Florida Primary

[SicEmBaylor]

http://enight.dos.state.fl.us/2008PPP/20080129_REP_SUM_PRE.html

Romney is holding steady at +1 over McCain with 34.3%.

[JohnnyMack]

Does Huckabee stay in through Super Tuesday or does he bail and try and help McCain out?

[SoonerStormchaser]

Jewell y Yanni is done. Too bad...but he'd make one hell of a running mate for McCain.

[Whet]

34% McCain
32% Romney
41% in

[SoonerStormchaser]

****! I coulda swore in would've only gotten 3%! Now he's got all the momentum headed into Super Tuesday!

[SicEmBaylor]

Does Huckabee stay in through Super Tuesday or does he bail and try and help McCain out?

Huckabee will stay in through Super Tuesday and I can't see him throwing his support behind McCain unless it's quite obvious McCain is going to win. He needs to angle for the Veep slot so he needs to keep his options open and stick it out.

[Octavian]

Hillary is celebrating her big "win" where nobody campaigned

[SicEmBaylor]

34% McCain
32% Romney
41% in

The state number is still showing .05 difference between McCain and Romney. I don't know if the networks are really behind (what I would assume since they are getting their numbers from the same place...supposedly) or if that represents absentee totals.

[SoonerStormchaser]

They're counting all the chads twice!


Hillary is celebrating her big "win" where nobody campaigned
Of course...after the *** whipping she got from O'Bomba in SC...she's grasping for whatever she can get at this point.

[SicEmBaylor]

Hillary is celebrating her big "win" where nobody campaigned

Obama's campaign issued a pretty good press release a little while ago. "Obama, Hillary tie for delegates in Florida tonight with 0 each."

[Octavian]

McCain is lookin good right now

[SicEmBaylor]

McCain is lookin good right now
It's making me nauseous.

[Octavian]

They're counting all the chads twice!


Of course...after the *** whipping she got from O'Bomba in SC...she's grasping for whatever she can get at this point.


the people who are paying attention will get it....just wondering if HRC's strategy of riding a "win" into Tuesday actually works.

[jeremy885]

The crying worked, so who knows.

[Octavian]

It's making me nauseous.


heh...you're not alone. The GOP is in a malaise. The talking heads are gonna be busy from now til Tuesday ;)


...probably after that too.

[SicEmBaylor]

heh...you're not alone. The GOP is in a malaise. The talking heads are gonna be busy from now til Tuesday ;)


...probably after that too.

I'm so close to just saying, "Screw 'em all" and voting for Obama and thus punishing the GOP for it's wicked ways.

[jeremy885]

Rudy raised 47 million and didn't finish higher then 3rd in any primaries? What a freaking waste.

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/map/

[Octavian]

the Huckster says he's not stopping...going forward through Tuesday also...

[Octavian]

I'm so close to just saying, "Screw 'em all" and voting for Obama....


http://img238.imageshack.us/img238/2455/gogf3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


GO. ;)

[Octavian]

Rudy raised 47 million and didn't finish higher then 3rd in any primaries? What a freaking waste.

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/map/


yeah...thats terrible. Rudy's gotta be happy that Fred Thompson was in the race too or he'd be an unprecedented flop.

[SoonerGirl06]

Guiliani is going to endorse McCain. I don't see that helping McCain much.

[Sooner_Havok]

Guiliani is going to endorse McCain. I don't see that helping McCain much.

It might just drag McDonald down

[SoonerGirl06]

That's what I'm thinking.

[Sooner_Havok]

I can see it now
I have decided to remove my name from consideration for the Republican Presidential nomination and back Senator McCain. I have chose to back Senator McCain because after the events of September 11...

[Octavian]

McCain Wins Florida (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/florida_republicans)

[SicEmBaylor]

I can see it now
He appears to be dropping out right at this moment.

[Octavian]

huh...Rudy sounds better in his concession speech than he did on the trail...

[Sooner_Havok]

huh...Rudy sounds better in his concession speech than he did on the trail...

Did he scale back the 9/11 references?

[SoonerGirl06]

I think that did him in eventually.


I know I got tired of hearing about it. Plus his "when I was mayor" spiel.

[SoonerGirl06]

I'm liking Romney more and more.



McCain... not so much.

[mikeelikee]

McCain is basically Hillary-lite. Just a little less liberal. This conservative is not a happy camper right now. :(

[r5TPsooner]

I'm liking Romney more and more.



McCain... not so much.

Yep. That's who I'm voting for but I have serious doubts to whether he can win or not..

[Whet]

here's his daddy!

http://www.americanheritage.com/assets/images/articles/web/09-04-Romney.jpg

[SicEmBaylor]

McCain is basically Hillary-lite. Just a little less liberal. This conservative is not a happy camper right now. :(
Well, my friend then grab a drink and join me toasting the last vestiges of conservatism within the Republican party, adieu!

[SoonerGirl06]

Adieu!

[SoonerGirl06]

Yep. That's who I'm voting for but I have serious doubts to whether he can win or not..

I've never had more serious doubts about the outcome of a Presidential campaign as I have with this one.

[SicEmBaylor]

I've never had more serious doubts about the outcome of a Presidential campaign as I have with this one.

