Plain and Simple

[boomersooner28]

We aren't good enough this year. Thats it. It's not Coach Stoops fault, not Venables, not the defensive backfield, not the injury bug, NONE OF THAT CRAP MATTERS! We just don't have a MNC team this year, PLAIN AND SIMPLE. I'm sick of the dumb posters and sports talk callers whining, complaining, and making excuses. If anybody thinks we were good enough to win in Lubbock, then beat Osux, then beat KU/Mizzou and beat whoever in the Championship game, with all do respect I think you are a MORAN!


It's gonna be ok. We will have the talent again. We will have a veteran team again. We will have playmakers again. We need leaders. Leaders that step up when times get tough on the road. We will have those again. We will win a MNC soon, very soon.

WE ARE OKLAHOMA!

[sozo]

Pretty well right on.

[goingoneight]

Amen, I'm seriously like "why don't you just go and root for someone who doesn't have 7 National Championships... because there's about 115 teams who don't," everytime I hear someone **** and moan about a loss. Especially people who blame coaches after everything that went wrong that night. I don't care if Barry Switzer was roaming the sidelines, when you lose four talented players to injury and you're missing two other stud DE's to begin with, you're going to have a tough time on the road. Anyone want to ask Barry Switzer what happened to his team when they lost Aikman? That was IN NORMAN and we still lost. It freaking happens.

[Clever Trevor]

Amen, I'm seriously like "why don't you just go and root for someone who doesn't have 7 National Championships... because there's about 115 teams who don't," everytime I hear someone **** and moan about a loss. Especially people who blame coaches after everything that went wrong that night. I don't care if Barry Switzer was roaming the sidelines, when you lose four talented players to injury and you're missing two other stud DE's to begin with, you're going to have a tough time on the road. Anyone want to ask Barry Switzer what happened to his team when they lost Aikman? That was IN NORMAN and we still lost. It freaking happens.
Who is the 4th?

[kc sooner]

We aren't good enough this year. Thats it. It's not Coach Stoops fault, not Venables, not the defensive backfield, not the injury bug, NONE OF THAT CRAP MATTERS! We just don't have a MNC team this year, PLAIN AND SIMPLE. I'm sick of the dumb posters and sports talk callers whining, complaining, and making excuses. If anybody thinks we were good enough to win in Lubbock, then beat Osux, then beat KU/Mizzou and beat whoever in the Championship game, with all do respect I think you are a MORAN!


It's gonna be ok. We will have the talent again. We will have a veteran team again. We will have playmakers again. We need leaders. Leaders that step up when times get tough on the road. We will have those again. We will win a MNC soon, very soon.

WE ARE OKLAHOMA!

Colorado was good enough to win in Lubbock, you don't think we have more talent than Colorado. Oh wait we lost to them also, I know we have more talent than them. I think that's what upsests people the most - losing to teams with inferior talent. I know that we could possibly win a MNC again soon, but you never know, that's why it's so frustrating when you get so close and lose games that you shouldn't lose. When people disagree with coaching or game planning, what is wrong with talking about it?

[boomersooner28]

It's fine to talk about it, but people go wayyyy overboard. Talking about firing the man that has brought OUr program out of the mud and into title hunts EVERY SINGLE year really chaps my ***, and it is stupid. I know people want to complain, people get mad, but geez, there are sooo many greater concerns in this world than losing a football game.

[blackbeauty02]

We aren't good enough this year. Thats it. It's not Coach Stoops fault, not Venables, not the defensive backfield, not the injury bug, NONE OF THAT CRAP MATTERS! We just don't have a MNC team this year, PLAIN AND SIMPLE. I'm sick of the dumb posters and sports talk callers whining, complaining, and making excuses. If anybody thinks we were good enough to win in Lubbock, then beat Osux, then beat KU/Mizzou and beat whoever in the Championship game, with all do respect I think you are a MORAN!


It's gonna be ok. We will have the talent again. We will have a veteran team again. We will have playmakers again. We need leaders. Leaders that step up when times get tough on the road. We will have those again. We will win a MNC soon, very soon.

WE ARE OKLAHOMA!

damn straight. we are a young team. it takes time.

[TrophyCollector]

This team should have been good enough to win at CU and at Lubbock, beat OSU and have a chance to win the Big XII. With the way this season has gone, do you really think we wouldn't have a chance to beat LSU or anyone else in the title game?

The 2000 team had to knock away a pass at OSU and get a pick 6 at ATM to win it.

