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Williesan
2/13/2008, 12:07 AM
From ESPN:

Sources: Indiana faces major violations over calls (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3243325)

Sooner_Havok
2/13/2008, 01:19 AM
HA!

Collier11
2/13/2008, 01:21 AM
this guy is an idiot if this is true

tommieharris91
2/13/2008, 01:30 AM
Goodbye dream job if this happens.

william_brasky
2/13/2008, 07:50 AM
Sampson had better win his National Championship this year, because it doesn't appear that he'll be there next season.

SOONER STEAKER
2/13/2008, 07:55 AM
I always like Sampson when he was at OU because he was a good character guy who worked hard and his team worked hard. It ashame that Kelvin forgot what good character is. The only thing that cheating gets ya is in trouble.
I guess Kelvin will be in the doghouse for the rest of his short career at IU. Whn he gets fired, he'll be a great pitch man for the phone companies..

AlbqSooner
2/13/2008, 07:59 AM
My opinion has changed. I thought the guy was stupid. He is apparently a sociopath.

Sooner_Bob
2/13/2008, 08:08 AM
Good grief. If this is true how could he think he could get away with it this time?


Sampson was hit with more penalties by the school, forfeiting a $500,000 raise, and a scholarship was taken away from the team.

Was that not enough of a reminder?

Crimsontothecore
2/13/2008, 08:49 AM
I hope he ends up so blacklisted from coaching that he has to do Arrid Extra Dry commercials again to pay his bills.

OUmillenium
2/13/2008, 09:28 AM
Wow, I can't believe he kept up with this type of violation.

SoonerStormchaser
2/13/2008, 09:31 AM
Sampson is a good guy. But I've said it already and I'll say it again: As a coach, he isn't cut out for it. I, for one was glad when he left us for Indiana cause I knew this problem was going to be someone's downfall...and I didn't want to see it be OU's problem anymore.

If these allegations are indeed true, which I have no doubt they are, he deserves to get his *** canned and not go near another major program for quite some time.

Big Red Ron
2/13/2008, 09:45 AM
Ha Ha, enjoy Washington State again Kelvin. If they'll take you back.

MextheBulldog
2/13/2008, 09:55 AM
The guy is an egomaniac.

Say what you will about his phone habits, but the guy can coach. Each and every one of you would trade 20-3 for 15-8 right about now. Not to mention the starting five OU would be putting out there had he stuck around.

stoops the eternal pimp
2/13/2008, 10:04 AM
The guy is an egomaniac.

Say what you will about his phone habits, but the guy can coach. Each and every one of you would trade 20-3 for 15-8 right about now. Not to mention the starting five OU would be putting out there had he stuck around.


The guy can coach, no doubt. I personally would trade 15-8 for 20-3 but with Capel coaching.

colleyvillesooner
2/13/2008, 10:08 AM
"BWHAHAHAHAHAHA" or "I told you so...", "BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA" or "I told you so..."

tough choice...

SoonerStormchaser
2/13/2008, 10:11 AM
The guy is an egomaniac.

Say what you will about his phone habits, but the guy can coach. Each and every one of you would trade 20-3 for 15-8 right about now. Not to mention the starting five OU would be putting out there had he stuck around.


I wouldn't.
Watching Sampson b-ball at OU was like watching the NBA in super-slow motion...not to mention that you spent the ENTIRE GAME ripping your hair out cause we were so gawddamn inconsistent. At least with Capel, you know exactly what you're getting, and you know he's busting his *** night after night to make sure his players are giving their best (although they sure as hell haven't played like it recently).

colleyvillesooner
2/13/2008, 10:17 AM
The guy is an egomaniac.

Say what you will about his phone habits, but the guy can coach. Each and every one of you would trade 20-3 for 15-8 right about now. Not to mention the starting five OU would be putting out there had he stuck around.

He can be the greatest coach ever, but if he's gonna cheat, and cheat the same way he got busted for before, I don't want him. And, I'm damn sure I'm in the majority.

OUsooner1
2/13/2008, 10:46 AM
http://www.thermocaster.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/sampson4.jpg

Crimsontothecore
2/13/2008, 11:02 AM
I get tired of hearing what a "good guy" he is. Sampson likes being regarded as a high character person but his actions say otherwise.
I realize IU is a better job than OU and I would feel no bitterness towards Sampson leaving had he left OU on the up and up.
My problem is that he left OU in a mess and bolted for a better job. I was always taught that you clean up your own messes and if Sampson had any REAL character he would have stayed at OU to rectify the problems HE caused.

I'll be grinning from ear to ear the day IU gives him the ax.

fwsooner22
2/13/2008, 11:05 AM
Please someone wipe the "I told you so" grin off my face.........

colleyvillesooner
2/13/2008, 11:45 AM
http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/3082/sampsonaf6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

CtheB
2/13/2008, 12:03 PM
In less than two seasons, this guy has taken one of the most storied programs in college basketball, with a great reputation of following the rules, and trashed it. He is gone, and he deserves it.

How can anyone honestly defend this guy anymore?

sooner n houston
2/13/2008, 01:33 PM
Indiana head men's basketball coach Kelvin Sampson has been cited by the NCAA for acting "contrary to the NCAA principles of ethical conduct" for knowingly violating recruiting restrictions that had been placed upon him, according to a report released by the NCAA Wednesday.