It doesn't matter who got the nomination on either side -- the Democrats are going to win. I have no doubts about that. The sooner everyone accepts that fact the less angst they'll have to live with for the rest of the year.

[SoonerGirl06]

I'm more concerned about the angst of the next 4 years... possibly 8.

[Big Red Ron]

Guiliani is going to endorse McCain. I don't see that helping McCain much.Well, think about it like this...on "super Tuesday" there is California, New York and New Jersey. The the biggest prizes of the day. All are "winner take all" and in each Rudy is in the top two or three. If those voters break even at only 60-40 for McCain, that would be enough to basically win the nomination.

[Okla-homey]

Time to get on board the USS McCain. Next stop, 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. :D

http://aycu37.webshots.com/image/43516/2001961181027712754_rs.jpg (http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2001961181027712754)

[Big Red Ron]

It doesn't matter who got the nomination on either side -- the Democrats are going to win. I have no doubts about that. The sooner everyone accepts that fact the less angst they'll have to live with for the rest of the year.You are way off in your analysis. Hillary has a chance only against Huckabee, and Obama against Huckabee and Romney.

The only Republican that can beat either one is John McCain.

[SicEmBaylor]

Time to get on board the USS McCain. Next stop, 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. :D

http://aycu37.webshots.com/image/43516/2001961181027712754_rs.jpg (http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2001961181027712754)

Is the USS McCain full of illegals in the cargo hold with little anchor babies growing in their bellies?

Inquiring minds want to know...

[Okla-homey]

It doesn't matter who got the nomination on either side -- the Democrats are going to win. I have no doubts about that. The sooner everyone accepts that fact the less angst they'll have to live with for the rest of the year.

Naw. Look on the bright side, if John wins, that will mean the Donks will have a better chance of holding onto Congress in '10. That spells gridlock. ;)

[Big Red Ron]

Naw. Look on the bright side, if John wins, that will mean the Donks will have a better chance of holding onto Congress in '10. That spells gridlock. ;)Gridlock is under rated, just ask Bill Clinton. ;)

[SicEmBaylor]

Naw. Look on the bright side, if John wins, that will mean the Donks will have a better chance of holding onto Congress in '10. That spells gridlock. ;)

That actually is a bright spot...

Assuming the GOP can get its collective *** together long enough to take it over. You know..before they're thrown out again for betraying every one of their stated principles.

But hey, here's to that small sliver of a silver lining!

[Okla-homey]

Is the USS McCain full of illegals in the cargo hold with little anchor babies growing in their bellies?

Inquiring minds want to know...

Why do you hate the XIV Amendment?

Also, please enlighten us with the Sic'Em plan to rid the fruited plain of illegal immigrants? Seriously. Would it involve concentration camps, or just midnight round-ups and clandestine executions of 15-20 million human beings?

[Jimminy Crimson]

Huck staying in only helps McCain by dividing the "Christian Conservatives", thus helping McCain win Super Tuesday! ...and possibly leading to a veep nod.

While future Attorney General Giuli..., I mean Rudy's endorsement helps McCain with $$$.

[SoonerGirl06]

Time to get on board the USS McCain. Next stop, 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. :D

http://aycu37.webshots.com/image/43516/2001961181027712754_rs.jpg (http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2001961181027712754)

I'm not ready to concede to that train.

[SicEmBaylor]

Why do you hate the XIV Amendment?

Also, please enlighten us with the Sic'Em plan to rid the fruited plain of illegal immigrants? Seriously. Would it involve concentration camps, or just midnight round-ups and clandestine executions of 15-20 million human beings?

Well, Christo, I didn't know the option was between blanket amnesty and mass extermination. I suppose I'll have to give those two choices some thought, but I'm definitely leaning one way over the other. ;)

[Jimminy Crimson]

I'm not ready to concede to that train.

It's okay, we'll gladly welcome you aboard whenever you decide to make the leap! :D

[r5TPsooner]

I'm not ready to concede to that train.


If McCain wins Oklahoma I'll be shocked. Huckabee prolly takes OK, KS, and MO.

[Sooner_Havok]

then hop on the Ron Paul express! :D

[r5TPsooner]

then hop on the Ron Paul express! :D


I prefer him over McCain!

[Okla-homey]

I'm not ready to concede to that train.

it'll be fun. Just think, we get to trade texass-style "aw shucks" and mispronunciations for a genuine curmudgeon who will have all the libs in DC apoplectic with rage.

Think Rumsfeld, only meaner, with the power of the presidency behind him.:D

[Okla-homey]

then hop on the Ron Paul express! :D

Are the tin foil hats optional? ;)

[SicEmBaylor]

it'll be fun. Just think, we get to trade texass-style "aw shucks" and mispronunciations for a genuine curmudgeon who will have all the libs in DC apoplectic with rage.

Think Rumsfeld, only meaner, with the power of the presidency behind him.:D

Why would they be in rage? He's on their side! And McCain would detest the comparison with Rumsfeld. He absolutely detests Rummy.

[royalfan5]

then hop on the Ron Paul express! :D
My mental image of this is Ron Paul riding in a radio flyer wagon.

