What OUr Team Seems To Be Missing

[SouthCarolinaSooner]

As I've watched the Sooner teams since our national championship in 2000, one ingredient seems to be missing. Our teams lack "winners" per se. Sure, all of our teams have had great talent, but we have had few true "winners". Rocky Calamus, Josh Heupel and Quentin Griffin to name a few, were not the most talented players and were fairly undersized. But they were determined, no matter if they had to go under you, over you or through you to win, they were going to do it, and I just havent seen alot of that lately. But don't get me wrong, we have had "winners" since 2000, Dan Cody, Teddy Lehmann, Roy Williams, AD and some others just had to win like the 2000 team. I saw flashes of it this year, especially from Bradford, Patrick and Lofton, but not consistently. We still lacked a fire to win.

Maybe I'm wrong but thats just my .02$....

SCS

[BASSooner]

i believe your 2 cents are worth about 2 bucks. thats a great statement.

Allow me to add on to it. If you look at USC, they run some of the most brutal practices in college football. Competition over there is just as fierce as ever before. Players would come out saying that the real games are a joke compared to practice and these kids seemed to be conditioned to have a winning attitude. Theres one answer on how many of their blue chippers don't have an ego.

Pete Carrol also drills his team HARD way before bowl games. I think Coach Stoops should look into something like this because I believe, that we could achieve a higher level than we are at right now with those kind of standards

[SouthCarolinaSooner]

i believe your 2 cents are worth about 2 bucks. thats a great statement.

Allow me to add on to it. If you look at USC, they run some of the most brutal practices in college football. Competition over there is just as fierce as ever before. Players would come out saying that the real games are a joke compared to practice and these kids seemed to be conditioned to have a winning attitude. Theres one answer on how many of their blue chippers don't have an ego.

Pete Carrol also drills his team HARD way before bowl games. I think Coach Stoops should look into something like this because I believe, that we could achieve a higher level than we are at right now with those kind of standards
As much as I hate to admire anything USC does, it's very true. I think Stoops definately needs to step practice up a level. With great intensity and effort in practice comes that desire to win no matter what.

[sanantoniosooner]

I'm torn.

I think it's either fire or mojo.

[BASSooner]

As much as I hate to admire anything USC does, it's very true. I think Stoops definately needs to step practice up a level. With great intensity and effort in practice comes that desire to win no matter what.
What OUr team needs to become is a team of perfectionists. Although perfection cannot be acheived, you can strive for it. USC is 4-1 in their BCS bowls thanks to it.


As crazy as it sounds, I think schmiddy should take things to a whole new level

[ouwapiti]

i'm thinking mentality or the lack thereof has played a significant role in the last few years 'debacle' games !!!!...case in point....how does a cover 2 safety bite so hard on a run fake that he completely 'forgets' about the slot receiver on his side????

[sanantoniosooner]

What OUr team needs to become is a team of perfectionists. Although perfection cannot be acheived, you can strive for it. USC is 4-1 in their BCS bowls thanks to it.


As crazy as it sounds, I think schmiddy should take things to a whole new level
USC likes to hurt people. We like to arm tackle too much.

We'd have to get mean or something to emulate them.

[madillsoonerfan5353]

[QUOTE=SouthCarolinaSooner]As I've watched the Sooner teams since our national championship in 2000, one ingredient seems to be missing. Our teams lack "winners" per se. Sure, all of our teams have had great talent, but we have had few true "winners". Rocky Calamus, Josh Heupel and Quentin Griffin to name a few, were not the most talented players and were fairly undersized. But they were determined, no matter if they had to go under you, over you or through you to win, they were going to do it, and I just havent seen alot of that lately. But don't get me wrong, we have had "winners" since 2000, Dan Cody, Teddy Lehmann, Roy Williams, AD and some others just had to win like the 2000 team. I saw flashes of it this year, especially from Bradford, Patrick and Lofton, but not consistently. We still lacked a fire to win.

Maybe I'm wrong but thats just my .02$....

