The refs probably didn't do Tech any favors

[Half a Hundred]

It should be fun watching the shoddy officiating.

That was not a touchdown.

[Crimson Kid]

Close, but no TD imo.

[tommieharris91]

That was kind of a PATHETIC call. Does Christal ref with a blindfold on?

[Jack T.]

Official Review strikes again.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Which announcer said RC was his buddy? said he wouldnt stand for that stuff that happened in atm-OU game

[aurorasooner]

Dammit - now that's good, unbelievable but good. I just called the home number and a lady says he's not available right now..... She probably got him ready earlier this week for the Tech fans :D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2StPWy7GkA

[cheezyq]

Seems Leach feels the same way:

Link (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=3104347)


Texas Tech coach Leach suggests Texas bias after loss

Associated Press

Updated: November 10, 2007, 10:48 PM ET

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AUSTIN, Texas -- Texas Tech coach Mike Leach ripped game officials Saturday, suggesting the crew favored Texas, after the Longhorns beat the Red Raiders 59-43.

Without naming him, Leach noted that referee Randy Christal lives in Austin.

"I think it's disturbing that Austin residents are involved in this. People work too hard, too long, there's too much money invested in these games to allow that," Leach said.

"Am I condemning the crew? Hell yeah, I'm condemning the crew," Leach said.

Big 12 official spokesman Bob Burda did not immediately respond to telephone messages seeking comment. Leach's rant will likely draw a fine from the league and possibly a suspension.

Leach was upset officials disallowed two Tech touchdowns in the third quarter. The first was overruled when video replay clearly showed the receiver let the ball hit the ground. On the next play, a touchdown pass was negated by a holding penalty. Leach also wanted, but didn't get, a flag for roughing the quarterback.

"Unless this can change, the Big 12 Conference needs to take a serious look at having out of conference officials officiate the Texas Tech-Texas games and perhaps other games where there is proven to be a bias by officiating," he said. "It's unfortunate and does the bowl picture enter into it? I don't know. Does the money enter into it? I don't know."

Leach's rant lasted for several minutes.

"It may be incompetence, bias, I don't know. Maybe it's something as simple as guys sitting over the water cooler at their office in Austin talking about how the great game they're going to see -- and then perhaps a preconceived notion develops as to how it's going to come out," he said.

Asked if expects to be punished by the league for his remarks, Leach said, "I expect to be coaching. I don't know what will happen but I'm not standing for this."

UMMM....I don't disagree with Leach here, but does he remember 2005 v. OU?

[crimson&cream]

Seems Leach feels the same way:

Link (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=3104347)



UMMM....I don't disagree with Leach here, but does he remember 2005 v. OU?
And didn't some of those refs live in Lubbock -yep they did.

[utex74]

It should be fun watching the shoddy officiating.

That was not a touchdown.

Yes. It was. But close. Shipley's foot came down in bounds.

[ocsooner]

It kills me that Leach is throwing a fit over this. Not that it doesn't deserve a rant, but someone who has some credibility needs to throw the rant, not the guy who turned the other way when he was handed a much more important win than he just lost.

[EnidHighSooner]

AUSTIN, Texas -- Texas Tech coach Mike Leach ripped game officials Saturday, suggesting the crew favored Texas, after the Longhorns beat the Red Raiders 59-43.

Without naming him, Leach noted that referee Randy Christal lives in Austin.

"I think it's disturbing that Austin residents are involved in this. People work too hard, too long, there's too much money invested in these games to allow that," Leach said.

"Am I condemning the crew? Hell yeah, I'm condemning the crew," Leach said.

Big 12 official spokesman Bob Burda did not immediately respond to telephone messages seeking comment. Leach's rant will likely draw a fine from the league and possibly a suspension.

Leach was upset officials disallowed two Tech touchdowns in the third quarter. The first was overruled when video replay clearly showed the receiver let the ball hit the ground. On the next play, a touchdown pass was negated by a holding penalty. Leach also wanted, but didn't get, a flag for roughing the quarterback.