Winning a title takes some luck and the ability to make plays on the road. This team has neither which is the only reason they aren't playing in the title game. They have just as much talent as the 2000 team had, more in places.

IMHO, at OU there is zero acceptable excuse for blowing a 17 point lead at a .500 team or having your defense completely destroyed by Tech or having a backup QB that has so little playing time that it takes him 2 quarters to adjust to a game situation. Neither loss has anything to do with lack of talent.

[olevetonahill]

Like TC said it takes LUCK and No injuries
we were GOOD enough it just didnt happen
On to the CCG ;)

[KingBarry]

I know that we could possibly win a MNC again soon, but you never know, that's why it's so frustrating when you get so close and lose games that you shouldn't lose. When people disagree with coaching or game planning, what is wrong with talking about it?

Nothing wrong with talking about what's wrong, but you shouldn't overlook what's right, either.

If you want to say that Stoops is a poor coach for losing a game that was a stepping stone to the TNC, then you likewise have to recognize that, at week 12 of the season, we were in control of our own destiny to the title.

How many coaches managed to keep themselves in national contention until week 12? Maybe 5? Does that mean that Bob Stoops is among the five best coaches in the game? Maybe.

Does the fact that he lost at Tech mean he is only the fifth best of those coaches? Maybe it does, but fifth best is still pretty good.

[pott_2]

"The only ones who never lose are the ones who never play.''

Sound familiar? We can't win them all. We aren't too far removed from the 90's.

[Sooner in Tampa]

I agree completely. We are just not at that level this year. We cannot lose to TTU, Col, and struggle against a bad ISU team and expect to get to the dance.

We should have know there would be bumps in the road...Sam is a Freshman and there was a lot riding on his shoulders. I think I am most suprised by our lack of consitent play from the OL. I thought they would be the bedrock of our offense.

We will be fine, we should beat those stepchildren from stoolwater and then play in the CCG. IF we win the BIG XII and go to a BCS game (and win that) I would be satisfied with this year. Dissappointed---yes---but still satisfied.

[SoonerJack]

I think that's what upsests people the most - losing to teams with inferior talent.

KC, teams with superior talent lose to teams with lesser talent all the freakin' time. Just look at all of the upsets that have occurred in college football this year! When you reduce the number of scholarships that each school can offer, good players go other places because they want to play football. So they wind up at Boise State or Appalachian State or Texas Tech. I heard Switzer say one time that they'd give a kid a scholly just to keep 0-state from getting him. That doesn't happen any more.

And rankings? The wise football swamis who put these things together at the beginning of every season should be given dart boards and trained chimps.

[Desert Sapper]

We still have a better than average chance of beating osu and competing for the Big XII against the MO-KAN winner. That's a damn good season, especially considering where we were 10 years ago. I think this team has learned more from the two losses this year than they did from any of the wins.

[Doged]

Going undefeated through the regular season is a phenomenal achievement these days. There are relatively few Div 1 schools that field a team completely incapable of turning in a winning performance against virtually any other team.

Coach Stoops has put together how many undefeated regular seasons? I'm thinking it's three, with two back-to-back (03 and 04?) but someone check me on that.

Only 3 teams come readily to mind that haven't lost to "less talented" teams this year.. Kansas, Mizzou and Hawaii.

[SoonerStormchaser]

I agree completely. We are just not at that level this year. We cannot lose to TTU, Col, and struggle against a bad ISU team and expect to get to the dance.

I dunno...the Acorn Aggies struggled against a lot of REALLY BAD teams in 2002 (Illinois, Purdue, Penn State) and still won the NC (with the help of another set of bad Big XII refs).

[Sooner in Tampa]

I dunno...the Acorn Aggies struggled against a lot of REALLY BAD teams in 2002 (Illinois, Purdue, Penn State) and still won the NC (with the help of another set of bad Big XII refs).HEH...youre right about that...but they didn't lose. We have no excuse for losing to Colorado...TTU---well that's another story. Even without Bradford though...I still think we should win that game.

[medstudent24]

What year is austin english?

[yermom]

you have to get at least a little lucky to win a national championship

we haven't really been lucky at all

[medstudent24]

HEH...youre right about that...but they didn't lose. We have no excuse for losing to Colorado...TTU---well that's another story. Even without Bradford though...I still think we should win that game.