The report details multiple instances of Sampson violating the sanctions imposed upon him in May 2006 by the NCAA after it was discovered that he had made more than 500 impermissible phone calls while he was head coach at Oklahoma. Sampson's penalties followed him to Bloomington, and he was banned from making recruiting phone calls, participating in three-way phone calls or conducting off-campus recruiting visits from May 25, 2006-May 24, 2007.



http://collegebasketball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=774096

the_ouskull
2/13/2008, 01:37 PM
I wouldn't.
Watching Sampson b-ball at OU was like watching the NBA in super-slow motion...not to mention that you spent the ENTIRE GAME ripping your hair out cause we were so gawddamn inconsistent.

And Capel's teams... They're producing more points per game? Like, enough so that you don't feel like you're watching basketball in, quote, "super-slow motion."

Interesting...

Sampson's teams at OU averaged 74.2 points per game. If you take out the two statistical outliers (his first season, in which we averaged 81.7, his best during his Sooner tenure, and his second-to-last season, in which we averaged 66.4... by far his worst, and in large part due to 6 scholly players) the average "jumps" to 74.3, so it is a pretty consistent average.

To date, Capel's teams have averaged 66.8, and 70.6 respectively. In only 3 of Sampson's 11 seasons did his teams score less than 70.6 points per game.

In other words, MEMO TO ALL: Quit trotting out the whole, "Capel's teams are so much more fun to watch because they score more," argument against Sampson. If you want to call him out for using the phone too much, that's fine, but years and years of people calling his teams "boring," and saying that they played "slow-it-down" ball are just inaccurate. It's a tired argument that has become a party line, typically spouted off by people that don't have any REAL argument against the man, so they regurgitate the same lines they've heard other people say, over and over. They're not only tired, but they're false.

"Boring" is a matter of opinion, yes. But if you are trying to say that Capel's teams are "fun and up-tempo," and Sampson's teams were "slow and boring," then please know that you're going to be dismissed as an idiot by anybody that knows anything about basketball... or anybody that knows how to read. EVERY team has scoring droughts. Duke. UNC. Kansas. EVERY team.

In 2005/2006, Sampson's last season at OU, the Sooners averaged 75.2 ppg. By the same token, Duke averaged 81 ppg. 6 more points per game than Sampson. Hardly the epitome of excitement. Kansas averaged 78.4. That's about 3 points per game more than OU did that season. I know that I get excited over more one three made in a game. What about Kentucky? They're ALWAYS good, right? 70.8 ppg.

Hmmm...

Uh... Michigan? 71.7.
What about the National Champs? The Florida Gators?

In 2005/2006 they averaged a hearty 78.3 ppg. That's 3.1 more than OU did that year. Now how many of you felt that THEY were exciting?

If you don't like Sampson, that's fine. Don't like the guy. But don't trot out the party line just because you don't have a good reason for not liking him... especially when the party line is wrong.

Now, as far as these recent allegations go... I hope that they're wrong. I do. But, the whole smoke/fire thing worries me. Also, there's a history of improper behavior now, so it makes it easier to 1) believe, and 2) spot when it happens again. If Kelvin is cheating, then yes, by all means, he deserves to be punished, and, at this point, it's going to hurt more than his wrist. But, if he's "cheating," then a long, hard look needs to be taken at what, exactly, constitutes a violation in the eyes of the as-we-all-know-quite-screwed-up NCAA. That's my $0.02 on that.

the_ouskull

Collier11
2/13/2008, 01:38 PM
http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107994

boomersooner28
2/13/2008, 01:40 PM
KS is toast.

Collier11
2/13/2008, 01:44 PM
And Capel's teams... They're producing more points per game? Like, enough so that you don't feel like you're watching basketball in, quote, "super-slow motion."

Interesting...

Sampson's teams at OU averaged 74.2 points per game. If you take out the two statistical outliers (his first season, in which we averaged 81.7, his best during his Sooner tenure, and his second-to-last season, in which we averaged 66.4... by far his worst, and in large part due to 6 scholly players) the average "jumps" to 74.3, so it is a pretty consistent average.

To date, Capel's teams have averaged 66.8, and 70.6 respectively. In only 3 of Sampson's 11 seasons did his teams score less than 70.6 points per game.

In other words, MEMO TO ALL: Quit trotting out the whole, "Capel's teams are so much more fun to watch because they score more," argument against Sampson. If you want to call him out for using the phone too much, that's fine, but years and years of people calling his teams "boring," and saying that they played "slow-it-down" ball are just inaccurate. It's a tired argument that has become a party line, typically spouted off by people that don't have any REAL argument against the man, so they regurgitate the same lines they've heard other people say, over and over. They're not only tired, but they're false.

"Boring" is a matter of opinion, yes. But if you are trying to say that Capel's teams are "fun and up-tempo," and Sampson's teams were "slow and boring," then please know that you're going to be dismissed as an idiot by anybody that knows anything about basketball... or anybody that knows how to read. EVERY team has scoring droughts. Duke. UNC. Kansas. EVERY team.

In 2005/2006, Sampson's last season at OU, the Sooners averaged 75.2 ppg. By the same token, Duke averaged 81 ppg. 6 more points per game than Sampson. Hardly the epitome of excitement. Kansas averaged 78.4. That's about 3 points per game more than OU did that season. I know that I get excited over more one three made in a game. What about Kentucky? They're ALWAYS good, right? 70.8 ppg.

Hmmm...

Uh... Michigan? 71.7.
What about the National Champs? The Florida Gators?

In 2005/2006 they averaged a hearty 78.3 ppg. That's 3.1 more than OU did that year. Now how many of you felt that THEY were exciting?

If you don't like Sampson, that's fine. Don't like the guy. But don't trot out the party line just because you don't have a good reason for not liking him... especially when the party line is wrong.