"Unless this can change, the Big 12 Conference needs to take a serious look at having out of conference officials officiate the Texas Tech-Texas games and perhaps other games where there is proven to be a bias by officiating," he said. "It's unfortunate and does the bowl picture enter into it? I don't know. Does the money enter into it? I don't know."

Leach's rant lasted for several minutes.

"It may be incompetence, bias, I don't know. Maybe it's something as simple as guys sitting over the water cooler at their office in Austin talking about how the great game they're going to see -- and then perhaps a preconceived notion develops as to how it's going to come out," he said.

Asked if expects to be punished by the league for his remarks, Leach said, "I expect to be coaching. I don't know what will happen but I'm not standing for this."

That suspension could be good for us :)

[kevpks]

Leach has got to get suspended for that. Stoops wasn't even that aggressive about the Oregon screwjob. If Leach is suspended, who is going to call their plays?

[Curly Bill]

Here's the answer to the original question: The conferences don't want to assign officials based on where they are from, where they graduated from, where their kids go to school, etc, etc, because to do so would be admitting that the officials might be capable of bias...and that my friends is a can of worms that college football officials don't want to open up. They want to perpetuate the idea that officials are paragons of honesty and virtue, to admit that might not always be the case would be a bad deal for them.

[Williesan]

The irony of this, in light of that day in November 2005, is very thick right now. Seriously - the league will send a message Leach that his public outburst won't be tolerated, even if he is calling a spade a spade.

IMHO, the offiiciating today in the Big XII was pathetic at best.

Bible's crew flat stunk tonight in Norman. I counted seven penalties on one drive they missed (4 obvious holds, a chop block, a clip, and the intentional grounding call where Syzmanski was "outside the tackle box" per Bible - he never got more than one foot off the hashmark that the ball was snapped from!!!!) and Baylor ended up scoring on that drive. (Note: the spread was 37 to 38 all week... we won by 31.)

The Castleberry crew in Stillwater was marginal at best. They flubbed the 2nd & 10 call where Robinson tried to pitch the ball to Savage two feet away. The ball should have come back to the spot of the fumble - KU never had possession of the ball, and the offense should never get the benefit of a gain from a forward fumble. Should have been 3rd & 11.

I didn't see Mizzou/A&M or ISU/Colorado but I'm sure there were moments in those games too. The reality is: Big XII officials SUCCS. Period. But notice from our forays outside our conference, their guys aren't much better.

< rant mode = ON >
To get officiating back on track, the NCAA should take the assignment of officials away from the conferences, or at least establish guidelines for who can call games involving University X. If I wore the stripes, you can bet that I wouldn't call any games involving OU (I'm a graduate of OU), OSU & Tulsa (born and raised in Tulsa) or the Big XII (too many possible conflicts of interest to list here). I'd even have a hard time calling any C-USA games for the same reason, but not as much as the Big XII. It just makes sense to prevent this and centralizing the officiating or establishing non-bias guidelines would be a good first step.
< rant mode = OFF >

Williesan (still looking for an application to be a Ref!!!!)

[Williesan]

deleted = double post.

[NorthernIowaSooner]

i think hes just calling out crappy big XII officiating and i didnt see the game but im glad he is regardless of the calls and what they shouldve been the big XII needs some replay help

[Williesan]

(dang it - triple post!!!!)

[Curly Bill]

I'm all for pointing out sucky officiating. For too long officials have been sheltered and sort of "above the law" so-to-speak. I think that has contributed to some of the crap officiating we've seen, these guys end up thinking they're invincible no matter how badly they might screw up a game or even some teams season.

[tulsaoilerfan]

The irony of this, in light of that day in November 2005, is very thick right now. Seriously - the league will send a message Leach that his public outburst won't be tolerated, even if he is calling a spade a spade.

IMHO, the offiiciating today in the Big XII was pathetic at best.

Bible's crew flat stunk tonight in Norman. I counted seven penalties on one drive they missed (4 obvious holds, a chop block, a clip, and the intentional grounding call where Syzmanski was "outside the tackle box" per Bible - he never got more than one foot off the hashmark that the ball was snapped from!!!!) and Baylor ended up scoring on that drive. (Note: the spread was 37 to 38 all week... we won by 31.)