I give us a pass against Tech, especially since we played them really well int eh 2nd half and didnt give up. Its a lot better than our whole team quitting like they did against SC and KSU in 03

[medstudent24]

you have to get at least a little lucky to win a national championship

we haven't really been lucky at all

Yeah, plus you cant have key injuries like losing both your starting DEs

[pennsooner]

If everyone would think back to the early pre-season conversations, you will remember that Coach Stoops was saying that he thought that this was a year to grow, and that next year would be the big one. Given the youth on this team, I am inclined to agree with him. I am thrilled that this team got close but everything this year is good gravy. Beat the Pokes!!

[Spanish Sooner]

If everyone would think back to the early pre-season conversations, you will remember that Coach Stoops was saying that he thought that this was a year to grow, and that next year would be the big one. Given the youth on this team, I am inclined to agree with him. I am thrilled that this team got close but everything this year is good gravy. Beat the Pokes!!

I agree, and we've been spoiled. We all expected 1-2 losses this year(just not against these teams) and winning the south but after the fast start, we got spoiled, we thought, oh wow we could win number 8 woot, and now that we are on track to achieve our original expectations, we are all ****ed because we aren't contending for a championship any longer, when back in august no one thought it possible.

Either way, young team, and offensively we (hopefully) only lose finley and patrick, and Gresham and Murray are an improvement in that department.

[FaninAma]

If you can't beat 2 mediocre teams on the road then, yeah, you're not deserving to play for the national title.

OU is a mediocre road team and has been for several years, now. Until the coaches get that corrected the Sooners won't be playing for a national title anytime soon. National titles are won and lost in how a team handles road games.

The one bad thing about their collapse on the road this year is that it will be a long time before the schedule sets up as favorably as it did this year.

2007 was another wasted opportunity in what is becoming an increasingly long string of wasted opportunities for this program.......
2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2007.

[cheezyq]

I disagree to a large extent. I don't personally think it's a talent issue at all. Lack of experience? Maybe.

Going into the season, our only questions were at LB, QB, and DE. I think we've more than established that we're solid with Bradford at QB, and others at DE (despite the injuries). I think we're inconsistent at LB, with the obvious exception of Lofton.

Ask any expert who knows anything about college football, and I think you'll find it rare to hear negative comments about the talent. We have pretty much the best OL in the country, the most efficient passer, one of the best stables of RBs, and a very talented WR group. We have one of the better defenses in the country, and our secondary is as talented as anyone else.

Talent-wise, we stack up well with any team in the country, and that includes the almighty LSU Tigers :rolleyes:. I think our biggest problem is execution, especially on the road. We've fumbled too many times, dropped too many passes, blown too many coverages, and missed too many tackles.

Part of that falls on the coaches, and part of that falls on the players. But I think that it's more likely just a lack of experience and leadership. I think at times we all question our coaches, which is fair in some cases. But also our players are usually in position to make plays, and they fail to do so.

The icing on the cake is when we face adversity. Good leaders on the field will step up and make plays, charge up their teammates, etc. In several circumstances this year, our players haven't stepped up and made good things happen.

Let's use the Colorado game as an example:

- Malcolm Kelly, one of the best receivers in the country, didn't get open to catch a single ball.
- Sam Bradford was slightly off, throwing into coverage, and throwing above and behind receivers.
- Our other receivers, including the TEs, continually dropped passes.
- Our defense blew coverage deep on the last touchdown.
- Our defense missed tackles, allowing the RB to rack up yards.
- Reggie Smith muffs a punt.

All these things can be attributed to lack of leadership, or inexperience. Perhaps it's also a lack of heart, but I don't think that's the case. They seem to be trying hard, but just lack the understanding of where the play is going, what needs to be done to make a big play.

I think that in the Iowa State game, you could see some of those good qualities start to develop. The team got down, but made enough plays to come from behind and win. They showed their dominance, physically, by controlling the line of scrimmage.

The TT game was a tough game because of the loss of SB. I think that hurt the team mentally, and they just got down on themselves too much. By the time they recovered, it was too late to overcome the officials (yeah, I know, but I had to put it in there :) ) and their early mistakes. They certainly had the momentum by the time the game was over.

In the end, I think this will be a lesson for the team...that no matter what happens, they have the talent to overcome almost any obstacle (even poor officiating), and that they shouldn't let themselves get down too early. Hopefully that will result in more wins, but we'll see.

