these days regarding Iraq. It is pure hogwash to make the ruling class feel good about themselves.

SoonerProphet
4/1/2008, 03:33 PM
Can President Obama help eliminate that problem?

His motivations are the same as the rest, preserve the status quo and continue to feed the beast.

SoonerProphet
4/1/2008, 03:37 PM
http://www.mit.edu/~mike/www/bosnia6.html

soonerboy_odanorth
4/1/2008, 08:26 PM
Well... thank God I'm not alone in thinking we are left with no choice at all this coming fall. Call me when it's 2012.

SoonerKnight
4/2/2008, 02:41 AM
http://msnbcmedia2.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/031208/031208_reaganobit_hmedium.hmedium.jpg

:rolleyes: Iran "don't remember" Contra!!! Every politician lies!!!