The Castleberry crew in Stillwater was marginal at best. They flubbed the 2nd & 10 call where Robinson tried to pitch the ball to Savage two feet away. The ball should have come back to the spot of the fumble - KU never had possession of the ball, and the offense should never get the benefit of a gain from a forward fumble. Should have been 3rd & 11.

I didn't see Mizzou/A&M or ISU/Colorado but I'm sure there were moments in those games too. The reality is: Big XII officials SUCCS. Period. But notice from our forays outside our conference, their guys aren't much better.

< rant mode = ON >
To get officiating back on track, the NCAA should take the assignment of officials away from the conferences, or at least establish guidelines for who can call games involving University X. If I wore the stripes, you can bet that I wouldn't call any games involving OU (I'm a graduate of OU), OSU & Tulsa (born and raised in Tulsa) or the Big XII (too many possible conflicts of interest to list here). I'd even have a hard time calling any C-USA games for the same reason, but not as much as the Big XII. It just makes sense to prevent this and centralizing the officiating or establishing non-bias guidelines would be a good first step.
< rant mode = OFF >

Williesan (still looking for an application to be a Ref!!!!)

Oh yeah, that should have been grounding as he wasn't even close to the right tackle, let alone outside him, and the chop block was a mystery to me also; how in the hell could they have missed that? Just more things that make you go hmmmm

[Jimminy Crimson]

...on homecooking refs.

heh!


AUSTIN, Texas -- Texas Tech coach Mike Leach ripped game officials Saturday, suggesting the crew favored Texas, after the Longhorns beat the Red Raiders 59-43.

Without naming him, Leach noted that referee Randy Christal lives in Austin.

"I think it's disturbing that Austin residents are involved in this. People work too hard, too long, there's too much money invested in these games to allow that," Leach said.

"Am I condemning the crew? Hell yeah, I'm condemning the crew," Leach said.

Big 12 official spokesman Bob Burda did not immediately respond to telephone messages seeking comment. Leach's rant will likely draw a fine from the league and possibly a suspension.

Leach was upset officials disallowed two Tech touchdowns in the third quarter. The first was overruled when video replay clearly showed the receiver let the ball hit the ground. On the next play, a touchdown pass was negated by a holding penalty. Leach also wanted, but didn't get, a flag for roughing the quarterback.

"Unless this can change, the Big 12 Conference needs to take a serious look at having out of conference officials officiate the Texas Tech-Texas games and perhaps other games where there is proven to be a bias by officiating," he said. "It's unfortunate and does the bowl picture enter into it? I don't know. Does the money enter into it? I don't know."

Leach's rant lasted for several minutes.

"It may be incompetence, bias, I don't know. Maybe it's something as simple as guys sitting over the water cooler at their office in Austin talking about how the great game they're going to see -- and then perhaps a preconceived notion develops as to how it's going to come out," he said.

Asked if expects to be punished by the league for his remarks, Leach said, "I expect to be coaching. I don't know what will happen but I'm not standing for this."


:pop:

[Frozen Sooner]

Folks:

Posting the personal information of referees is completely unacceptable. Whether they are biased or they have a bias that you perceive, harassing them and their families is messed the **** up.

[One of Bob's Children]

sometime fake pirates get beat... most times times the zebras cannot help...

[aurorasooner]