[Johnny Utah]

I waited a least 48 hours to post this because a didn't want to come across as a ********* and get run off this board. I'm hopefully speaking for more than just myself in saying that most rational posters are not really crying that the sky is falling, or for an overhaul of the coaching staff. Our frustration is not so much that we've lost some games over the past few seasons, but more that we've lost those games either to "lesser" teams, and/or in the national spotlight. I live in the middle of SEC country and in this area, rightly or wrongly, our program is at risk of being "defined" by those games. Unfortunately, as another poster indicated in another thread, the Holiday Bowl victory over the Ducks seems like a long time ago, especially in this "what have you done for me lately" world.

[medstudent24]

If you can't beat 2 mediocre teams on the road then, yeah, you're not deserving to play for the national title.

OU is a mediocre road team and has been for several years, now. Until the coaches get that corrected the Sooners won't be playing for a national title anytime soon. National titles are won and lost in how a team handles road games.

The one bad thing about their collapse on the road this year is that it will be a long time before the schedule sets up as favorably as it did this year.

2007 was another wasted opportunity in what is becoming an increasingly long string of wasted opportunities for this program.......
2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2007.

I think the road game woes are directly related to defense woes. When you go on the road its more likely that yoru offense is going to struggle, so you need a good defense.

I think a #1 rated defense and a #100 rated offense is far more likely to win road games than a #1 rated offense and a #100 rated defense.

[Johnny Utah]

I think the road game woes are directly related to defense woes. When you go on the road its more likely that yoru offense is going to struggle, so you need a good defense.

I think a #1 rated defense and a #100 rated offense is far more likely to win road games than a #1 rated offense and a #100 rated defense.

I agree. Plus an offense that can pound the ball through dominating the line of scrimmage would help (and take the crowd out of the game). It seems too easy for an inexperienced pass happy offense to get rattled on the road.

[Stoop Dawg]

Talent-wise, we stack up well with any team in the country, and that includes the almighty LSU Tigers :rolleyes:. I think our biggest problem is execution, especially on the road. We've fumbled too many times, dropped too many passes, blown too many coverages, and missed too many tackles.

If a player fumbles, drops passes, and misses tackles, what exactly is their "talent"? I thought "talent" was the ability to NOT fumble, drop passes, and miss tackles.


Let's use the Colorado game as an example:

- Malcolm Kelly, one of the best receivers in the country, didn't get open to catch a single ball.
- Sam Bradford was slightly off, throwing into coverage, and throwing above and behind receivers.
- Our other receivers, including the TEs, continually dropped passes.
- Our defense blew coverage deep on the last touchdown.
- Our defense missed tackles, allowing the RB to rack up yards.
- Reggie Smith muffs a punt.

All these things can be attributed to lack of leadership, or inexperience.

MK needs leadership to get open? Bradford needs leadership to throw accurately? Our receivers need leadership to catch balls that hit them in the hands? Our defense needs a leader to tell them to tackle someone? Reggie needs a leader to tell him to catch a punt?

Those things are basic football. IMO, the only valid excuse for those things are inexperience (not accustomed to the bigger, faster college game) or lack of talent (just don't have the ability to get it done).

[MclOUvin]

I think it is more that we are not mentally tough enough than we just arent good enough. There is no way we should lose to tech and colorado, we just dont have the mental toughness in competitive road games this year!

[Spanish Sooner]

The thing that we need to remember is we aren't the only team that is having these struggles. Hell Florida with their Heisman candidate QB has lost 3 games and they are the defending champs. Michigan lost to Appilachian State in the Big House. USC was beat by Stanford at home. Frankly this year has been f'ing crazy. But this team has and is improving, and loosing on the road two conference opponents in environments that extremely favor the home team is a lot better then being beat by a 40 point underdog or a division 1AA opponent (though Appy State is one of the best in D 1AA/FCS)

Frankly it could have been worse. We are a top program that continues to be successful. 4 big 12 titles in 8 years, 5 big 12 south in 8 years with a chance to add 5 and 6 respectively. Is it what we want, no. I graduate next semester and I wanted us to win while I was here. (Though 3 years in law school here means I got a chance)

But everything is continuing to be good for us. We bring in top talent, we have success(though not as much as we would hope) with a good coaching staff, and a stadium that is becoming one of the toughest places to play. Look at the other teams in conference, we have a team who is having a hard time continuing success without their all world qb, or a team that should be playing at our level but is plagued by mediocre coaching. Or a team that thinks they should be contenders, who claim to have the best tradition in the big 12 who are being hounded by a coach who they thought was a great hire who turned out to be a dud. Who claim to have the toughest place to play but had all their losses their in 06 and let a WAC team fight back from a 17-0 halftime lead, and take them to overtime. Or be a team on the rise year in year out, only to go to troy get spanked and be stuck in the same mediocre funk that has plagued them for as long as I can remember.

