College Football News dares to question the SEC

[kevpks]

http://cfn.scout.com/2/683546.html

By Pete Fiutak


In an attempt to surpass the record number of frighteningly angry e-mails received, recently set by the “passionate” college wrestling crowd … As of right now, with the caveat that I'll likely change my tune as the season goes on and as teams start to jell, today, Tuesday, September 25th, 2007, marks day one of the rest of my life. From this day forward, I will try to be brave enough, and strong enough, to stop blindly kissing the SEC's butt.

For years, everyone’s been afraid to poke the bear with a stick (as opposed to the legend of The Bear poking Nick Saban), knowing that anything short of continuous genuflecting at the altar of the almighty SEC will bring nothing but great vengeance and furious anger from the most passionate fans in college football.

Yes, with Ole Miss, Vanderbilt, and Mississippi State not being that bad, from top to bottom, the SEC is the best conference going right now (please note what I just wrote when your bile starts to build), but it’s time to start taking a really hard look at the league this year, and it's time to stop assuming it’s the dominant force everyone thinks it is.

You’re 100%, rock-solid, bet-the-house certain that LSU is one of the two best teams in the country right now. It's been driven into your head so much, it's now become an unquestioned fact. The defense has been so dominant, ranking first in the nation in almost all categories, and seventh in pass defense, that no one can do anything against it, right? Yeah, and last year's Ohio State offense couldn't be shut down. Take a look at the offenses LSU has faced so far: Mississippi State (102nd in the nation), Virginia Tech (107th), Middle Tennessee (108th), and South Carolina (79th). It won't get much harder once the meat of the season kicks in. Right now, half the SEC offenses are ranked 74th or lower, none are in the top ten, and only Florida, Kentucky, and Arkansas are in the top 25.

You’re 100%, rock-solid, sell-the-house certain that Florida has simply reloaded, and it automatically belongs among the national title contenders, right? (Actually, I do believe this, but more on that later.) Western Kentucky is barely D-I, Troy is dead last in America in run defense, Tennessee has a great brand name, but isn’t Tennessee right now, and Ole Miss is 107th in the nation in defense. You're basing everything on one dominant performance against an average Vols team.

There's no question about it, LSU and Florida are good, but I want to see more. Unfortunately, I won’t, because now the SECers basically play each other, and everyone likes to pump up SEC teams based on what they do in conference play. You have to remember that just because one or two teams are top-shelf dominant, that doesn’t mean the entire conference is great. Did you rank the Pac 10 as one of the best conferences over the last few years because of USC? No, so why are you doing it now?

Ole Miss, Mississippi State, and Vanderbilt aren’t awful like the true bottom feeders in other leagues, but they’re at a lower level compared to the rest of the league (even after MSU's win over Auburn). South Carolina, Kentucky, Tennessee, Auburn, Alabama, Arkansas, and Georgia are all at a similar level of average, with a few differences here and there.

Arkansas can't throw more than three feet down the field with any sort of accuracy, Auburn is woefully short on playmakers and on the offensive line, Alabama can't find any sort of a pass rush no matter what the situation, Georgia is as flaky as they come thanks to a reloading young team, Kentucky can't stop the run, South Carolina's offense is more painful to watch than an Oprah/The View double-feature, and Tennessee has apparently decided to not play defense this year. I'm not saying the programs stink, and I'm not saying these teams won't be really good at the end of the year, or dominant next year. I'm talking about right now, and if you're watching the entire college landscape, then you can't objectively look at the mid-level SEC teams and say they're anything remotely special.

And then there are the big non-conference games to compare and contrast. In the big ones, Tennessee lost to Cal, Auburn lost to South Florida, and barely beat Kansas State, LSU dominated a Virginia Tech team that’s still playing like the weight of an entire region is on its shoulders, and Kentucky beat a Louisville team that couldn’t stop you and ten girl scouts from putting up 500 yards and 43 points. That’s it.