Another Sooner board was going to monitor the Big 12 officiating crews as to the geographic area where they reside vs the games they were assigned as well as if they had any university affiliations to the teams of the games that they were assigned. I thought at the time it was a good idea. Since then, I haven't read or heard a peep on that board about that so-called "Big-12 referee monitoring". It also seems like when Walt Anderson was announced as head of Big 12 officiating that a reporter (or one of the guys that run that board), called out both Bebee and Anderson on that exact subject in preseason Big 12 dog and pony show (when Bebee jumped in and pulled his Weedberg/Michael Jackson backwards shuffle). This supposed monitoring of the Big 12 officiating crew assignments has sort of mysteriously disappeared (been swept under the carpet--suppressed---quashed--extinguished--wiped out--you get the message).
It's going to be interesting to see which crew the Big 12 sends to Lubbock after the 2005 homer officiating fiasco and as well as Leach calling out the officials in yesterday's game for the same exact thing. I would imagine that ABC would be all over this, but ABC is rather wimpy when it comes around to making "college officiating" a story on it's broadcasts. The thing that scares me about the Lubbock game is that the Whorns have to have a Tech win or they're eliminated from the Big 12 south as are everyone else since the Big 12 south conference championship would be over. I've got a feeling that no matter what Leach says or who he calls out about Big 12 officiating, Tech will get the ""officiating breaks" not only because of the "conference TV ratings factor" but also becauce of the "whorn factor". I also think that's the last you'll hear from Leach about the subject and we'll probably hear some type of Nice-Nice "emotion-of-the-minute"type of apology , because he's a smart guy and knows if he upsets OU on an ABC night game, all the Sand Aggies (and the other big-time programs, such as UCLA, possibly looking for a new coach to step up from a mid-level program) will forget about Texas, Missouri, CU and OSU losses. Playing Tech in Lubbock with so much on the line, conference-wise, is a whole different animal than playing them at home in mid-season. Leach could pull a Bobby-Knight volcano this week and the Big 12 would smile and look the other way, although I don't think he will. BTW, with all the Big 12 homer-officiating controversy this week, this would be the perfect game for the Big 12 to allow the ABC cameras to go live inside the replay booth to show CFB fans that everything was on the up&up as ESPN did earlier in the year. I wouldn't hold my breath on that happening.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

I'm thinking something along the line of Pot and Black...

[devOUt]

Maybe the horns could work this into a pre-season ticket sale campaign. Perhaps put up some billboards with a catchy phrase like "he's in, are you?"

[GrapevineSooner]

Leach won't get suspended.

Recall Mark Mangino went on a similar tirade three years ago and I think all he got was either a fine or a stiff reprimand.

And yes, Leach sounds like a hypocrite given that the line judge, who said Taverean Henderson (IIRC) was in two years ago, was from Lubbock.

Not to mention, somebody should remind Leach that only in the NFL do the referees look at the actual replay. In college, the call is made by the replay official in the booth.

And another not to mention, your defense gave up 59 points to Texas. The refs, I think, had very little to do with that.

Just like the abysmal officiating had litte to do with our defense giving up over 500 yards of offense to Ory-Gone.

[Scott D]

So what Grapevine is really saying is...


“You know what this is about, don't you?” Mangino said. “BCS. That's what made the difference today in the game. That's what made the difference in the call in front of their bench. Dollar signs.”

[OK2LA]

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=3104347


AUSTIN, Texas -- Texas Tech coach Mike Leach ripped game officials Saturday, suggesting the crew favored Texas, after the Longhorns beat the Red Raiders 59-43.

Without naming him, Leach noted that referee Randy Christal lives in Austin.

"I think it's disturbing that Austin residents are involved in this. People work too hard, too long, there's too much money invested in these games to allow that," Leach said.

"Am I condemning the crew? Hell yeah, I'm condemning the crew," Leach said.

Big 12 official spokesman Bob Burda did not immediately respond to telephone messages seeking comment. Leach's rant will likely draw a fine from the league and possibly a suspension.

Leach was upset officials disallowed two Tech touchdowns in the third quarter. The first was overruled when video replay clearly showed the receiver let the ball hit the ground. On the next play, a touchdown pass was negated by a holding penalty. Leach also wanted, but didn't get, a flag for roughing the quarterback.

"Unless this can change, the Big 12 Conference needs to take a serious look at having out of conference officials officiate the Texas Tech-Texas games and perhaps other games where there is proven to be a bias by officiating," he said. "It's unfortunate and does the bowl picture enter into it? I don't know. Does the money enter into it? I don't know."

Leach's rant lasted for several minutes.

"It may be incompetence, bias, I don't know. Maybe it's something as simple as guys sitting over the water cooler at their office in Austin talking about how the great game they're going to see -- and then perhaps a preconceived notion develops as to how it's going to come out," he said.

Asked if expects to be punished by the league for his remarks, Leach said, "I expect to be coaching. I don't know what will happen but I'm not standing for this."