Now, as far as these recent allegations go... I hope that they're wrong. I do. But, the whole smoke/fire thing worries me. Also, there's a history of improper behavior now, so it makes it easier to 1) believe, and 2) spot when it happens again. If Kelvin is cheating, then yes, by all means, he deserves to be punished, and, at this point, it's going to hurt more than his wrist. But, if he's "cheating," then a long, hard look needs to be taken at what, exactly, constitutes a violation in the eyes of the as-we-all-know-quite-screwed-up NCAA. That's my $0.02 on that.

the_ouskull


I see where you are coming from but I do see Capels teams as being more entertaining, obviously not due to the scoring but because he has players that fit his style.

DFQGrounds
2/13/2008, 02:02 PM
Heard many stories from people associated with the bball program while Sampson was at OU -- some good and some bad BUT I can tell you I think OU looks much better now for Sampson being gone! It is one thing to make a mistake and learn from it -- but to try and keep doing it is plain DUMB!

I think Joe has done a good job getting quality coaches who are QUALITY people into OU and I hope that it stays that way!

OUmillenium
2/13/2008, 02:32 PM
Kelvin was a solid defense/rebounding/intensity coach. Offensively he was/is clueless.

Capel is still battling low player #s due to Kelvin's screw ups here.

Once Capel has a full compliment of players we will be back to 20+ wins a year...without cheating.

Taxman71
2/13/2008, 02:45 PM
I think the lack of offensive production under Capel so far has been due almost exclusively to lack of talent. Not only do we not have any true scorers (except for Blake Griffin this year), but we have had a talent and depth deficiency as a whole and have been forced to slow the game down...hence less scoring and scoring opportunities.

I think Sampson had the talent to score much more than he did, but he always has and always will coach a physical, beat you up on defense style which emphasizes defense and rebounding and offense is where the players catch their breath. His style definitely wins, but his offensive sets were horrid to watch.

Didn't Ryan Minor have his breakout year during Sampson's first season? Might explain the higher PPG.

MextheBulldog
2/13/2008, 02:52 PM
Give me slow and boring wins vs. an average 'entertaining' team every day of the week.

SoonerStormchaser
2/13/2008, 02:54 PM
Skull,
I never implied that we were scoring more under Capel. I just stated that they're more fun to watch because they don't look like it's super-slow motion.

Crimsontothecore
2/13/2008, 03:41 PM
My favorite part of the ESPN article is where it says "Sampson did not return calls left by ESPN.com"
I can only assume he was low on minutes.

stoops the eternal pimp
2/13/2008, 03:47 PM
My favorite part of the ESPN article is where it says "Sampson did not return calls left by ESPN.com"
I can only assume he was low on minutes.


No..Everybody knows you don't call Sampson. Sampson calls you.

wishbonesooner
2/13/2008, 04:45 PM
I hope ole Kelvin has been socking away a bunch of those big paychecks. He'll be lucky to find an NAIA job.

mfosterftw
2/13/2008, 04:46 PM
http://www.tmnews.com/stories/2008/02/13/news.nw-926905.tms

http://webpages.charter.net/mactartan/Marc/sampson28.jpg

badger
2/13/2008, 05:17 PM
Skull,
I never implied that we were scoring more under Capel. I just stated that they're more fun to watch because they don't look like it's super-slow motion.
How bout this: Capel is more fun to watch because:

1- He is not a jerk like KS.
2- He is recruiting talent and not wasting it like KS.
3- He is a young, rising star and not an old, angry man like KS.
4- He is a positive role model for our players and our young fans, unlike KS.
5- He gives you a positive feeling about the future of our program, unlike KS.
6- He gives you the confidence that your school is winning by following the rules, unlike KS.
7- When OU wins, you actually watched the entire game because it was fun, unlike the era of KS.

Capel, we love you and we are so incredibly happy you are here and not KS.

Frozen Sooner
2/13/2008, 07:02 PM
1. Kelvin Sampson was pretty cordial every time I met him.
2. Kelvin got to a Final Four, Two Elite Eights, Three Sweet Sixteens vs. no postseason at all for Capel. Not sure how you can make this statement.
3. Kelvin was pretty young when he got the OU job.
4. I can agree with that.
5. I agree that I have a positive feeling about the future of the program, but I did with Sampson as well.
6. Prior to the phone allegations coming out, we all thought Sampson was playing inside the rules.
7. OU wins are always fun.

That being said, I'm not defending him anymore. He's braided a rope out of his own denim shirt. He needs to hang by it now.

MojoRisen
2/13/2008, 08:04 PM
Sampson would be fired already if he didn't land Eric Gordon... That is like having an NBA all star & potential great playing for you. I feel that guy is that good.

Kelvin - would was a damn good recruiter - he cheated to do it as it turns out though. Kelvin had some really quality players under him when we were exciting under him. The Final 4 and Elite 8 teams had some searious scoring capabilities and were pretty deep. when we had less talen I wanted too vomit watching his teams - effective maybe to an extent but too me wasn't what I call basketball. I will take a Kansas style at 78 points a game any day of the week.

KantoSooner
2/13/2008, 10:28 PM
I am so very very happy he is gone from OU. Just what we would need: a loose cannon coach who simply couldn't understand that the NCAA, for better or worse, really can shut down your program(s).
So very, very happy he is gone.
Commiseration to IU, but they knew what they were getting.

stoops the eternal pimp
2/13/2008, 11:33 PM
Crowd gave him a mixed reaction at home tonight..and they lost which isnt good

Soonerus
2/13/2008, 11:41 PM
Kelvin is a great guy, I am totally bamboozled by these allegations...he could be fired...