The best non-conference wins for the other nine teams: Alabama (Western Carolina 52-6), Arkansas (Troy 46-26), Florida (Troy 59-31), Georgia (Oklahoma State 35-14 … this was good, even with the Cowboys’ loss at Troy), Ole Miss (Memphis 23-21), Mississippi State (Tulane 38-17), South Carolina (UL Lafayette 28-14), Tennessee (Southern Miss 39-19), Vanderbilt (Richmond 41-17). Oooh, a bunch of real BCS killers in that bunch.

Basically, I'm asking the world to actually watch the SEC games like it would games from any other league. I will now curl up into a corner with a warm glass of milk, a copy of I'm OK, You're OK, and rest up for the onslaught that's about to come my way.

[DalHorn]

I feel sorry for that dude. Better turn on his inbred spam filter.

Kudos though. Nothing whips my arse like hearing SEC fans spew how their champ should be in the NC game no matter the # of losses. Makes me want to stick my head in an oven.

If we lose to you guys in the RRS, I'll be rooting hard for OU vs. USC in LSU's backyard.

[colleyvillesooner]

heh


and Kentucky beat a Louisville team that couldn’t stop you and ten girl scouts from putting up 500 yards and 43 points.

[NormanPride]

http://www.acceleratingfuture.com/michael/blog/images/Nuke2.JPG

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Above all else, I want LSU to lose at least one game, since I don't want ANYBODY, not even suc, to have to play the Leslies in a home-field environment. It's just not right.

[JohnnyMack]

I thought heading into the weekend that the polls should look like this:

1. USC
2. LSU
3. Florida
4. OU

Now I'm not so sure beyond having USC at No. 1.

[Boomer.....]

Why does almost everyone say that USC is a definite #1? Yes, they were preseason #1, but other than that, LSU and OU have showed just as much if not more talent.

[Boomer.....]

If it weren't for preseason polls, I don't see how couldn't be at least considered for #1. Our numbers and stats are much more impressive than the other 3. Yes, we might have played a little softer schedule, but Tulsa and Miami are still good teams. VTech (LSU) and Nebbish (USC) were grossly over-rated, so why so much love for those 2?

[JohnnyMack]

Why does almost everyone say that USC is a definite #1? Yes, they were preseason #1, but other than that, LSU and OU have showed just as much if not more talent.

They have an experienced talented QB. Amazing depth and talent at RB. An O-line that is one of the best two or three in the country. Their defense is fast, big and mean up front. They have amazing LBs.

Don't get me wrong, I hate SUC, but I still think they're the best team in the country.

[Boomer.....]

They have an experienced talented QB. Amazing depth and talent at RB. An O-line that is one of the best two or three in the country. Their defense is fast, big and mean up front. They have amazing LBs.

Don't get me wrong, I hate SUC, but I still think they're the best team in the country.
Remove the word experienced and add a much more explosive offense and you have described OU.

[bigtom98]

Bravo, Mr. Fiutak,

Finally a sportswriter breaks down the SEC. This sonference gets respect because it has a lot of teams with the reputation for being good, but aren't. Tennesee, Auburn, 'Bama, Arkansas, and South Carolina, featuing "the ol' ball coach" are very mediocre teams with glaring offensive weaknesses and SEC fans act like going to Miss. St. and Ole Miss are tough road trips. Nobody in the SEC ever plays anybody in their non-conference schedules, expect the Vols, but every sports blow hard is ready to continually say the SEC is without a doubt the toughest conference and just getting through an SEC schedule is the greatest challenge imaginable.

Right now I'd say the PAC 10 is the best conference based on some good non-conference wins. Every other conference hasn't proved anything thus far, except the Big 10, which proved it's terrible.

As a Sooner, I don't have any fear of Florida or LSU after what I saw this weekend. Florida's best running back is their quarterback, I'm not sure he'll survive college running the quarterback dive play 25 times a game. LSU's best player on offense is a 5'5" 150 lb track guy. I don't think gimmicks win championships.

[JohnnyMack]

Remove the word experienced and add a much more explosive offense and you have described OU.

Yeah and the fact that we're playing a Frosh at QB vs. Booty is what is keeping me from thinking we're no. 1. That and I think our secondary is still a tad overrated.

[MextheBulldog]

Wow, those LSU opponent offensive rankings really jump out at you. SouthCar did have that defense on its heels for a bit.

