Edmond Marine Exonerated

[Okla-homey]

now, let's just hope L/Cpl Tatum gets his life and career back.


Charges dropped against Marine in Haditha case

Mar 28 02:11 PM US/Eastern

Charges against a US Marine allegedly involved in the killing of 24 Iraqi civilians in the town of Haditha were dropped on Friday ahead of his trial, the military said in a statement.

A court martial for lance corporal Stephen Tatum had been due to start on Friday on charges of involuntary manslaughter, reckless endangerment and aggravated assault.

However in a statement released from the Marines Camp Pendleton base outside San Diego, the military said the charges had been dismissed "in order to continue to pursue the truth seeking process into the Haditha incident."

It was not immediately clear if fresh charges could be laid against Tatum at a later date or whether the soldier may now cooperate with prosecutors. [other sources reveal the government's case against L/Cpl Tatum was in fact "dismissed with prejudice" which means the charges are gone forever]

Tatum had been accused of shooting dead two unarmed children as Marines cleared houses near the scene of a deadly roadside bombing in Haditha, 260 kilometers west of Baghdad, on November 19, 2005.

The deaths were part of a grim civilian toll from the Marines' actions in Haditha. Four soldiers were initially charged with murder and four officers accused of staging a cover-up.

However, since charges against the soldiers were first announced in late 2006, prosecutors have struggled to make the allegations stick.

Four of the eight have had charges against them dropped, while charges of murder were replaced by the lesser offence of manslaughter in the cases of Tatum and his squad leader Sergeant Frank Wuterich.

The military investigator overseeing Tatum's pre-trial hearing had recommended all charges against the soldier be dismissed.

The killings in Haditha are the most serious allegations of war crimes leveled at US forces since the 2003 invasion to topple Saddam Hussein.

[yermom]

hmm... the US military decided that someone in the US military didn't commit war crimes

[Okla-homey]

hmm... the US military decided that someone in the US military didn't commit war crimes


and where, pray tell would you have him tried? The Hague?

c'mon bro, you can bet if the government thought it could stick its case against the guy, they would have hung in there. In fact, a conviction would allow the government to say, see, we don't abide this sort of crap and we put the guy who did it in prison.

[yermom]

i'm just sayin

i don't know anything about the case, and i'm not saying he's guilty, i'm just saying that even "the government" and "the military" aren't really the same thing, are they?

it just sounds a little flimsy, i mean what would we think if some Russian or Chinese soldiers were accused of some atrocity and they came out and said "oh yeah, we looked into that, they didn't do anything wrong"

[12]

Love and war. I don't know about the second subject, but I certainly know the first is horrible and WOW is it cruel.

Not saying he did nothing wrong.

[Flagstaffsooner]

I wish all the America hating donks would move to Cuba or N Korea where they have the form of government that they like.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

i'm just sayin

i don't know anything about the case, and i'm not saying he's guilty, i'm just saying that even "the government" and "the military" aren't really the same thing, are they?

it just sounds a little flimsy, i mean what would we think if some Russian or Chinese soldiers were accused of some atrocity and they came out and said "oh yeah, we looked into that, they didn't do anything wrong"

Yermom, what's flimsy is the idea that these boys did anything wrong. They were attacked, they returned fire and under their standing orders, the area was considered hostile. THey were given orders to clear out the area and under their terms of engagement, they were given the leeway to carry out their commanding officers orders. I see no problems here. If you are in a hostile area, get out of it or don't let the insurgents in your area attack armed military people.

The media has trumped up these charges. You know if they are dismissing with prejudice, there is nothing under the UCMJ that was chargable.

[Frozen Sooner]

I wish all the America hating donks would move to Cuba or N Korea where they have the form of government that they like.

I wish all the Constitution-hating republicans would move to Russia where they can have the form of government they like.

[Frozen Sooner]

And yeah, I'm inclined to believe that the charges were investigated pretty seriously. Whether it looks funky to the world or not, our military certainly doesn't want another Calley on their hands.

[OUbones]

It's ironic, usually the people who are first to remind people that the troops are the ones fighting for Americans rights are the first to tell Americans to get the **** out because some are exercising those rights by saying something they don't like.

That being, this is basicly like a rape case where there's no forensic evidence. You've got one side saying one thing and the other saying another and there on concrete evidence supporting either side. By the time it's all said and done I think the charges against all of 8 will be dropped.

[soonerscuba]

I know nothing of military justice, but it seems it would be in the best interest of the gov't to take this stuff very seriously. I mean if American soldiers are given a pass on killing random civilians we start to lose even more credibility in the world. So, I think that if there were enough evidence to convict, they would and it would be wise to do so as a deterent. Basically, at this point I am willing to accept the fact that a crime wasn't committed in this case as we have shown in the past convictions for more minor situations.

[soonerloyal]

Festering genital sores to anyone - from either side of the aisle - who think any military person is probably automatically guilty just because they serve. And double that to anyone who thinks that just because someone is registered to a particular Party, that person can't think for themselves.