I agree great post!!!! To bad Patrick isn't coming back!!! Maybe Lofton will hang around!!

[NS5]

I'm torn.

I think it's either fire or mojo.


Definitely MOJO

[aero]

Attitude. A team has to have disdain for losing and almost disdain for the opponent in front of them. A team has to KNOW they are better than the opponent in front of them. Miami had teams like that. USC has had teams like that. We have had teams like that. I believe its a fine line for a coach to walk to get his team in that mindset because a little too much of that attitude and you end up with problems extending off the field. I think our 2000 bunch actually pulled it off perfectly as they never came off as thugs, just a TEAM that refused to lose. Just think how scary Texas could have been some of the last 10 years with a bad attitude. Just think how many more MNC's we'd have with that attitude instilled in some of the teams we've had the last 7 years. We have had great fortune to have had some very good talent and some good coaching but we are missing that final piece. My guess is that's where we are missing Mike S.
I also think Texas scored a huge coup with the hiring of Muschamp and we would be well served if Bob can figure out how to get this team angry.

[bluedogok]

The team that played Missouri in San Antonio was not the one that showed up in Glendale. That is what has been missing for a few years, robotic is not good when it comes to football. It is a game of emotion, as much as I don't like all the extra crap that some players do these days it seems to be what this era of player needs. Even the Patriots which try to play at robotic efficiency plays with a lot of emotion. In most game OU comes out flat and just wants to out execute you, when that doesn't happen they get into trouble. There has to be a balance between being robots and emo twits to play at a maximum level.

Somehow it seems to me the 77-0 A&M game was the tipping point which started this down turn in the mental aspect of the game. Something was lost after the furor over that game because they haven't been the same since.

[Breadburner]

As much as I hate to admire anything USC does, it's very true. I think Stoops definately needs to step practice up a level. With great intensity and effort in practice comes that desire to win no matter what.

Or it weeds out the ones that don't..... On another note I love A.P. but he needs to work real hard on his blocking when he is in the backfield with a QB......

[sanantoniosooner]

I tend to think it has something to do with believing our press clippings.

When we are told we can't lose, we play like a team that thought they could show up and win.

But when the press clipping aren't in our favor, we make a statement.

It's hard to believe that it's just a coincidence.

[bluedogok]

I agree SAS..or as Nate Newton used to say on a Sunday night show on KXAS when he was with the Cowboys, when it comes to press clippings a lot of guys "start smelling themselves" and think they don't stink.

[tulsaoilerfan]

I think it's overall team speed; we don't seem to be as fast on defense as we used to be, and the reliance on the huge boys on the offensive line makes us susceptible to speed rushers; just my .02 and you can ignore if it you wish. :)

[princetonsooner]

TEAM SPEED & A HUNGER TO BE THE BEST!

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Yes Pete Carroll is the greatest coach ever, however despite his teams overwhelming work ethic, overwhelming athetic ability, not to mention being the tallest, strongest, fastest, quickest, mentally tough, most disciplined, and generally the only group of young men to ever to be worthy to sit on Mount Olympus with the Gods themselves. Hercules himself would at best be a third stringer on this team, and if Zeus could throw his lightning bolts with half the speed and accuracy that John Wayne David Booty could throw the ball, or if Jesus could run a 4.3 fourty on water in a matter similar to Joe McKnight. Despite this, they still managed to lose to Stanford and Oregon, who only have mere mortals on their team. And didn't they lose two games last year... Hold up this doesn't compute....

[BASSooner]

Yes Pete Carroll is the greatest coach ever, however despite his teams overwhelming work ethic, overwhelming athetic ability, not to mention being the tallest, strongest, fastest, quickest, mentally tough, most disciplined, and generally the only group of young men to ever to be worthy to sit on Mount Olympus with the Gods themselves. Hercules himself would at best be a third stringer on this team, and if Zeus could throw his lightning bolts with half the speed and accuracy that John Wayne David Booty could throw the ball, or if Jesus could run a 4.3 fourty on water in a matter similar to Joe McKnight. Despite this, they still managed to lose to Stanford and Oregon, who only have mere mortals on their team. And didn't they lose two games last year... Hold up this doesn't compute....
ahem...see their rose bowl victories

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

But we are Sooners, we don't tolerate losses ever, so which is it, "WE ARE OKLAHOMA AND WE ONLY PLAY FOR TITLES" or "WE ARE OKLAHOMA AND WE WILL LOSE TWO GAMES BUT KICK *** IN OUR BOWL GAMES" Which one are we striving for because I was under the impression that we only accept 100% perfection from our teams.