Regarding the non-conf sched., LSU had VaTech (not their fault its a down year) and UF has FSU (same thing as VaTech), and that's not nuthin'. Similar to OU's situation with Miami this year.

Still, this thread is yet another reason why CFN.com is pure greatness.

[Boomer.....]

Yeah and the fact that we're playing a Frosh at QB vs. Booty is what is keeping me from thinking we're no. 1. That and I think our secondary is still a tad overrated.
Everyone has a chink in their armor or is overrated at a position. USC is 23rd in total offense and 25th in total defense. Obviously those numbers aren't great. I just don't think that they would be #1 if it was not for preseason polls.

[RedGiant]

I don't know who should be 1-4 right now and until one of these teams plays someone with a few claws and responds, neither will anyone else. The only team I could say that has played like they deserve the 4 spot is Florida, so until OU plays Texas and LSU plays Florida there is no telling how this all shakes out.

[misplaced_sooner]

First time Poster!!!!

I think LSU and Florida will both lose one game this season. OU SHOULD run the table against a weak Big 12 this year. The wild card will be USC. Will they have a week where they get surprised? Yes, but will they make it thru.

Honestly, facing USC in the title game scares me. USC is just a great team in bowl games, they haven't lost a bowl game since 2001-2002.

Florida is a scary team too. OU hasn't done well against spread offense teams, see loses to Oregon and Boise State. They are improving, but they still gave up 21 to Tulsa.

Andrew

[footballfanatic]

First time Poster!!!!

I think LSU and Florida will both lose one game this season. OU SHOULD run the table against a weak Big 12 this year. The wild card will be USC. Will they have a week where they get surprised? Yes, but will they make it thru.

Honestly, facing USC in the title game scares me. USC is just a great team in bowl games, they haven't lost a bowl game since 2001-2002.

Florida is a scary team too. OU hasn't done well against spread offense teams, see loses to Oregon and Boise State. They are improving, but they still gave up 21 to Tulsa.

Andrew

USC hasn't lost a bowl game since 2001-2002? What was the Rose Bowl against Texas? Japanimation?

[Boomer.....]

Florida should get crushed by LSU.

[footballfanatic]

LSU may beat Florida, but if we've learned anything, never undersestimate an Urban Meyer coached team.

[AlbqSooner]

USC hasn't lost a bowl game since 2001-2002? What was the Rose Bowl against Texas? Japanimation?
That was filmed on the site previously used for Neil Armstrong's lunar landing.

[goodonya]

Why does almost everyone say that USC is a definite #1? Yes, they were preseason #1, but other than that, LSU and OU have showed just as much if not more talent.

We've ridden our laurels from the previous year(s) more than once. USC is no different. We need to concentrate on getting to #2. Florida can help us in a "good way" after we spank UT.

[LSUdeek]

I'd agree that Tenn's loss to Cal looks bad, but downplaying UK's win over UL is admitting that Pete was an idiot for having them ranked #9 preseason.

If Pete can come up with a group of 5 teams to match LSU, UF, UGA, Ala, and South Car, I'd like to see them. Even Kentucky is ranked #15 right now.

All we need to do is point at the fact that there are 6 SEC teams in the Top 25. The nation agrees with us.

[SoonerBBall]

I'd agree that Tenn's loss to Cal looks bad, but downplaying UK's win over UL is admitting that Pete was an idiot for having them ranked #9 preseason.

If Pete can come up with a group of 5 teams to match LSU, UF, UGA, Ala, and South Car, I'd like to see them. Even Kentucky is ranked #15 right now.

All we need to do is point at the fact that there are 6 SEC teams in the Top 25. The nation agrees with us.

Pointing to any of the deeply flawed human polls used to rank college teams isn't a great way to prove your point. Also, since when do those three polls make up "the nation"? In fact, most of the nation outside of the SEC doesn't agree with the "SEC is superior" party line. I'd take OU vs LSU, TX vs UF, TX Tech vs UGA, Mizzou vs Ala, and OSU vs SC right now and like the Big XII's odds to win each one.

[LSUdeek]

Pointing to any of the deeply flawed human polls used to rank college teams isn't a great way to prove your point. Also, since when do those three polls make up "the nation"?