[Okla-homey]

Well, Christo, I didn't know the option was between blanket amnesty and mass extermination. I suppose I'll have to give those two choices some thought, but I'm definitely leaning one way over the other. ;)

That's just it. There simply are'nt any practical alternatives, other than ensuring the ones who are already here pay taxes and pull their weight. Call it "blanket amnesty", Quilted Northern, or whatever you want. The bottomline is they're here to stay, unless and until Congress passes a law criminalizing the act of employing them.

You and I both know that will not happen. Too many factions and lobbyists would scream bloody murder at the mention of a bill to that effect.

[Big Red Ron]

My mental image of this is Ron Paul riding in a radio flyer wagon.Of course while wearing a foil hat. :D

[JohnnyMack]

Time to get on board the USS McCain. Next stop, 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. :D

http://aycu37.webshots.com/image/43516/2001961181027712754_rs.jpg (http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2001961181027712754)

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u224/SaneMadness/Failboat.jpg

[SoonerGirl06]

it'll be fun. Just think, we get to trade texass-style "aw shucks" and mispronunciations for a genuine curmudgeon who will have all the libs in DC apoplectic with rage.

Think Rumsfeld, only meaner, with the power of the presidency behind him.:D

I'm a stubborn red-head. I'll resist till the very end.... :D

[Okla-homey]

Why would they be in rage? He's on their side! And McCain would detest the comparison with Rumsfeld. He absolutely detests Rummy.

You can paint him as a lib if you want, but you need to realize he's actually moderate on some things, and conservative on others. Like most Americans.

[Big Red Ron]

I don't understand McCain bashers. The guy has given more for and personally done more for his country than 99% of most Americans.

[r5TPsooner]

I don't understand McCain bashers. The guy has given more for and personally done more for his country than 99% of most Americans.


I don't have a problem with McCain personally I just dislike his views on illegals in this country, as do most Repubs which is a big issue for me.

[VeeJay]

In the White House, who'd be the meaner, fly off the cuff, cusser outer, Hillary or McCain?

What a nightmare the West Wing will be for the next few years.

[Okla-homey]

In the White House, who'd be the meaner, fly off the cuff, cusser outer, Hillary or McCain?

What a nightmare the West Wing will be for the next few years.

Personally, I prefer my mean, fly-of-the-cuff, cusser-outers to be male. It's not attractive when ladies do it.;)

[SanJoaquinSooner]

I don't know why so many of you are fussing over a possible Clinton white house. If she is all that evil, the senate can filibuster her evil proposed legislation. If she's a terrible president, she'll not be able to build a winning coalition to get things done.... she'd just become a HillaryCarter, impotent just like Jimmy. it would energize the pubs like Carter did leading to the Reagan revolution.


on the other hand, maybe she turns out to be a decent president. that should pleasantly surprise you.


either way you win: an energized pub party or a better-than-expected prez.

[Big Red Ron]

I don't have a problem with McCain personally I just dislike his views on illegals in this country, as do most Repubs which is a big issue for me.His views are the only ones that are thought through and achivable. It's not as if he's not going to build the fence to keep them out or that he's going to simply grant immunity to the ones that are here.

IMHO, this election is more about how we as American's continue to live with life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness and less about how many families we can push out of our country.

What is more threatening today to our way of life and long term security? A war with radical Islam, Iraq, and Afghanistan or a minor disagreement over HOW not IF we deal with Illegal immigrants (some are more productive than some "Americans" BTW).

I don't mean to diminish your point and I'm mostly in your corner, I just cannot fathom how that one issue can be that important.

[r5TPsooner]

His views are the only ones that are thought through and achivable. It's not as if he's not going to build the fence to keep them out or that he's going to simply grant immunity to the ones that are here.

IMHO, this election is more about how we as American's continue to live with life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness and less about how many families we can push out of our country.

What is more threatening today to our way of life and long term security? A war with radical Islam, Iraq, and Afghanistan or a minor disagreement over HOW not IF we deal with Illegal immigrants (some are more productive than some "Americans" BTW).

I don't mean to diminish your point and I'm mostly in your corner, I just cannot fathom how that one issue can be that important.


True story unfortunately:

We purchased a brand new home last April. About a month afterwards we discover mold growing in our master bathroom under and around our whirlpool bathtub. After removing the tub and completely knocking out all of the tile as well, they then discover that the brick that was next to the bathtub would have to be removed as well to combat the mold. When they sent the brick layer out yesterday, I decided to go outside and discuss what he was going to do to my home, since he had already started to pound and remove the brick w/o consulting me 1st.

The young man was a Hispanic who didn't understand a word I was saying but was sent to my home to knock out the old brick and eventually replace it with new brick. After minutes of frustrating miscommunication, he finally dials his cell phone so that I can talk to his "boss." I take the phone and I talk to yet another Hispanic who barely speaks more English than the brick layer at my home. I then call the builder and bitch him out for sending a guy who can not communicate with me on what he's about to do to my home.

I don't mean to insult you, but this is a huge issue for me not only personally, but economically as well.

I called immigration today and when he comes back out tomorrow... they'll be waiting! Hopefully, he's legal, but all parties involved know that he's not!

I was insulted that they'd send someone to work on my home, a huge investment to me, that could not even communicate with me, the home owner, on the simplest of levels.