Blue
2/13/2008, 11:51 PM
Kelvin is a great guy, I am totally bamboozled by these allegations...he could be fired...

How did the allegations fool you?

Soonerus
2/13/2008, 11:53 PM
How did the allegations fool you?

I guess I naively did not think he would repeat the same transgressions... I feel sorry for him...

Ground_Attack
2/13/2008, 11:59 PM
sorry for him or sorry for the school and fanbase that he has embarassed? (for the second time)

SoonerObsession
2/14/2008, 12:17 AM
I'm just glad Capel doesn't make his players lock arms like a frigg'n broke back bench squad.

Seriously though, I know two highschool coaches and one basketball trainer who say that Sampson was very two-sided. Behind closed doors he was not the same person. One of the coaches said he had to personally tell Sampson to back off of a 12 year old kid because Kelvin was cursing at him. The kid sat on a basketball at one of his camps during a break time and Sampson cussed him out with all kinds of explatives. All three coaches agreed that Sampson could coach, but he was not who he appeared to be on camera.

Blue
2/14/2008, 12:25 AM
Sometimes I think Indiana hired Sampson just to stick it to Bobby Knight one more time. It was known Knight was not a Sampson fan.

DFQGrounds
2/14/2008, 07:38 AM
The two-sided person is what I spoke of earlier -- I know we all can be different at times BUT I know people who told me Sampson was like night-day different. His public persona and his private were so opposite that most people would not believe it unless they were able to experience it!

Crimsontothecore
2/14/2008, 08:16 AM
Kelvin is a great guy, I am totally bamboozled by these allegations...he could be fired...
Yeah, a real stand-up guy.
http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd53/mollytrixie/05788546552.jpg

the_ouskull
2/14/2008, 09:07 AM
Kelvin was a solid defense/rebounding/intensity coach. Offensively he was/is clueless.

Read the board, don't just write on it.

the_ouskull

the_ouskull
2/14/2008, 09:09 AM
How did the allegations fool you?

They tapped him on his left shoulder, and, when he turned to his left, they ran around to his right?

I got nothin'. :D

the_ouskull

the_ouskull
2/14/2008, 09:20 AM
How bout this: Capel is more fun to watch because:

1- He is not a jerk like KS.

He was never anything but nice to me in any dealings that I had with him, personal or professional. Others whose opinions I greatly value had similiar experiences.

2- He is recruiting talent and not wasting it like KS.

"Wasting talents?" If you're referring to a few players who got here and realized that Kelvin MEANT everything that he said about hard work and intensity, and decided they'd rather be coddled elsewhere, then okay. But, given his track record at OU, wins-wise, you'd better hold off on throwing Sampson under the bus for a guy that hasn't made the postseason, NCAA's or otherwise, while wearing the Crimson and Cream.

3- He is a young, rising star and not an old, angry man like KS.

How broad is the brush with which you paint THIS stroke? Capel's young, so he's "a rising star," and Kelvin's older, so he's "angry." I suppose he's crotchety too? Is Capel a whippersnapper?

4- He is a positive role model for our players and our young fans, unlike KS.

Currently, this is a point with which I have no choice but to agree.

5- He gives you a positive feeling about the future of our program, unlike KS.

People, you can't have your cake. Don't get mad at Kelvin for the players that left... players which would have made an enormous difference while at OU, and then say that you felt that the future of our program was in question while he was here. Which is it? I feel like we're headed in the right direction under Capel, yes, but short-term, he's a step back, and long-term remains to be seen. Virginia Commonwealth is NOT OU.

6- He gives you the confidence that your school is winning by following the rules, unlike KS.

Three years ago, this argument was nonexistent. Kelvin's been gone for almost two full years. One year out of 11, with allegations coming out AFTER the season, is hardly cause for feeling like "Sampson was winning outside of the rules."

7- When OU wins, you actually watched the entire game because it was fun, unlike the era of KS.

If you're a real fan, you don't stop watching the game, and you don't watch part of the game. Frustration or not, you watch, and root/cheer the whole game. If this is a problem, try on some orange. Seems to me like it might be a better fit for you.

Capel, we love you and we are so incredibly happy you are here and not KS.

Ah. The jist comes out. Don't get me wrong, I'm not UNhappy with Capel, but I'm ready to see our program do great things NOW. We were doing rather well under Kelvin, and, with Capel, we've taken a step back. Is it to take a step forward? That remains to be seen. BUT, the fact is, under Capel, to date, we've taken a step back. I feel like he'll get us to where we WERE, no problem. But, will he get us to where we want to be? That also remains to be seen.

the_ouskull

badger
2/14/2008, 10:23 AM
Skully, I stand by my 1-7 list, despite your refutes. I've seen "the other side" of KS, the side that doesn't include the "take the players home to watch movies and have Wife Sampson make dinner." He is kind of like that other guy described about yelling at a 12-year-old.

I'm not saying I didn't watch the entire game, but it was obvious that others were not.

As far as "wasting talent" goes, it was obvious that a certain type of player thrived in his patented system. However, after all the trips to the NCAA's, he started recruiting All-Americans, which are good players, but not good for his system. That's why many transferred and a few, like Longar Longar, did not shine until he was gone.

I'm not bashing KS's age, I'm bashing this alternate universe personality which apparently few have seen.