People around the country who are paid to watch college football and vote in these polls have decided that the SEC has the best top 6 teams. Sorry I wasn't more specific.


In fact, most of the nation outside of the SEC doesn't agree with the "SEC is superior" party line.

Of course fans don't agree. I'm sure fans of the mighty OSU Buckeyes who barely managed to put 20 up on mighty Akron and the Michigan Wolverines who lost to a I-AA team at home would have lots of disagreement.


I'd take OU vs LSU, TX vs UF, TX Tech vs UGA, Mizzou vs Ala, and OSU vs SC right now and like the Big XII's odds to win each one.

I wouldn't. OSU got beat by 3 touchdowns at UGA. TX Tech played a SEC team in a bowl a couple of years ago and couldn't move the football at all. Texas barely beat UCF, struggled against TCU, and needed an onside kick against Arkansas State. :rolleyes:

OU-LSU would be a tough game. Here's hoping it happens in January. :D

[goingoneight]

One definite thing that happenes every single year... whenever someone is crowned before they've achieved, the end up beat or embarassed.

Starting with the 2000 season, FSU, UF.
2001 = Nebraska, OU, UT
2002 = "Greatest Team Ever" Miami :rolleyes:, OU
2003 = next "Greatest Team Evar," :mad: OU
2004 = us again. :mad:
2005 = USC, Miami, Michigan
2006 = Notre Dame, Ohio State, Michigan, USC, UT all called "world beaters."
2007 = Michigan, Nebraska, Georgia have all had little stingers so far.
... I would not be surprised at all to see a "mighty" SEC team embarassed soon in the light of the hype. No one seems to be immune to it. Those are just a few examples off the top of my head.

[LSUdeek]

2007 = Michigan, Nebraska, Georgia have all had little stingers so far.
... I would not be surprised at all to see a "mighty" SEC team embarassed soon in the light of the hype. No one seems to be immune to it. Those are just a few examples off the top of my head.

I would agree with you except I don't think the SEC is still getting all of the pub. Right now the CFB media is focused on how bad Michigan and Notre Dame are rather than telling everyone that LSU is the best team ever to play college football.

Sometimes it's hard to get kids to stop listening to the bouquets that are being thrown their way. :rolleyes:

[SoonerBBall]

People around the country who are paid to watch college football and vote in these polls have decided that the SEC has the best top 6 teams. Sorry I wasn't more specific.

Which poll do those people put out? Oh, that is right, they don't put one out. Not a single human poll is comprised of people who are paid to make themselves aware of the ins and outs of each college football team. I don't know who exactly you are talking about, but I guarantee that not a single one of them could name 3 players from every team in their top 15, let alone their top 25.


Of course fans don't agree. I'm sure fans of the mighty OSU Buckeyes who barely managed to put 20 up on mighty Akron and the Michigan Wolverines who lost to a I-AA team at home would have lots of disagreement.

The Big Ten sucks this year. So what? Are you using the first 4 weeks in a single conference to justify decades of pimping the SEC as the best? Seriously? Or are you trying to say that the coaches, journalists, and other members of the media are unbaised observers of college football and aren't considered fans, so that is why their opinions count in the polls?


I wouldn't. OSU got beat by 3 touchdowns at UGA. TX Tech played a SEC team in a bowl a couple of years ago and couldn't move the football at all. Texas barely beat UCF, struggled against TCU, and needed an onside kick against Arkansas State. :rolleyes:

Tech played an SEC team years ago?? Wow, what a compelling argument.

Yeah, OSU got their pants beat off by UGA, but we also don't tout OSU as one of the best in the league. Even given what happened in the OSU/Tech game, I'd still like to see what would happen if UGA played Tech or even Missouri.

Yeah, I hate Texas as much as anyone else, but after watching Florida against Ole Miss, I'm not quite sure you can say that Florida is much better than Texas. Hell, Florida has been living off the mere NAME of a throttling they gave a Tennessee, and Tennessee has proven that they aren't any good, so what does that make Florida?