This is not only insulting but it's just not right IMHO and for folks to be so obtuse about the issue, is just mind boggling to me.

[KABOOKIE]

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u224/SaneMadness/Failboat.jpg

That boat looks like it was designed to haul Hilary's fat ***.

[1stTimeCaller]

True story unfortunately:

We purchased a brand new home last April. About a month afterwards we discover mold growing in our master bathroom under and around our whirlpool bathtub. After removing the tub and completely knocking out all of the tile as well, they then discover that the brick that was next to the bathtub would have to be removed as well to combat the mold. When they sent the brick layer out yesterday, I decided to go outside and discuss what he was going to do to my home, since he had already started to pound and remove the brick w/o consulting me 1st.

The young man was a Hispanic who didn't understand a word I was saying but was sent to my home to knock out the old brick and eventually replace it with new brick. After minutes of frustrating miscommunication, he finally dials his cell phone so that I can talk to his "boss." I take the phone and I talk to yet another Hispanic who barely speaks more English than the brick layer at my home. I then call the builder and bitch him out for sending a guy who can not communicate with me on what he's about to do to my home.

I don't mean to insult you, but this is a huge issue for me not only personally, but economically as well.

I called immigration today and when he comes back out tomorrow... they'll be waiting! Hopefully, he's legal, but all parties involved know that he's not!

I was insulted that they'd send someone to work on my home, a huge investment to me, that could not even communicate with me, the home owner, on the simplest of levels.

This is not only insulting but it's just not right IMHO and for folks to be so obtuse about the issue, is just mind boggling to me.
I can't believe you are falling for the 90s esque mold trick.

[Big Red Ron]

True story unfortunately:

We purchased a brand new home last April. About a month afterwards we discover mold growing in our master bathroom under and around our whirlpool bathtub. After removing the tub and completely knocking out all of the tile as well, they then discover that the brick that was next to the bathtub would have to be removed as well to combat the mold. When they sent the brick layer out yesterday, I decided to go outside and discuss what he was going to do to my home, since he had already started to pound and remove the brick w/o consulting me 1st.

The young man was a Hispanic who didn't understand a word I was saying but was sent to my home to knock out the old brick and eventually replace it with new brick. After minutes of frustrating miscommunication, he finally dials his cell phone so that I can talk to his "boss." I take the phone and I talk to yet another Hispanic who barely speaks more English than the brick layer at my home. I then call the builder and bitch him out for sending a guy who can not communicate with me on what he's about to do to my home.

I don't mean to insult you, but this is a huge issue for me not only personally, but economically as well.

I called immigration today and when he comes back out tomorrow... they'll be waiting! Hopefully, he's legal, but all parties involved know that he's not!

I was insulted that they'd send someone to work on my home, a huge investment to me, that could not even communicate with me, the home owner, on the simplest of levels.

This is not only insulting but it's just not right IMHO and for folks to be so obtuse about the issue, is just mind boggling to me.Seems a bit petty given the world we live in. My firm has been hired to deal with some of the labor problems that road, bridge, highway and roofing subcontracting companies are going to deal with now. Be prepared for a real economic hammer when all these workers are gone. The only way to make it work is to cut our losses and absorb many that are here by a process.

[r5TPsooner]

I can't believe you are falling for the 90s esque mold trick.


Ohhh how I wish that were true.

Seeing is believing.

[OUbones]

It doesn't matter who got the nomination on either side -- the Democrats are going to win. I have no doubts about that. The sooner everyone accepts that fact the less angst they'll have to live with for the rest of the year.

I'm totally amazed by this line of thinking. If there's anything America has learned in the last 8 years, Republican know how to win a tight election. Have Republican gotten so complacent in the last 8 years that they'd, if McCain is the nominee, not support him? So he'd be a little more moderate than some might like, but he'd be closer to their ideals than the Democratic nominee. If McCain wins the nomination he'd be a stronger candidate than Romney. I have about as much faith in the Democrats winning in Nov. as I do in OU's 2 minuet defense. It actually hurt to write that last line but it's true.

[r5TPsooner]

Seems a bit petty given the world we live in. My firm has been hired to deal with some of the labor problems that road, bridge, highway and roofing subcontracting companies are going to deal with now. Be prepared for a real economic hammer when all these workers are gone. The only way to make it work is to cut our losses and absorb many that are here by a process.



I'm willing to take that chance to force them to obey the laws that are on the books.

As far as being petty goes... never judge a man until you've been in his shoes.

[Big Red Ron]

As far as being petty goes... never judge a man until you've been in his shoes.I suggest you do the same. What would you do if you couldn't feed your family in Mexico? Let them starve?

[Big Red Ron]

Also, you seem to not understand McCain's plan for illegal immigration.

See below Sir.

Immigration is one of those challenging issues that touch on many aspects of American life.