Copyright 2007 by The Associated Press

[Tulsa_Fireman]

I want to have Mike Leach's babies.

[The Maestro]

Sorry, but I guess Leach forgot about his team giving up 59 points as well as forgetting about a certain fourth down play in Lubbock two years ago. I have no sympathy for him. We got screwed at their place and Stoops took the high road while Leach claimed the refs got it right.

[Doged]

Two years ago yadda, yadda.

There have been numerous posts on this board stating that Christal has no business officiating saxet games and I'm not about to back off that just because Leach is saying it now, too.

Leach is right and the league needs to address home cooking whether it be in Austin, Lubbock, Norman or anywhere else. Instead they'll fine him and pretend all is well.

[EnidHighSooner]

So theres a chance he could be suspended??

Anything new on this?

[Sooner Eclipse]

Two years ago yadda, yadda.

There have been numerous posts on this board stating that Christal has no business officiating saxet games and I'm not about to back off that just because Leach is saying it now, too.

Leach is right and the league needs to address home cooking whether it be in Austin, Lubbock, Norman or anywhere else. Instead they'll fine him and pretend all is well.

Spot on. And you can add Jon Bible to the list of refs that should not be calling texas related games. Dude is beyond homer.

Would UT fans stand for Bud Wilkinson's nephew calling the RRS? Don't think so.

[sooner2b09]

"Am I condemning the crew? Hell yeah, I'm condemning the crew," Leach said.


This is a man who surfs in his free time, what a beast.

[jbstrick]

So theres a chance he could be suspended?

I would not be surprised. :pop:

[soonermeteor]

The irony of this, in light of that day in November 2005, is very thick right now. Seriously - the league will send a message Leach that his public outburst won't be tolerated, even if he is calling a spade a spade.

IMHO, the offiiciating today in the Big XII was pathetic at best.

Bible's crew flat stunk tonight in Norman. I counted seven penalties on one drive they missed (4 obvious holds, a chop block, a clip, and the intentional grounding call where Syzmanski was "outside the tackle box" per Bible - he never got more than one foot off the hashmark that the ball was snapped from!!!!) and Baylor ended up scoring on that drive. (Note: the spread was 37 to 38 all week... we won by 31.)



Agreed. It was terrible. Baylor jumped offsides a couple of times and was never called, and then it took the officiating crew about 10 seconds that time the Baylor playor waltzed behind our O-line. There was the missed intentional grounding as you said, and a terrible "late hit" which looked more like face mask on Baylor. They missed an obvious pass interference call. There were several "thug" like hits after plays were called dead by Baylor also and no personal fouls.

[85sooners]

:hot:

[Jacie]

Some more random musings:

I was as outraged as anyone about the twin fiascos (Tech in 2005, Oregon in 2006) and agree that of all coaches, Leach ranting about last Saturday doesn't exactly come across as credible. Truth be told, I am smiling inwardly at the very idea that the sand aggies got jobbed by home cooking from the zebras. That said having watched a lot of football I've concluded that the refs are not guilty of favoring one team over another. Rather, the college refs, the guys who call games in addition to their regular jobs, are simply not competent to do this and be accurate more than 3 times out of 4 (75%). If they were really good they'd be working for the NFL. Like it or not today's coaches, in addition to being able to evaluate highschool players, recruit them, train and condition them, manage a staff, call the offense or defense during a game (and/or trust another guy to do the same), deal with the administration-press-fans and all the other fallout that comes from being the head of a college football program, have to be able to work the refs. Some coaches are better at it than others. There have been games where Stoops performed admirably at this. However, I think some refs take offense and might subconciously punish a coach who was noted in the media for doing this.

Like the dilemma of the BCS, there is no solution in sight for the problem of poor college officiating.

[r5TPsooner]

Hello forest... meet the trees.