I supported KS when he was here, but now that he is gone, I'm happy that he is ruining another school's future, and not ours (although it would be best if he not ruin any school's future). I'm not going to wear orange as you suggested, but if KS wants to... hehe, that would be highly amusing.

cheezyq
2/14/2008, 10:31 AM
The one thing I miss about KS is that we played some hellacious man-to-man defense most of the time. We play some good defense now, too, but there was something different about KS team defense.

However, what I do like about Capel is that he's willing to pull out of the man-to-man and make some adjustments when necessary. KS did try to do some of that during the last couple of years here, but IMO it wasn't working like he wanted it to, and he used it only as a last-ditch effort to stop a particular guy. Capel uses it as part of an actual strategy.

Skull, you've made the point that OU scored more under KS and that somehow invalidates the argument that Capel's teams are more exciting. I disagree. I realize we're not scoring more yet, but I think the biggest reason for that is poor outside shooting, not offensive philosophy. Watching the offense w/ Capel vs. w/ KS, there is a distinct difference. I think we're getting more out of our post players than we ever did during the KS days, and if our outside guys could hit a shot or two, we're a really good team. We may not be producing more points yet, but the offense IS more exciting.

Part of the problem is that JC has been running a fire drill just trying to keep players on the team. He DOESN'T have his players yet. Last year, he had to put together a last-ditch recruiting effort just to plug all the holes from the players that de-committed. To even have us in the conversation for the NIT or NCAA (which we were at one point) last year was a heck of a job for a first-year coach.

This year he's dealt with injuries and academic issues, and has been lucky to even field a front-line with players taller than 6-5. Yet again, we're seriously in the NCAA tourney conversation. We've won against good teams on the road, something that rarely happened under KS. This is despite having a backcourt that can't shoot.

Don't get me wrong, KS was a good coach (aside from the cheating), and I was disappointed to see him go, at first. But in the short time that JC has been here, he's done a remarkable job. It's too early to put him in the "good coach" category, but I think he'll end up a better coach than KS. Heck, KS might not even be a coach much longer.

I think the excitement around Capel is justified. Defending KS when he was here is fine, but there's no reason to put down Capel while doing so.

Ash
2/14/2008, 10:36 AM
the_ouskull

Yeah we've taken a step back. Because the pieces were all there when Sampson left, Capel's just didn't put it together. :rolleyes:

badger
2/14/2008, 10:43 AM
CAAAAA-PELLLLLL! CAAAAAA-PELLLLL!

See, that just has a better ring to it than the alternative :D

We can all appreciate what KS did while he was here, as far as winning and losing. We had a lot of good runs and could consistently make the Dance.

Unfortunately, that has come to pass. KS chose to move on, so I have chosen to move on, and wow, after hearing all the recent crap, am I glad that we moved on, too.

Joe C. has told donors at speaking events how embarrassing that mess was with "failure to monitor" and "impermissable calling" or whatever. I was embarrassed, too. OU had just promised to clean up its act after the two idiots left campus, and now THIS, just months after?!

It was embarrassing, and that is why I'm looking forward to Capel-ball for years to come. Indiana, you made your choice. Deeeeal with it.

CAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA-PELLLLLLL! CAAAAAAAAAA-PELLLLLLLLLL!
:D

stoops the eternal pimp
2/14/2008, 10:48 AM
It is a shame after all he did contribute to the program that he left with things like they were. And he tarnished his reputation and his legacy not just with committing NCAA infractions, but repeating them over and over.

I will not defend him on any front because he has done this to himself. His behavior and blatant disrespect of the rules and regulations set before him is why I don't have any sympathy towards him. Do I dislike him? Never met the guy? Did I like his coaching style? OU won with him as coach but I did get frustrated with him..But they won a lot of games so I just chalked my responses up to being a fan.

When other fans complain or have bad feelings about they guy, he doesn't deserve my defending him.

stoopified
2/14/2008, 11:09 AM
KS has now shown his TRUE colors;he IS a liar and a cheat.Case closed and thank God he is Indiana's problem and not OU's.

birddog
2/14/2008, 11:54 AM
Never met the guy?

you're being a little too harsh with your self-interrogation.:D


"so i says to myself, self, have you ever met the guy?"

Bourbon St Sooner
2/14/2008, 12:31 PM
I realize IU is a better job than OU and I would feel no bitterness towards Sampson leaving had he left OU on the up and up.
My problem is that he left OU in a mess and bolted for a better job.

I really think the leaving was mutual at that point. He had worn out his welcome with Joe C. Not that he was going to be fired immediately, but he was definitely on notice. He just lucked out that Indiana was stupid enough to want him.

Bourbon St Sooner
2/14/2008, 12:32 PM
Where is Nicky defending his favorite coach?

Blue
2/14/2008, 03:32 PM
He might of averaged over 70 in the regular season, but why is it I remember struggling to get 50 points in conference like 60 times?

OUMonster
2/14/2008, 03:46 PM
Where is Nicky defending his favorite coach?


Funny you should ask. He goes by Luke the Drifter over on another board.

http://www.soonertimesbb.com/forums/view_topic.php?id=3462&forum_id=2&page=1


LtD/NickZepp: "I hope this goes away because he's a great coach. But if it doesn't maybe we can get him back in a couple years. He's flat out a great, great coach. Wish we could have kept him."

Crimsontothecore
2/14/2008, 03:47 PM
I don't know why Sampsons coaching ability is even a topic of conversation.
I don't care if the guy is the second coming of John Wooden, he's still a lier and chronic cheater..period.

cb4ou
2/14/2008, 03:49 PM
He will be gone soon. They are just trying to figure out how to handle it.