I have always believed that our border must be secure and that the federal government has utterly failed in its responsibility to ensure that it is secure. If we have learned anything from the recent immigration debate, it is that Americans have little trust that their government will honor a pledge to do the things necessary to make the border secure.
As president, I will secure the border. I will restore the trust Americans should have in the basic competency of their government. A secure border is an essential element of our national security. Tight border security includes not just the entry and exit of people, but also the effective screening of cargo at our ports and other points of entry.
But a secure border will contribute to addressing our immigration problem most effectively if we also:

Recognize the importance of building strong allies in Mexico and Latin America who reject the siren call of authoritarians like Hugo Chavez, support freedom and democracy, and seek strong domestic economies with abundant economic opportunities for their citizens.
Recognize the importance of pro-growth policies -- keeping government spending in check, holding down taxes, and cutting unnecessary regulatory burdens -- so American businesses can hire and pay the best.
Recognize the importance of a flexible labor market to keep employers in business and our economy on top. It should provide skilled Americans and immigrants with opportunity. Our education system should ensure skills for our younger workers, and our retraining and assistance programs for displaced workers must be modernized so they can pursue those opportunities
Recognize the importance of assimilation of our immigrant population, which includes learning English, American history and civics, and respecting the values of a democratic society.
Recognize that America will always be that "shining city upon a hill," a beacon of hope and opportunity for those seeking a better life built on hard work and optimism.Border security and our failed immigration system are more examples of an ailing Washington culture in need of reform to regain the trust of Americans. In too many areas -- from immigration and pork barrel spending to Social Security, health care, energy security and tax relief -- business-as-usual politics prevents addressing the important challenges facing our nation.
http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/68db8157-d301-4e22-baf7-a70dd8416efa.htm

[Big Red Ron]

nm

[OUbones]

Seems a bit petty given the world we live in. My firm has been hired to deal with some of the labor problems that road, bridge, highway and roofing subcontracting companies are going to deal with now. Be prepared for a real economic hammer when all these workers are gone. The only way to make it work is to cut our losses and absorb many that are here by a process.

Everyone agrees that something has to be done about illegal imingration. However I'd really like to see how long US citizens would tolerate $4 lettuce. Most Americans don't realize how much it would cost them to deport all illegal workers.

[Big Red Ron]

Everyone agrees that something has to be done about illegal immigration. However I'd really like to see how long US citizens would tolerate $4 lettuce. Most Americans don't realize how much it would cost them to deport all illegal workers.shoot lettuce is only the tip of the iceberg ( ;) ). wait until a three million dollar road project turns into an 8 million dollar project. Labor Unions are licking their chops and if this is the way it goes, our economy will tank inside of a decade.

[SicEmBaylor]

I'm totally amazed by this line of thinking. If there's anything America has learned in the last 8 years, Republican know how to win a tight election. Have Republican gotten so complacent in the last 8 years that they'd, if McCain is the nominee, not support him? So he'd be a little more moderate than some might like, but he'd be closer to their ideals than the Democratic nominee. If McCain wins the nomination he'd be a stronger candidate than Romney. I have about as much faith in the Democrats winning in Nov. as I do in OU's 2 minuet defense. It actually hurt to write that last line but it's true.

Don't misunderstand me -- I'm actively hoping for a Republican defeat. I'd rather see a Republican defeat than a Republican victory with non-conservative principles that are thus validated with a victory. I think it's ultimately better for the party to lose a race every now and then.

Sometimes a party needs a good blood letting. If McCain or Huckabee are the nominees then we're going to need to bleed the party.......a lot.

[tommieharris91]

I would just hope McCain or whoever we elect follows through with those kinds of promises.

[tommieharris91]

Don't misunderstand me -- I'm actively hoping for a Republican defeat. I'd rather see a Republican defeat than a Republican victory with non-conservative principles that are thus validated with a victory. I think it's ultimately better for the party to lose a race every now and then.

Sometimes a party needs a good blood letting. If McCain or Huckabee are the nominees then we're going to need to bleed the party.......a lot.

I'm with you, but only if the dems nominate Obama (and he doesn't ask Clinton to be his VP). If they give the nod to Hillary, she will ruin the country. I think Barack is a little more privy to economic needs of the country and won't completely wreck the free market like Hillary will.

[Big Red Ron]

Don't misunderstand me -- I'm actively hoping for a Republican defeat. I'd rather see a Republican defeat than a Republican victory with non-conservative principles that are thus validated with a victory. I think it's ultimately better for the party to lose a race every now and then.

Sometimes a party needs a good blood letting. If McCain or Huckabee are the nominees then we're going to need to bleed the party.......a lot.Huckabee is a side show at this point. "Conservative" obviously does not mean the same as it did in the 18th and 19th century and from my perspective it's even more different than in the mid to late 20th century. Bush isn't a conservative either. The word has become meaningless in modern day political lexicon. McCain, sans his respectable yet ineffectual attempt to limit the power of money in politics, more represents Republican not necessarily "conservative" ideals. Whatever that means anymore.

[SicEmBaylor]

I'm with you, but only if the dems nominate Obama (and he doesn't ask Clinton to be his VP). If they give the nod to Hillary, she will ruin the country. I think Barack is a little more privy to economic needs of the country and won't completely wreck the free market like Hillary will.

That's fair enough and I agree. Hillary scares the ever loving bejesus out of me, and I'd advocate keeping her out of the WH at any cost. If Obama is the nominee then he can have it. I don't like his politics, but I trust him.

[Sooner_Havok]

I, for one, will welcome our future Canadian overlords with open arms!