OU-LSU would be a tough game. Here's hoping it happens in January. :D

As long as it isn't for the NC. There is no way I want to play any team in that sh*thole in New Orleans, especially LSU. It is too bad the Sugar Bowl got into the mix instead of the Cotton Bowl.

[Crucifax Autumn]

My big thing is, don't these people realize it's college football? This isn't the NFL where it's almost predetermined. This is the NCAA where the "any given 'saturday' " thing is actually true. Teams that look truly unbeatable one week look weak the next, and creampuffs convincingly knock off powerhouses almost weekly.

One week a conference goes undefeated, the next they suffer humiliation.

I am way big into conference pride, but since the USC rule was instated into the BCS formula, who really gives a rat's gumby which conference is best?

[misplaced_sooner]

USC hasn't lost a bowl game since 2001-2002? What was the Rose Bowl against Texas? Japanimation?

Doh!:confused:

They still played well.

Andrew

[SelmaBamaFan]

The stat thing doesnt float with me either. Im not going to come and toot the SEC horn, but I think you should look at things objectively. Maybe those teams' offenses are ranked 100+ because they played LSU.

I mean, if the #50 offense came to play OU and you held them to 150 total yards for the game, they would drop to around 70-100 with it being this early in the season.

I wouldnt say the drop would be THAT drastic for LSU opponents, as I have no idea what the total yards were in their games, and Im not interested enough to look it up. I'm just saying when a team gets shut down by a good defense, their offensive rankings will fall.

[JohnnyMack]

Yeah, OSU got their pants beat off by UGA, but we also don't tout OSU as one of the best in the league.

psst...

Remind him what happened the last time osu played and SEC team, the time before the UGA game.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

That and I think our secondary is still a tad overrated.

isn't it always before the texas game?

[JohnnyMack]

isn't it always before the texas game?

Nate Jones scares the hell out of me.

[jkjsooner]

I'd take OU vs LSU, TX vs UF, TX Tech vs UGA, Mizzou vs Ala, and OSU vs SC right now and like the Big XII's odds to win each one.

I wouldn't make that argument this year. The Big 12 is really down right now. Even Texas isn't playing very well at the moment. Texas would not beat UF unless they really got their stuff straightened out. I wouldn't champion either OSU or TTech to win their games either. I don't know about Missouri.

When it comes down to it, SEC fans usually talk up their conference as an excuse for their terrible results. It's easier to justify a 5 loss season if you can convince yourself that you would have been 10-2 in another conference (total BS). You also see this when you're trying to get in the title game but most of the talk is from the fans of the teams who are struggling. Heck, I used to do this to Big East fans back in the Blake years.

Even if you could come up with some numeric system that gave each team a number that everyone agreed with, you would still have a problem determining which conference is "best." It really depends on you're reasoning for making the argument in the first place. If you're OU in the late '90s you might be more interested in how good the middle and low level conference teams are because those are the ones who are going to keep you from going to a bowl. If you're OU in 2000's you are more interested in how good the top tier conference teams are. Really only those teams will help determine if you are truly deserving of being in the title game. If you're Northwestern or Duke, you might be more interested in how the lower level programs are doing.

In either case, the importance of the conference arguments can be downplayed by the following factors:

1. How tough is your OOC schedule. Even if the Big 12 is not nearly as strong as the SEC, if you play a couple of very tough OOC games you can end up with a higher strength of schedule that many of the SEC teams.

2. How tough is your conference schedule. With the 12 team conferences, it is sometimes possible to play relatively weak conference schedules in just about every conference. I remember a few years ago the SEC East was head and shoulders above the West and it was possible for some teams to only play one of UGA, Florida, or Tennessee (if any). A few years ago the Big 12 South was almost unanimously considered the toughest division so even if the SEC was better a Big 12 South team could argue their conference schedule was tougher. (Obviously, with the fall of A&M and OSU the Big 12 South is no longer close to the toughest division - not to mention that the north has fallen off a cliff.)

To make this point more clear, when the Big 8 expanded to the Big 12, the idea was that the conference would be a lot tougher. In the early years, from OU's perspective, I think it was weaker. We already played Texas every year anyway. We got to trade off CU/KSU/NU some years and replace them with A&M/Tech/Baylor. In the Gibbs years we had almost automatic 3 losses in CU/NU/UT. That wasn't the case once the Big 12 was formed.