It may not be as good as we want, and it may not be relevant but I needed to rant. Its harder and harder in college to have a dynasty and go on a tear like we did back in the day because of talent being spread out more evenly. but to win as consistently as we do and pretty much owning our conference(more big 12 titles then anyone in our conference) is good, not what I want, but I'll take it.

This year has proved that loosing to conference opponents on the road isn't as bad as used to be, especially when the highest paid coach in the country looses to University of Louisana-Monroe while coaching on of the most storied program in the country.

Bitch all you want, its your right as a human being, but lets keep things in perspective this season, we are 9-2 with Rex....I mean a redshirt Freshman as our quarter back, with a good O-line(not great run blocking needs to improve, pass blocking has been good) We lost to a team that is light years better then they were last year and team that hasn't had a loosing season since the big 12 was formed, both on the road. So lets bitch, lets moan, and lets criticize because Lord knows I do my fair share, but lets remember we have yet to lose(or need to play) a 1AA team at home, we don't have Dennis Franchione as our coach, we aren't an aggy school, and we aren't a media darling storied team that is 2-9 with the "second coming" at their quarterback.

So do we want more yes, but with the underclassmen we have coming back, its a great time to be a Sooner

[cheezyq]

If a player fumbles, drops passes, and misses tackles, what exactly is their "talent"? I thought "talent" was the ability to NOT fumble, drop passes, and miss tackles.

There are some of our backups that haven't ever fumbled, dropped a pass, or missed a tackle. Does that mean that our backups are better than our starters? That is quite possibly the dumbest argument I've ever heard.


MK needs leadership to get open? Bradford needs leadership to throw accurately? Our receivers need leadership to catch balls that hit them in the hands? Our defense needs a leader to tell them to tackle someone? Reggie needs a leader to tell him to catch a punt?

Those things are basic football. IMO, the only valid excuse for those things are inexperience (not accustomed to the bigger, faster college game) or lack of talent (just don't have the ability to get it done).

Um, I believe I mentioned inexperience, but I guess facts like that don't matter to you. Inexperience could be a reason why MK doesn't get open. You have to know the routes to run, or find ways to get open, and that comes with experience. Inexperience could attribute to taking bad angles on a tackle, and not tackling with the proper technique.

Leaders make plays when plays are needed, and leaders motivate others to do better. Good leaders don't make huge mistakes, like muffing a punt. Good leaders have their head in the game and don't drop passes that hit them in the hands and blow coverages, and whiff on tackles.

But most importantly, leaders encourage and motivate their teammates when they face adversity and keep a bad situation from escalating into a loss.

[Stoop Dawg]

There are some of our backups that haven't ever fumbled, dropped a pass, or missed a tackle. Does that mean that our backups are better than our starters? That is quite possibly the dumbest argument I've ever heard.

Dumbest argument you've ever heard? You haven't been here long enough then.

My point, if you care to hear it, is that to be "talented" you need to be able to perform the primary function of your position. A receiver should be able to catch the ball when it hits him in the hands. A punt returner should be able to catch the ball. A LB should be able to tackle. If you can't do those things it would be difficult to call you "talented".

Note that I'm not saying that our team is not talented. Quite the contrary. Even talented players make mistakes. But given the number of mistakes made by our team in critical situations, you're going to have a hard time convincing me that we are "more talented" than every other team in the country.


Um, I believe I mentioned inexperience, but I guess facts like that don't matter to you.

Indeed you did, but I was addressing your comment on leadership. You'll notice that I agree with your statement that inexperience is likely the primary factor.


Leaders make plays when plays are needed, and leaders motivate others to do better. Good leaders don't make huge mistakes, like muffing a punt. Good leaders have their head in the game and don't drop passes that hit them in the hands and blow coverages, and whiff on tackles.


Right. That's pretty much what I said. Apparently you were too busy feeling "attacked" to notice.

[hink4769]

Even talented players make mistakes. But given the number of mistakes made by our team in critical situations, you're going to have a hard time convincing me that we are "more talented" than every other team in the country.

And what team doesn't make these mistakes? If you say LSU, well I'll concede that one because I think they are a better team. If your answer is Kansas, well, I hope we see them in the CCG and they'll make plenty of mistakes during their loss to OU. Mizzou? Well, rerun Chase Daniels game against us and look at all his mistakes. Point is, every team makes mistakes, even the good ones that are supposedly better than us.