From ESPN:

Indiana is reviewing all of its legal options to avoid a lawsuit similar to what Ohio State went through with former men's basketball coach Jim O'Brien, ESPN.com has learned. O'Brien sued the school when he was fired before the NCAA had ruled on his case. O'Brien eventually won the lawsuit against Ohio State.

Sampson could have a similar situation if he is terminated for cause prior to the NCAA officially ruling on a violation. Indiana has 90 days to respond to the enforcement staff's notice of allegations. A hearing in front of the committee on infractions won't occur until June, and a decision usually takes anywhere from a few weeks to a few months before it's rendered.


Indiana is unlikely to wait that long to resolve Sampson's status.

birddog
2/14/2008, 04:02 PM
well that didn't last long.

hope he coaches osu next. saweeet.

Taxman71
2/14/2008, 04:47 PM
Sampson was unquestionably a very good coach. However, can you imagine how his current "major" violations would have impacted OU's entire athletic department after the last two years? We are talking major, major sanctions if he were still here. We should all be very thankful he isn't because even a NC in basketball would not be worth what the NCAA would have done to us if he did this again while at OU.

badger
2/14/2008, 04:52 PM
well that didn't last long.

hope he coaches osu next. saweeet.
how well does a blue denim shirt go with an orange tie?

william_brasky
2/14/2008, 04:58 PM
article form the IndyStar IU beat writer: http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080214/COLUMNISTS01/802140501/

tulsaoilerfan
2/14/2008, 06:53 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if he is gone by the weekend

melveaz
2/14/2008, 08:38 PM
I always like Sampson when he was at OU because he was a good character guy who worked hard and his team worked hard. It ashame that Kelvin forgot what good character is. The only thing that cheating gets ya is in trouble.
I guess Kelvin will be in the doghouse for the rest of his short career at IU. Whn he gets fired, he'll be a great pitch man for the phone companies..
I guess you don't spend a lot of time around the rumor mill if you believed that. I heard he was a mean son of a bitch. Cussing at cheerleaders, high school students who came to practice, etc. I also he was intoxicated with some ladies not named Mrs. Sampson at Club Rodeo. All rumors, of course.

Rock Hard Corn Frog
2/15/2008, 12:13 AM
Sampson was unquestionably a very good coach. However, can you imagine how his current "major" violations would have impacted OU's entire athletic department after the last two years? We are talking major, major sanctions if he were still here. We should all be very thankful he isn't because even a NC in basketball would not be worth what the NCAA would have done to us if he did this again while at OU.


Agreed but I think the key word is was. I would say he is about to start an early retirement. I appreciate 80% of what he did at OU but the other 20% we could have done without.

CtheB
2/15/2008, 07:40 AM
Agree, RHCF, but, to me, as the expectations of the OU basketball program started to grow, they started to underachieve. Sans the NCAA issues, is Kelvin Sampson the Dennis Franchione of college basketball?

sooneron
2/15/2008, 09:06 AM
I really think the leaving was mutual at that point. He had worn out his welcome with Joe C. Not that he was going to be fired immediately, but he was definitely on notice. He just lucked out that Indiana was stupid enough to want him.
Yeah, anyone that thinks that KS just bolted without any encouragement is retarded.
I met Kelvin a few times and he was very cordial to being downright nice. I appreciate what he did here, but his legacy is completely tarnished. His teams were sometimes painful to watch, but they played their azzes off and I appreciate that. I also appreciate good bball D (bad boys fan).
Claiming Capel as a rising star is a pretty premature at this point. I guess you could say he was on the basis of going from VC to OU, but he needs to take the next step and soon. KS was called a rising star and a coach that was coveted back in the late 90's. He followed it up with some trips that were deep into the dance. We'll see about Jeff.

King Crimson
2/15/2008, 09:17 AM
Yeah, anyone that thinks that KS just bolted without any encouragement is retarded.


i can tell you from pretty much first hand knowledge Kelvin was encouraged to look for another job by David Boren if he ever wanted another raise (outside of winning it all). it what it is, me posting on the internet, but i'm talking about someone who has been associated with OU, the AD, and the legal apparatus at OU (like contracts) for 30+ years. this person negotiated some of Billy Tubbs contracts at OU.

tru2ou
2/15/2008, 05:39 PM
Didnt like Kelvin or his style when he was here so I get a chuckle watching all of this happen now.

Of course, I really enjoyed Billyball when I was in school. Scoring 170+ on my birthday made me a believer.

tru

badger
2/15/2008, 07:52 PM
So... um... where will he go after this? Of course somebody will give a winning coach a chance even after mistakes, NCAA and otherwise. Look at UCLA's new football coach. Look at the UTEP football coach. Both had tarnished reps, but got another chance.

I personally think that neither of Sampson's old stints would take him back. Washington State has a good coach in Bennett (proof that coach's sons CAN inherit programs and make them better!) and OU wants no part of anything the NCAA would sanction them for.

Frozen Sooner
2/15/2008, 07:59 PM
I have a feeling he's heading to the NAIA ranks for a while, or perhaps he'll get on as an NBA assistant somewhere. I think that NCAA institutions will give him a wide berth for the time being.

Actually, I bet Pembroke State would love to have him. That's where I'm putting my bet. Pembroke State.

Mjcpr
2/15/2008, 09:01 PM
I'm confused by all of this. Kelvin was here for a long time and I never heard a bad word about him until the phone call thing. I liked Kelvin and I thought he did a pretty good job with our program. I can't blame him for leaving OU to go to Indiana, that's a no brainer for a college basketball coach. When we let those guys out of their ROI's and they all bailed, that's why we were in such bad shape, I can't say that I blame Kelvin for that......except for the phone call thing. And resulting probation. But it wasn't like the death penalty or something.