I don't want to get in an argument on who is better this year - the PAC 10 or the SEC. I don't really care. However, I do want to state that the SEC is not ALWAYS the toughest conference. I would argue the Big 12 was definitely better in 2000.

Sorry I rambled so much....

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Nate Jones scares the hell out of me.

no, no, the other guy from texarkana is the one that got indicted for rape. he's at osu.

[LSUdeek]

I wouldn't make that argument this year. The Big 12 is really down right now. Even Texas isn't playing very well at the moment. Texas would not beat UF unless they really got their stuff straightened out. I wouldn't champion either OSU or TTech to win their games either. I don't know about Missouri.

Texas's defense would not be able to stop Florida. It would probably be a 38-31 game or something ....



When it comes down to it, SEC fans usually talk up their conference as an excuse for their terrible results. It's easier to justify a 5 loss season if you can convince yourself that you would have been 10-2 in another conference (total BS). You also see this when you're trying to get in the title game but most of the talk is from the fans of the teams who are struggling. Heck, I used to do this to Big East fans back in the Blake years.

This is true, but I think right now we really are the strongest conference. We'd have to see UF vs Oregon or Cal and USC take on LSU before being able to decide that.

According to :

http://cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/div_ia/sec/vs_conf.php

this, we have an all-time winning record against every conference except the Big Ten.

[kevpks]

According to :

http://cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/div_ia/sec/vs_conf.php

this, we have an all-time winning record against every conference except the Big Ten.

Whatever! You guys suck against the independents including a .500 record against Navy. ;)

Geez, when were those games played? Just have Miss St. and Vandy schedule somes games against Notre Dame and you guys can even out that record.

[SoonerBBall]

Texas's defense would not be able to stop Florida. It would probably be a 38-31 game or something ....

I can't argue with you there, I just say that it is equally likely that the game is 38-31 going the other way.


This is true, but I think right now we really are the strongest conference. We'd have to see UF vs Oregon or Cal and USC take on LSU before being able to decide that.

Here's the rub, I completely agree with what you just said. I think that right now the SEC is the best conference, followed by the Pac-10. I'm just saying that I don't think it is as clear-cut as most SEC fans would have you believe, and I also don't buy that it is the best conference year in and year out, at least any more so than the Pac-10 (recently), Big 10, or Big 12.



According to :

http://cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/div_ia/sec/vs_conf.php

this, we have an all-time winning record against every conference except the Big Ten.

Also, according to your link the SEC has a winning percentage of 50.4%. So to 2 decimal places, the Big 12 has been exactly as solid against the SEC as vice-versa. This pretty much flies in the face of the whole "SEC is consistently the best conference" theory. Of course, that is just in the context of the stats provided by the link.

[Purple Tiger]

Yeah and the fact that we're playing a Frosh at QB vs. Booty is what is keeping me from thinking we're no. 1. That and I think our secondary is still a tad overrated.
Nic Harris was not offered by LSU because of questions concerning his speed.

[SoonerBBall]

Nic Harris was not offered by LSU because of questions concerning his speed.

Hahahahahaha.


Good call...

[Purple Tiger]

Hahahahahaha.


Good call...
It's true as he is from my home town. His recruitment was well documented here. His hs principal is a friend of mine.

[SoonerBBall]

I didn't say it wasn't true, I'm just saying that LSU was wrong on that one.

[JohnnyMack]

Nic Harris was not offered by LSU because of questions concerning his speed.

Thanks for stopping by.

[JohnnyMack]

It's true as he is from my home town. His recruitment was well documented here. His hs principal is a friend of mine.

people make mistakes Purple Tiger.

[Ash]

people make mistakes Purple Tiger

Not the SEC, they only have the goodest teams with the goodest coaches and the goodest players.

:oink:

[Desert Sapper]

Conference smack is for the birds. OU, LSU, and USC are in the same league. Everyone else is not.