I'd wager good money that 99% of military personnel have no patience with "brothers" who make them all look bad by violating their code of ethics, yermom. That's quite a leap for you to make that military leaders might automatically be dirty enough to excuse murder of innocents, just because a warrior is accused of the crimes.

Please. :mad:

God bless the LCpl. and all the other innocent Marines who were unjustly accused and locked up - and branded by the public before the facts were known. Godspeed and Semper Fi.

[olevetonahill]

If Ya aint never seen the Elephant
please just
STFU nOObs
Trust me, Justice is being done .

[Whet]

I wonder if Congressman John Murtha will apologize to these guys? He was so hung ho about proclaiming their guilt!

[yermom]

Festering genital sores to anyone - from either side of the aisle - who think any military person is probably automatically guilty just because they serve. And double that to anyone who thinks that just because someone is registered to a particular Party, that person can't think for themselves.

I'd wager good money that 99% of military personnel have no patience with "brothers" who make them all look bad by violating their code of ethics, yermom. That's quite a leap for you to make that military leaders might automatically be dirty enough to excuse murder of innocents, just because a warrior is accused of the crimes.

Please. :mad:

God bless the LCpl. and all the other innocent Marines who were unjustly accused and locked up - and branded by the public before the facts were known. Godspeed and Semper Fi.

i'm a skeptic and a cynic. like i said, i don't know anything about the story. i didn't say i thought he was guilty, just that the way it read initially sounded weird.

furthermore, not having enough evidence to convict doesn't convey innocence to me. it might mean they can't prove someone is guilty, it still doesn't mean they didn't do it.

does anyone have a good link to the story?

[Frozen Sooner]

Dismissed with prejudice is not the same as "not enough evidence to convict."

[olevetonahill]

Thank you for your Service L/Cpl Tatum
Sorry you had to endure the *******s Of America. :mad:
It goes with the teritory :O
Just sayin

[yermom]

Dismissed with prejudice is not the same as "not enough evidence to convict."

heh, ok i think i saw that somewhere else as i was looking for more info

[yermom]

here's a link to more info:
http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/asection/la-fg-haditha29mar29,1,918989.story

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Yermom, I pretty much summarized the case for you. They were acting under orders and Marines are given leeway to interpret orders. I am pretty sure if the conditions were not met for the interpretation of the order, charges would be filed. Nevertheless, I am sure every good Marine involved will have their career terminated by this incident, even though the charges are dismissed, I doubt if their dossier will be completely clean. I suspect that their military career if they were career is over.

[olevetonahill]

IF they Just snuffed the Folks to Be Snuffing em
they Should see Sparky
If they Made a Mistake Under Combat Stress.
Then we Need to just STFU and let the Military handle it
Cause Ya see a Bunch of them ole Boys Been there done That
Just sayin

[yermom]

Yermom, I pretty much summarized the case for you. They were acting under orders and Marines are given leeway to interpret orders. I am pretty sure if the conditions were not met for the interpretation of the order, charges would be filed. Nevertheless, I am sure every good Marine involved will have their career terminated by this incident, even though the charges are dismissed, I doubt if their dossier will be completely clean. I suspect that their military career if they were career is over.

"he was just following orders" is summarizing the case? :confused:

[olevetonahill]

"he was just following orders" is summarizing the case? :confused:

No bro .:(

[yermom]

again, i'm not commenting on the case anymore. i have no complaint with the verdict.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

"he was just following orders" is summarizing the case? :confused:

Not meaning to pick on you. To me it seems pretty clear cut and a case where they were following orders.

[olevetonahill]

Not meaning to pick on you. To me it seems pretty clear cut and a case where they were following orders.

then Drop it

[AlbqSooner]

Bullets make a kind of singing sound when they whiz past your head. It can interfere with making clear cut decisions in a matter of seconds. The survival instinct is a very strong instinct. If the enemy would all wear uniforms, we could be better assured that civilians would not be shot. Under the circumstances, which thankfully most do not fully comprehend, the soldiers in this instance do not appear to have violated any of the rules of engagement or any generally accepted principles of morality.

[MojoRisen]

I think it is a case of the Media making one because they have the right to hear the enemy complain about a tragic incident.

If this is the same story I watched on 60 minutes about a year ago... I am glad the marines are clear and hope all of them get cleared - the real savagry here is that the enemy hid behind civilians and used "normal combat tactive" to clear the buildings against the marines who were looking for the gunmen. If I remember correctly they did finally catch up with the gunman and the asault riffile 3 houses into the ordeal.

The guy was runing house to house - and the civilians allowed him to do it. SICK on thier behalf. Unfortunate but - we can not fight a war and allow them to have it anyway they want it. All of this was after the same gunman blew up a convoy and killed some soldiers - then fired on them when they were trying to help the wounded.

[soonerloyal]

I wonder if Congressman John Murtha will apologize to these guys? He was so hung ho about proclaiming their guilt!


http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a14/KevAndLori/Posting%20Photos/UpYours.jpg

:D

He was a Marine (yeah WAS, in his case). He should have treated his Brothers better. "S***bird tenpercenter", growls my Airwinger.