[usmc-sooner]

If Bob can't win 47 straight what good is he?

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

I hope you aren't referencing are ****ty *** coach from the fifities named Bud Wilkinson...That ******* was only 28-28-1 against Top 25 teams....He should have been fired. In his 16 seasons at OU, he only won 3 National Titles...that means that 13 seasons were WORTHLESS!

[bluedogok]

ahem...see their rose bowl victories
It also helps when the best team out of the Big 10/11 is pulled out of the Rose Bowl to play in the BCS game that you wind up playing the second or third best team in the Rose Bowl. See the last time that they played a non-Big 10/11 team in the Rose Bowl.

[BASSooner]

But we are Sooners, we don't tolerate losses ever, so which is it, "WE ARE OKLAHOMA AND WE ONLY PLAY FOR TITLES" or "WE ARE OKLAHOMA AND WE WILL LOSE TWO GAMES BUT KICK *** IN OUR BOWL GAMES" Which one are we striving for because I was under the impression that we only accept 100% perfection from our teams.
and why not? USC does and they have a pretty fine record.

Of course, you can't achieve perfection but like I said earlier, you end up with GREAT results.

[jccouger]

Georgia has it right. Look at how much emotion their players and coach showed towards the end of the year and look at the results of their games! They were unstoppable! They even brought out some black jerseys for a little extra 'tude. Whatever they are doing in Athens is what we need to start emulating.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Do you think to start the first spring practice, Bob opens with, "Guys I just want us to try to be allright this year. I mean if we can win most of our games...AWESOME" Do you think that Bob Stoops doesn't stress perfection. This is the same guy that losses 4 defensive starters and arguably his two best offensive players, he always says we expect the backups to step up and show why we expect great things from them. Pete Carroll probably stresses perfection less than we do.

[lksseven]

I think every thread but yours has missed the point - thank you! The coach's soul searching should be about recruiting philosophy and character.

With the exception of the 2000 championship team (which had some older exceptional leaders on it), Stoops teams all share the common thread of underperforming their physical talent. Each year has produced a team that is 'enigmatic', and 'erratic'. Inconsistent effort and repeated ongoing mental mistakes (offsides, illegal procedures, holding, personal fouls, trying to field punts inside the 10 yard line while going backwards, etc). And also bad choices off the field (grades, pay for no work, theft, etc). All of that speaks to the mental aspect of our teams, and it spells 'bad choices' and lack of self discipline.

Stoops teams seem to be characterized by a lack of self discipline -
- offensive linemen getting pushed around on the field because they loafed in the weight room in offseason training;
- starters not making good enough grades to play;
- starters cheating and/or stealing;
- players not able to focus strongly enough on being 'in the moment' that they don't commit the dumb mental errors on the field that kill drives and momentum;
- players giving up and going through the motions when the game gets away from them.

The question is, if this is so, why is it so?
I believe Stoops' coaching philosophy errs on the side of 'an extra 10lbs of muscle, an extra 1" in height, and an exra .1 second off the 40yd dash' at the expense of recruiting players who have the character and self discipline to prepare themselves to play - and to play - to 100% of their abilities each and every game.

Not to say that we don't have many fine players who are also fine people - I believe we do. What I'm saying is that these teams - in aggregate - do not have the collective grit and character to consistently perform at their best in tense situations.
(And the example that gauls me the most is an offensive line that outweighs its opposing line by 40lbs/man and can't run block - a bunch of pathetic baby hugheys.)