Then he goes to IU, lands a big name guy, has success and then there is the phone issue again. I don't get it. If it was Bob Huggins suddenly landing the best player in the nation at KSU, I could beleive the cheating allegations.....I just don't understand it with Kelvin.

Maybe he's a big, fat too many phone calls cheater and everything that's being said is true. But it just doesn't make any sense to me. I still like the guy so I hope it isn't, but it's not looking good.

mdklatt
2/16/2008, 01:07 AM
However, can you imagine how his current "major" violations would have impacted OU's entire athletic department after the last two years? We are talking major, major sanctions if he were still here.

The ESPN peeps are talking like IU may get the hammer dropped on them because they should have known to keep a close eye in him.

1stTimeCaller
2/16/2008, 01:56 AM
Funny you should ask. He goes by Luke the Drifter over on another board.


Nick should have his *** beaten for numerous reasons, sullying Hank Sr.'s good name like that might be at the top of the list.

the_ouskull
2/16/2008, 12:45 PM
I like how, when I post facts. Not opinions, but FACTS, deconstructing the major argument against Sampson (in the past) - that his teams didn't score, people then change their tune and start saying that it's a matter of opinion and that Capel's brand of basketball is more exciting because he gets more out of his posts.

When Sampson was here, we had 1 NBA-caliber player in Eduardo Najera. With Capel here, we have Blake Griffin, and possibly Taylor. (Something that, when I said it two years ago, people laughed... Amusing.) If Tony Crocker puts on about 20 pounds of muscle and develops a consistent handle and outside shot, then we may have three, but I doubt it. Most likely, we have one. (No, Longar Longar is NOT "NBA-material," and the sooner those of you that think he is realizes it, the better off you'll be; at least basketball-knowledge-wise.)

I'm not comparing the two coaches in a negative manner, because I really do like Capel as our coach. I just also happened to like Coach Sampson, and I don't want to sit here and watch people tee off on him... at least not for the wrong reasons. Just like every other coach in the world, when he's got good players that fit his system well, he looks great. When he doesn't, he doesn't. I feel like Kelvin got more out of marginal players than Capel does, currently, but Kelvin is also a much, much more experienced coach. Capel is a good coach now with the potential, especially due to his youth and enthusiasm, to become a great one. Kelvin is a great coach now. That's the only major difference.

Well, that and roughly 500ish phone calls... allegedly.

the_ouskull

Frozen Sooner
2/16/2008, 01:00 PM
Hey, don't forget Ryan Minor. He was drafted by the NBA!

(Sure, it was in the second round and I don't think they ever even got around to stitching his name on his uniform or assigning him a locker or anything...)

Blue
2/16/2008, 02:24 PM
I can't believe you can't admit that Kelvins teams were boring as all hell half of the time. I rarely see Capels teams struggle to get 50 points. Kelvins did all the time. They might have evened it out over the season with some higher scores, but it was a major issue of those teams.

1stTimeCaller
2/16/2008, 06:34 PM
Kelvin never did anything with any of the big men he recruited. Look at Longar Longar's vast improvement under Capel.

He just didn't know how to coach big men.

stoops the eternal pimp
2/16/2008, 06:44 PM
.



I'm not comparing the two coaches in a negative manner, because I really do like Capel as our coach. I just also happened to like Coach Sampson, and I don't want to sit here and watch people tee off on him... at least not for the wrong reasons.


I don't like him but it doesn't have anything to do his being boring or anything like that. I don't because he has a issue of breaking rules and then continuing to do it. He damaged the basketball program and is about to do it to another one.

Personally, I didn't know his teams scored that high and thats good information if that is someone's argument against him. All I remember is the long scoring droughts in crucial parts of some big games. But that happens

Big Red Ron
2/16/2008, 06:45 PM
Hey, don't forget Ryan Minor. He was drafted by the NBA!

(Sure, it was in the second round and I don't think they ever even got around to stitching his name on his uniform or assigning him a locker or anything...)I consider him a Tubbs guy that happened to play for Sampson too.

Newbomb Turk
2/16/2008, 07:09 PM
Kelvin never did anything with any of the big men he recruited. Look at Longar Longar's vast improvement under Capel.

He just didn't know how to coach big men.

I consider him a Sampson guy that just happened to play for Capel too.

;)

Big Red Ron
2/16/2008, 07:12 PM
I consider him a Sampson guy that just happened to play for Capel too.

;)Can't argue that. The difference in my mind would be that Minor got worse and Longer got better.

Newbomb Turk
2/16/2008, 07:16 PM
just a play on your post.

MojoRisen
2/16/2008, 08:09 PM
Kelvin - I understand is an egotistactal maniac - now you see him now you don't - he absolutely cheats- he knows the rules....

Also - those guys that went Europe were all americans - Mcghee and H Price and white was pretty good.

stoops the eternal pimp
2/16/2008, 08:23 PM
According to an ESPN article this so called "7 day investigation" is just legal mumbo jumbo for firing Sampon but doing it in a way were he cant sue the school

stoops the eternal pimp
2/16/2008, 08:28 PM
Digger just said Calvin simpson is gonna lose his job.