[SicEmBaylor]

Huckabee is a side show at this point. "Conservative" obviously does not mean the same as it did in the 18th and 19th century and from my perspective it's even more different than in the mid to late 20th century. Bush isn't a conservative either. The word has become meaningless in modern day political lexicon. McCain, sans his respectable yet ineffectual attempt to limit the power of money in politics, more represents Republican not necessarily "conservative" ideals. Whatever that means anymore.

You're absolutely positive right. That's exactly what has made me so damned bitter. My politics is basically 150 years past it's expiration date. I'm a pretty committed paleo-conservative, but we don't run or direct the movement anymore.

'Tis a pity. You wouldn't have these outrageous deficits, porous borders, or Wilsonian diplomacy with a sledgehammer if the paleo's still controlled the party.

[Octavian]

Rudy plans to endorse McCain tomorrow at the Reagan Library.


salt in the wound.

[Big Red Ron]

You're absolutely positive right. That's exactly what has made me so damned bitter. My politics is basically 150 years past it's expiration date. I'm a pretty committed paleo-conservative, but we don't run or direct the movement anymore.

'Tis a pity. You wouldn't have these outrageous deficits, porous borders, or Wilsonian diplomacy with a sledgehammer if the paleo's still controlled the party.In all sincereity, I believe John is more like us than he can let on. I've heard that not only is Rudy going to endorse McCain but Thompson and others will before super tuesday. I think we dinosaurs will find McCain's brand of conservativism much more platable than Romney's and certainly Bush's.

Cheers

[SanJoaquinSooner]

You're absolutely positive right. That's exactly what has made me so damned bitter. My politics is basically 150 years past it's expiration date. I'm a pretty committed paleo-conservative, but we don't run or direct the movement anymore.

'Tis a pity. You wouldn't have these outrageous deficits, porous borders, or Wilsonian diplomacy with a sledgehammer if the paleo's still controlled the party.


an interesting comment regarding outrageous deficits. that is why McCain originally voted against the Bush tax cuts. He demanded spending cuts linked to them. Post-WWII, it really started with Reagan. he cut taxes on the promise of spending reduction that never was realized. the deficits skyrocketed. and they've skyrocketed under dubya as well. so McCain gets labeled a democrat for not supporting the tax cuts, when in reality he was being a deficit hawk.

[SicEmBaylor]

an interesting comment regarding outrageous deficits. that is why McCain originally voted against the Bush tax cuts. He demanded spending cuts linked to them. Post-WWII, it really started with Reagan. he cut taxes on the promise of spending reduction that never was realized. the deficits skyrocketed. and they've skyrocketed under dubya as well. so McCain gets labeled a democrat for not supporting the tax cuts, when in reality he was being a deficit hawk.

You're right about him being a deficit hawk. It's one thing that I seriously give him credit for, but I was referring to the party in general with those comments not McCain.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Don't misunderstand me -- I'm actively hoping for a Republican defeat. I'd rather see a Republican defeat than a Republican victory with non-conservative principles that are thus validated with a victory. I think it's ultimately better for the party to lose a race every now and then.

Sometimes a party needs a good blood letting. If McCain or Huckabee are the nominees then we're going to need to bleed the party.......a lot.If the country is going down the wrong track, better it be with the democrats at the helm than a republican who acts like a democrat. McCain makes Bush look almost like Reagan. I would take a chance on Romney, but not McCain. He's too disgusting to head up a political party I could associate with . SicEm, bring on the 2nd Civil War. We'll be on the same side.

[Sooner_Havok]

SicEm, bring on the 2nd Civil War. We'll be on the same side.

That my friends is a very scary thought :eek:

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

That my friends is a very scary thought :eek:What, me and SicEm on the same side, or the 2nd Civil War, period?

[SicEmBaylor]

What, me and SicEm on the same side, or the 2nd Civil War, period?

I was about to ask the same thing.

[Sooner_Havok]

I am going to go with both. An unstoppable force, an unmovable object, and a war between the coasts and the midsection.

[SicEmBaylor]

I am going to go with both. An unstoppable force, an unmovable object, and a war between the coasts and the midsection.

Am I the unmovable object or the unstoppable force?

[Sooner_Havok]

You can be the unmovable object

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I was about to ask the same thing.I have heard that some of the polling places in FL let people come and vote without proper party credentials, allowing them to declare a party at the polling place and then vote in the primary of their choice. Don't know how widespread it was, but it's chaos.

[Big Red Ron]

I have heard that some of the polling places in FL let people come and vote without proper party credentials, allowing them to declare a party at the polling place and then vote in the primary of their choice. Don't know how widespread it was, but it's chaos.With all due respect. McCain just did what you said wouldn't happen, win a closed primary state.

Rush, the real one not you is simply wrong on this one. Wouldn't be the first time. ;)

[Sooner_Havok]

I have heard that some of the polling places in FL let people come and vote without proper party credentials, allowing them to declare a party at the polling place and then vote in the primary of their choice. Don't know how widespread it was, but it's chaos.