[OKC Sooner]

In the case of truly flagrant missed calls, I'm in favor of public flogging of the refs involved at halftime of the next game. But that's just me... :)

[soonerP_A_C]

Agreed. It was terrible. Baylor jumped offsides a couple of times and was never called, and then it took the officiating crew about 10 seconds that time the Baylor playor waltzed behind our O-line. There was the missed intentional grounding as you said, and a terrible "late hit" which looked more like face mask on Baylor. They missed an obvious pass interference call. There were several "thug" like hits after plays were called dead by Baylor also and no personal fouls.


I was wondering myself how Symanski could grab Reggie's facemask and drag him out of bounds like a suitcase and we get the 'late hit' penalty? Offensive players aren't immune from facemaks calls, are they?

[Scott D]

Two years ago yadda, yadda.

There have been numerous posts on this board stating that Christal has no business officiating saxet games and I'm not about to back off that just because Leach is saying it now, too.

Leach is right and the league needs to address home cooking whether it be in Austin, Lubbock, Norman or anywhere else. Instead they'll fine him and pretend all is well.

there are more posts saying that Christal has no business officiating any games, than only Texas games.

[douxpaysan]

Maybe the horns could work this into a pre-season ticket sale campaign. Perhaps put up some billboards with a catchy phrase like "he's in, are you?"
http://forums.scout.com/mb.aspx?S=188#s=188&f=1650&t=1398581&p=1Posted: 11/11/2007 8:47 AM

Re: Whorn fans are upset with Leach....

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Guys, this is nothing new. ut DOES get the calls in Austin. There IS a bias. It has always been this way and it will never change. They are the big dog of the conference and ALWAYS will be.

The condescending tone of the first article posted above shows that they know it as well. The hornfan is the whiniest fan of all college sports yet when an opponent shows displeasure they look down on them and mock them.

The refs DID NOT cost Tech that game yesterday. The defense did. However, it would be nice to play on a level playing field. The Big 12 has way too many $$ riding on their success to do anything about it. I don't think it is a conspiracy, meaning they don't tell the refs to blow the whistle one way but I do think they have a "look the other way" mentality. They will protect OU and ut. They are just to important to them.

Reply | Quote

[SoonerMom2]

Whoever got the idea they protect OU needs to check again. Obviously they haven't been to some of our games. There are two crews from Austin, one from Lubbock, one from Stillwater, and where do the rest reside. I would bet none of them come from Norman because you would be hearing all kinds of complaints.

Amazing that Leach has such a poor memory that the 'homer' officiating in 2005 at Lubbock.

Think the NCAA should take officiating out of the conferences and assigned officials from the NCAA and not let any crew officiate that has a tie to the university or lives in the same town. That way officiating would be standard instead of all over the place. BTW, Bible did his usual louzy job officiating our game. If someone doesn't think he is biased in favor of the other schools against OU, then I have swampland for sale in AZ. Even the announcers will talk about the wrong calls of Bible in games of ours he officiates.

[SoonerKnight]

I think Leach is funny! I mean to rant against the refs! You thought they gave bad calls before wait until you play the next few games! I think TT defense lost them that game!

[Crucifax Autumn]

He's hilarious...just look at this:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v153/ulijon/Leach.jpg

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Spot on. And you can add Mr. Man Tan to the list of refs that should not be calling texas related games. Dude is beyond homer.

Would UT fans stand for Bud Wilkinson's nephew calling the RRS? Don't think so.

Fixed it for ya...;)

[SoonerJedi]

It should be fun watching the shoddy officiating.

That was not a touchdown.

Karma. :D

[stoopified]

I guess Mike NOW knows what it is like when THE OTHER TEAM is awarded a PHANTOM TD.

[MamaMia]

This thread is worthless without video. ;)

[The_Red_Patriot]

Tirade clip. Funny he wasn't saying this after the 05 OU/TT game

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCX8ow4gTkw

[utex74]

I didn't notice a lot of calls going against KSU this year in Austin. And last year's aggy game at home had lots of questionable calls that did not go our way. But after those losses we rip the coaches, the game plan and the performance on the field. With a few exceptions, the refs do not cost you the game if you take care of business. (granted, you are a little closer to this issue the past two years than most teams)

[Crucifax Autumn]

A little closer? We are the poster child of the issue the last few years. My jaw actually dropped when a review of a close one went our way Saturday.