[TideTiger2005]

I wouldn't. OSU got beat by 3 touchdowns at UGA. TX Tech played a SEC team in a bowl a couple of years ago and couldn't move the football at all. Texas barely beat UCF, struggled against TCU, and needed an onside kick against Arkansas State. :rolleyes:

OU-LSU would be a tough game. Here's hoping it happens in January. :D

It was former Alabama DC Joe Kines that wrote the dissertation on how to shutdown Texas Tech's spread offense in the 2006 Cotton Bowl. It's a 3-3-5. Kines used the same defense on Oklahoma in 2003 where Alabama was one of the only teams on OU's entire schedule to hold them under 3 touchdowns (Great game by the way!). That's why Kansas State and LSU used the Alabama game films that very same year. He used it to shutdown Florida in 2005. He used it again, minus 3 NFL starters, to beat Hawai'i in the 2006 season opener.

[kevpks]

It was former Alabama DC Joe Kines that wrote the dissertation on how to shutdown Texas Tech's spread offense in the 2006 Cotton Bowl. It's a 3-3-5. Kines used the same defense on Oklahoma in 2003 where Alabama was one of the only teams on OU's entire schedule to hold them under 3 touchdowns (Great game by the way!). That's why Kansas State and LSU used the Alabama game films that very same year. He used it to shutdown Florida in 2005. He used it again, minus 3 NFL starters, to beat Hawai'i in the 2006 season opener.

That actually is interesting. It seems like OU runs a much different offense now than they did in 2003.

[SoonerBBall]

It was former Alabama DC Joe Kines that wrote the dissertation on how to shutdown Texas Tech's spread offense in the 2006 Cotton Bowl. It's a 3-3-5. Kines used the same defense on Oklahoma in 2003 where Alabama was one of the only teams on OU's entire schedule to hold them under 3 touchdowns (Great game by the way!). That's why Kansas State and LSU used the Alabama game films that very same year. He used it to shutdown Florida in 2005. He used it again, minus 3 NFL starters, to beat Hawai'i in the 2006 season opener.

No offense to Bama, but we've been shutting down Tech's offense consistently since Leach got there in 2000. Kines dissertation was about 6 years too late.

2000 - 27-13 OU
2001 - 30-13 OU
2002 - 60-15 OU
2003 - 56-25 OU
2004 - 28-13 OU
2005 - 21-23 Tech (grrrr... replay refs)
2006 - 34-24 OU

So after that, your 13-10 win in the Cotton Bowl isn't exactly earth shattering. :P

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Nic Harris was not offered by LSU because of questions concerning his speed.

what the heck does that have to do with anything? i mean OU didn't recruit barry sanders because of concerns about his size - does that make it any less of a recruiting mistake?

[sooneron]

TX Tech played a SEC team in a bowl a couple of years ago and couldn't move the football at all. Texas barely beat UCF, struggled against TCU, and needed an onside kick against Arkansas State. :rolleyes:

OU-LSU would be a tough game. Here's hoping it happens in January. :D
Tech played a bowl game TWO years ago and didn't do well against an sec team? Well that settles it, they could not win this year either. :rolleyes:

I don't agree with all of his match ups, but I think we (B12) would do pretty well in half of those games. And I think the B12 is still down this year.

KU, Misery, UTerus are the teams that could prove me wrong as the season plays out.

I really don't want to play leslie and the tiggers in your backyard. It would be a shame to skip a champ game based upon the opposing team's classless fanbase/homefield.

[sooneron]

Good Lord, somemone get these sec noob fuggers out of here, they're wasting bandwidth.

[stoopified]

Above all else, I want LSU to lose at least one game, since I don't want ANYBODY, not even suc, to have to play the Leslies in a home-field environment. It's just not right.
Amen.

[Geekboy]

Conference smack is for the birds. OU, LSU, and USC are in the same league. Everyone else is not.
Well said. Thread should have been closed after your post.

[Purple Tiger]

what the heck does that have to do with anything? i mean OU didn't recruit barry sanders because of concerns about his size - does that make it any less of a recruiting mistake?
Saban thought he would be fast enough for LB but doubted his ability to gain the weight. Nic is a good player.
Saban did miss the boat on Alexander though.

[Crucifax Autumn]

Saban's missed so many boats they sell him a ticket for sold out cruises.