Hope they do that here in OK so I can go vote fer McClain and stick it to the GOP:rolleyes:

[olevetonahill]

This shat cracks me up :D :D :D :D :D
we are a Bunch of Sooner Fans On a Sooner site , In THE SOONER state .
Aint a dayum thing we say here gonna change a dayum thing in the Political world
In the Final analysis , we as Okies are gonna be able to vote for 1 of 2 that are running and HOPE that our Vote means something :P

[Sooner_Havok]

This shat cracks me up :D :D :D :D :D
we are a Bunch of Sooner Fans On a Sooner site , In THE SOONER state .
Aint a dayum thing we say here gonna change a dayum thing in the Political world
In the Final analysis , we as Okies are gonna be able to vote for 1 of 2 that are running and HOPE that our Vote means something :P

Our votes never mean squat and you know that.

[olevetonahill]

Our votes never mean squat and you know that.
Kindq Like this thread ?;)

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

With all due respect. McCain just did what you said wouldn't happen, win a closed primary state.

Rush, the real one not you is simply wrong on this one. Wouldn't be the first time. ;)I said there might have been significant fraud. An election that doesn't follow the law is what might have been there. It would actually be more tragic if my suspicions about the fraud ARE wrong, and even those in the more conservative party are voting for socialism.

[Sooner_Havok]

Hell, with any luck, our two party system will be so fractured by this next presidential election that it will crumble, never to rear it's ugly head again in all of human history.

[Big Red Ron]

Hell, with any luck, our two party system will be so fractured by this next presidential election that it will crumble, never to rear it's ugly head again in all of human history.It's the best system in the history of man.

[olevetonahill]

I think In My Okie Opinion . That anyone that takes this shat serious :P
Yall need to Move to warshinton , and Leave Us alone to Enjoy OU football
just sayin :D

[olevetonahill]

It's the best system in the history of man.
Or woman !
Ya know ya gots to Be PC now dontcha ?

[Sooner_Havok]

It's the best system in the history of man.

The two party system is the best in the history of man? Dividing up into only two groups and forcing people to compromise half their ideals for the sake of the other half? Even George Washington thought two parties was a bad idea. More parties=more opportunities for more people to express more of their views. If this country wasn't so divided along party lines, we would be in a lot better shape right now. As it is you have people on the extremes of both sides sniping at each other, and using the people in the middle as fodder.

[Big Red Ron]

Or woman !
Ya know ya gots to Be PC now dontcha ?Show me a functional executive, bicameral, republican form of gubment created by women and I'll change my verbiage, ;)

[Big Red Ron]

The two party system is the best in the history of man? Dividing up into only two groups and forcing people to compromise half their ideals for the sake of the other half? Even George Washington thought two parties was a bad idea. More parties=more opportunities for more people to express more of their views. If this country wasn't so divided along party lines, we would be in a lot better shape right now. As it is you have people on the extremes of both sides sniping at each other, and using the people in the middle as fodder.Tell that to the western europeans. Even in South America (not Mexico) has the same problem. How would you distribute power within the upper or lower legislative bodies? Let's say there are 150 seats divided up between 10-30 parties. What now? They compromise their beliefs electing leaders with coalitions within the caucuses. What if the party with the least amound of representation also elects the Pres? Gridlock X10.

It all sounds good on paper, but our strength as a nation is, in large part a function of the systems we chose while forming this nation.

[olevetonahill]

Show me a functional executive, bicameral, republican form of gubment created by women and I'll change my verbiage, ;)
Well hell Now you wanta get all technical and stuff :confused:
How bout? them wimmens control 1/2 the Money and all the Punnany in the world ?
Hell Them wimmins got us By the short hairs .
I blame It on those P whipped dudes years ago . ;)

[dolemitesooner]

Time to get on board the USS McCain. Next stop, 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. :D

http://aycu37.webshots.com/image/43516/2001961181027712754_rs.jpg (http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/v/2001961181027712754)
lmao

[NormanPride]

Tell that to the western europeans. Even in South America (not Mexico) has the same problem. How would you distribute power within the upper or lower legislative bodies? Let's say there are 150 seats divided up between 10-30 parties. What now? They compromise their beliefs electing leaders with coalitions within the caucuses. What if the party with the least amound of representation also elects the Pres? Gridlock X10.

It all sounds good on paper, but our strength as a nation is, in large part a function of the systems we chose while forming this nation.

You say Gridlock x10 like it's a bad thing.

[Jimminy Crimson]

This shat cracks me up :D :D :D :D :D
we are a Bunch of Sooner Fans On a Sooner site , In THE SOONER state .
Aint a dayum thing we say here gonna change a dayum thing in the Political world
In the Final analysis , we as Okies are gonna be able to vote for 1 of 2 that are running and HOPE that our Vote means something :P

You don't strike me as the Huckabee type... ;)

[Bourbon St Sooner]

Don't misunderstand me -- I'm actively hoping for a Republican defeat. I'd rather see a Republican defeat than a Republican victory with non-conservative principles that are thus validated with a victory. I think it's ultimately better for the party to lose a race every now and then.

Sometimes a party needs a good blood letting. If McCain or Huckabee are the nominees then we're going to need to bleed the party.......a lot.


I think this is the bloodletting. 2006 was a bloodletting and this is a continuation. Rush Limbaugh and his am radio ilk got their man 8 years ago and what did we get? We got a larger Dept of Education, the largest new entitlement program since the Johnson admin and out of control spending. And that was when he had a Republican Congress. Besides the tax increases, Bill Clinton by far did more to restrain the growth of gov't than Bush (granted, that was mostly driven by the Gingrich revolution).