Digger still gets on my nerves in how he deals with KS. Seems pretty happy about the whole thing

birddog
2/16/2008, 08:35 PM
dickie v is ripping calvin simpson a new stink hole.

stoops the eternal pimp
2/16/2008, 08:35 PM
Now Vitale is digging at him..I just dont get it..Why KS why?

edit: I just saw your post bd

bluedogok
2/16/2008, 09:02 PM
Hey, don't forget Ryan Minor. He was drafted by the NBA!

(Sure, it was in the second round and I don't think they ever even got around to stitching his name on his uniform or assigning him a locker or anything...)
He did get the honor of being the player who replaced Cal Ripken Jr. in the lineup at Third Base when he ended the consecutive game streak.

For those of us who grew up on "Billyball" both Calvin's and Capel's teams play is "boring". We just witnessed an incredible time in college basketball, there were many teams who played the up-tempo style back then, OU, UNLV, Loyola-Marymount, Pacific, they were great fun to watch espcecially the games with UNLV. The only problem with comparing ANY team now to the "Billyball" era is no one plays the up-tempo style anymore, instead of the speed game it is a plod and crush physical game. I think the refs wouldn't allow the up-tempo game like it was back then anyway, they would call fouls just to slow the game down....which I think they did some back then. Maybe that is one reason why I don't watch as much as I used to.

birddog
2/16/2008, 09:13 PM
calvin's lost quite a few lbs. the stress he's under must be keeping him up all hours of the night, every night.

i just don't know how you could knowingly make the same mistake at your new job.

of course, we still need to see how this plays out. hell, i don't even know specifically what the allegations are.

Rogue
2/16/2008, 09:14 PM
I was a big defender of KS...until he hurt the football team. Bob Stoops and Co. got hit harder b/c it was on the heels of Kelvin-gate. That's right...I will always believe that the overpaid crybaby KS was more responsible than the two 18 year old kids with no-show jobs for the NCAA trying to erase a football season from the record books.

I spent hours arguing with friends who were mad every year when he "pimped himself out for other jobs every year." I defended his record and his consistent winning teams, very decent tournament record, and player development. I was proud of him chairing the coaching ethics committee and coaching the olympic team. Why was I so blind? Why wouldn't I listen to reason? Why wouldn't I take off the crimson colored glasses?

Now...he's the Bill Belichick of CBB.

And somehow IU are the "victims" tonight. **** him!

Blue
2/16/2008, 09:17 PM
I still think he was a good coach for us. I think we've got a better one in Capel, though.

Rogue
2/16/2008, 09:24 PM
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Tcq6ZMDGXYI

He has managed to hurt a Top 10 All Time Football Program at OU and a Top 10 All Time Basketball Program at IU.

meoveryouxinfinity
2/16/2008, 09:48 PM
Did Sampson's basketball phone calls at OU have any influence on the NCAA's ruling of "lack of institutional control" during the "Bomar thing?"


I know the sooner haters suggest that it was yet another example of cheating an institutional control. I almost threw up when I heard Dick Vitale talking about what a "clean" program Indiana is and how that university does not deserve this. Umm, yeah, nobody gave us a pass with Sampson.

Rogue
2/16/2008, 09:53 PM
Did Sampson's basketball phone calls at OU have any influence on the NCAA's ruling of "lack of institutional control" during the "Bomar thing?"


I know the sooner haters suggest that it was yet another example of cheating an institutional control. I almost threw up when I heard Dick Vitale talking about what a "clean" program Indiana is and how that university does not deserve this. Umm, yeah, nobody gave us a pass with Sampson.

I'll always believe it did. Otherwise it's two 18 y.o. kids with no-show jobs that were immediately kicked off the team by the head coach. Action-reaction. Thanks to KS, it was a "pattern."

Frozen Sooner
2/16/2008, 09:54 PM
That's a common misconception about what institutional control means.

"Lack of institutional control" isn't a finding of "Whoa, those dudes are CRAZY out there! There's nobody in charge!"

It means that the institution has failed to implement audit procedures to detect wrongdoing. The reason OU got a "Lack of institutional control" finding is that we weren't following our own audit procedures, which would have caught the Bomar thing much earlier. OU appealed that (and won) stating that there was confusion as to who was supposed to be conducting the audits.

Big Red Ron
2/16/2008, 09:59 PM
That's a common misconception about what institutional control means.

"Lack of institutional control" isn't a finding of "Whoa, those dudes are CRAZY out there! There's nobody in charge!"

It means that the institution has failed to implement audit procedures to detect wrongdoing. The reason OU got a "Lack of institutional control" finding is that we weren't following our own audit procedures, which would have caught the Bomar thing much earlier. OU appealed that (and won) stating that there was confusion as to who was supposed to be conducting the audits.Sure, but I do remember reading that having BBall sanctions just before the idiots screwed up in football was at least a mitigating factor in the initial finding.

birddog
2/16/2008, 11:34 PM
Umm, yeah, nobody gave us a pass with Sampson.

yeah, atleast we didn't hire the guy AFTER he had already screwed up.

hey calvin, lay off the horn there, fella!

1stTimeCaller
2/17/2008, 12:28 AM
I still think he was a good coach for us. I think we've got a better one in Capel, though.

I agree with this statement 100%

JohnnyMack
2/21/2008, 02:39 PM
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/basketball/ncaa/02/21/sampson.ap/index.html

Reports say he's done.

Collier11
2/21/2008, 02:42 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/cbk/story/7824932?MSNHPHMA

BarryBnds
2/22/2008, 12:50 PM
Is Kelvin in Charles Barkley's Fab Five?

Collier11
2/22/2008, 01:07 PM
Is Kelvin in Charles Barkley's Fab Five?


:D