I've always been lukewarm on John McCain, but if Rush Limbaugh hates him that much, he must be worth giving a shot.

[SicEmBaylor]

I think this is the bloodletting. 2006 was a bloodletting and this is a continuation. Rush Limbaugh and his am radio ilk got their man 8 years ago and what did we get? We got a larger Dept of Education, the largest new entitlement program since the Johnson admin and out of control spending. And that was when he had a Republican Congress. Besides the tax increases, Bill Clinton by far did more to restrain the growth of gov't than Bush (granted, that was mostly driven by the Gingrich revolution).

I've always been lukewarm on John McCain, but if Rush Limbaugh hates him that much, he must be worth giving a shot.

Look, I agree with all of that. I voted for Bush twice and God knows I am NOT a fan of his for the reasons listed above and more.

But to be fair, Bush presented himself in 2000 as a pretty strict conservative. He talked about tax relief, reducing the bloated Federal budget, a restrained nation-building free foreign policy, parental and local control over education, etc. Now, as it turns out, things didn't go that well...

There's really no excuse in 2004 though I'll say the things that he said about an "Ownership Society" was pretty good and straight out of Margaret Thatcher's (of all people) playbook.

Having said that, he's not a conservative or even tried to act like one.

[Ike]

Look, I agree with all of that. I voted for Bush twice and God knows I am NOT a fan of his for the reasons listed above and more.

But to be fair, Bush presented himself in 2000 as a pretty strict conservative. He talked about tax relief, reducing the bloated Federal budget, a restrained nation-building free foreign policy, parental and local control over education, etc. Now, as it turns out, things didn't go that well...

There's really no excuse in 2004 though I'll say the things that he said about an "Ownership Society" was pretty good and straight out of Margaret Thatcher's (of all people) playbook.

Having said that, he's not a conservative or even tried to act like one.

Extending the "Bush presented himself as a conservative" logic a bit farther, what does that tell you about the current campaigns? Romney's doing a hell of a job presenting himself as a conservative despite the fact that as governor he ran essentially in the opposite direction on key issues. Should conservatives really feel all that jazzed about him?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I think this is the bloodletting. 2006 was a bloodletting and this is a continuation. Rush Limbaugh and his am radio ilk got their man 8 years ago and what did we get? We got a larger Dept of Education, the largest new entitlement program since the Johnson admin and out of control spending. And that was when he had a Republican Congress. Besides the tax increases, Bill Clinton by far did more to restrain the growth of gov't than Bush (granted, that was mostly driven by the Gingrich revolution).

I've always been lukewarm on John McCain, but if Rush Limbaugh hates him that much, he must be worth giving a shot.If you were ever to actually listen to Rush Limbaugh, you would know that he criticizes "W" on all the social spending you speak of, and would find that you would be pleased how much he broadcasts YOUR ideas to the nation. McCain is, indeed, a bad apple, and will lose to the democrat in the general, if he gets that far.

[jeremy885]

lmao

srsly, when did doleo get the right to vote?

[SicEmBaylor]

srsly, when did doleo get the right to vote?
When literacy tests were ruled unconstitutional. ;)

Kidding.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Extending the "Bush presented himself as a conservative" logic a bit farther, what does that tell you about the current campaigns? Romney's doing a hell of a job presenting himself as a conservative despite the fact that as governor he ran essentially in the opposite direction on key issues. Should conservatives really feel all that jazzed about him?Heck, we never know what anyone will do til they get in office, but Romney is taking the most sensible, and rational(conservative) positions of those remaining in the race. McCain hasn't promised to change any of his blatantly bad ideas and actions he has delivered in his past.

[LosAngelesSooner]

I love it that I don't even have to respond to RLIMC anymore now that everyone on there knows how completely crazy and out of touch with reality he is.

Pass the popcorn and the tin foil hats. It's gonna be fun to watch the meltdown once McCain beats the pants off the ol' White Collared Liar from Mass. :D

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I love it that I don't even have to respond to RLIMC anymore now that everyone on there knows how completely crazy and out of touch with reality he is.

Pass the popcorn and the tin foil hats. It's gonna be fun to watch the meltdown once McCain beats the pants off the ol' White Collared Liar from Mass. :DDoes insulting people prove you're smarter than others. Then genius, you sure know how to win an argument.

[KABOOKIE]

Pass the popcorn and the tin foil hats. It's gonna be fun to watch the meltdown once McCain beats the pants off the ol' White Collared Liar from Mass. :D


He'll probably vow to move to Canada!

[JohnnyMack]

Heh.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

Does insulting people prove you're smarter than others?

How would Rush Limbaugh answer?

[Jerk]

When literacy tests were ruled unconstitutional. ;)

Kidding.

hehe. That is just mean.

[LosAngelesSooner]

Does insulting people prove you're smarter than others. Then genius, you sure know how to win an argument.I could try your strategy of ignoring the facts and the real world and creating fascinating conspiracy theories that even OTHER conservative Republicans roll their eyes at.

:cool:

[OCUDad]

Does insulting people prove you're smarter than others. Then genius, you sure know how to win an argument.Pot, meet kettle.